average power

Amprodude

What is a good realistic average power(watts) for an amateur rider for a distance of
100km?

DirkVoodoo

Amprodude wrote: »

What is a good realistic average power(watts) for an amateur rider for 100km?

Say what now?

Amprodude

DirkVoodoo wrote: »

Say what now?

What you mean?

custom_build

150w

Raam

151w.

Hi Ho

You will probably get a few odd answers because your question can't really be answered. Among other things, 'Amateurs' range from fellows on their first bikes to guys contending for the podium in the Rás.

Beasty

Also depends on weight. In addition there is more "exertion" when constantly slowing down and speeding up, or putting in extra effort on the hills (partly compensated by freewheeling down them, but the arithmetic average is lowered as you would typically climb a hill in a slower time than descending it). The concept of "Normalised Power" was developed to try to deal with this.

DirkVoodoo

Amprodude wrote: »

What you mean?

Rider/bike weight, terrain, conditions, effort...your question has absolutely no context to be meaningful.

And unless it's a 100km time trial, your average power isn't really going to mean a huge amount over 100km. Are you maintaining the same power on the downhill sections as you would be into a climb/headwind? Unlikely.

Like I said, unless you're pacing yourself for a 100km TT, this question is fairly pointless. What's the objective here? Are you trying to measure improvement? Just work a monthly FTP test (a mere 20 minutes of suffering versus your 100km) into your programme.

iwillhtfu

Maybe op if you gave some of your stats on weight someone on here might have some data over a 20/40km tt you could work off.

100 km is just to long with to many variables to try and work out an average.

Amprodude

I did 100km today with average power 217w and normalised power 254w. I'm new to powermeter and I don't know what to focus on. It was a hard effort this 100km spin. I'm trying to figure out what watts I need to be training on to improve. I want to do that 20min threshold test and I'm trying to figure out what watts I should be aiming for. I have done three spins now with the powermeter. On one of the rides my avg power was 236w with normalized power of 289watts. My other ride was 232 watts with normalised power of 283 watts. If that means anything what could I focus on to get a target watt for a 20 min threshold test?
Thanks.

Amprodude

iwillhtfu wrote: »

Maybe op if you gave some of your stats on weight someone on here might have some data over a 20/40km tt you could work off.

100 km is just to long with to many variables to try and work out an average.

I weigh 75kg.

Hi Ho

'I want to do that 20min threshold test and I'm trying to figure out what watts I should be aiming for.' - it's supposed to work the other way around - the test gives you the information.
" I have done three spins now with the powermeter. One rider my avg power was 236w with normalized power of 289watts." - were these a minute, or an hour, or what?
What actually is your aim?

RockWerchter

Do you're first power test blind. Don't aim for a wattage just ride at a level you can sustain for 20 mins without looking at your power output.

My average power from 93km today was 284W which is normalised to 310W. 70 of those km were spent in a chase group in the A1/2 Boyne GP.

Inquitus

Amprodude wrote: »

I did 100km today with average power 217w and normalised power 254w. I'm new to powermeter and I don't know what to focus on. It was a hard effort this 100km spin. I'm trying to figure out what watts I need to be training on to improve. I want to do that 20min threshold test and I'm trying to figure out what watts I should be aiming for. I have done three spins now with the powermeter. On one of the rides my avg power was 236w with normalized power of 289watts. My other ride was 232 watts with normalised power of 283 watts. If that means anything what could I focus on to get a target watt for a 20 min threshold test?
Thanks.

Riding 100km like you did today is not good value for your training time. It will stress your body and limit the training that can be done on subsequent days without yielding the benefits a better structured spin would.

Amprodude

RockWerchter wrote: »

Do you're first power test blind. Don't aim for a wattage just ride at a level you can sustain for 20 mins without looking at your power output.

My average power from 93km today was 284W which is normalised to 310W. 70 of those km were spent in a chase group in the A1/2 Boyne GP.

Looks like you were going hard. But as an A1/2 rider you are quite strong anyway to be in that league. What was your Avg HR? Mine was 147 but today but I know if I was racing it would be a bit higher.

See that's what I don't understand with the above. Do I need to find the point of where my legs are starting to burn or is just an effort that I can manage without my heart rate going into red zone? Or is it an effort that is hard but comfortably manage for 20mins?

Lumen

Read Training and Racing with a Power Meter. Or get a coach.

Understanding the models through forum posts is like eating a five course meal through a straw.

Inquitus

Amprodude wrote: »

Looks like you were going hard. But as an A1/2 rider you are quite strong anyway to be in that league. What was your Avg HR? Mine was 147 but today but I know if I was racing it would be a bit higher.

See that's what I don't understand with the above. Do I need to find the point of where my legs are starting to burn or is just an effort that I can manage without my heart rate going into red zone? Or is it an effort that is hard but comfortably manage for 20mins?

You need to aim to ride as hard as you can and achieve the maximum average power possible, you need to judge this for yourself, obviously if afterwards you feel you went to hard at the start and ruined the effort, you'll know you didn't perform at your best and may need to try again, likewise if you feel you could have given more then you didn't do your best and may need to try again. At this stage you should have an idea of when you are on the limit of what you can sustain, and you need to push that envelope for 20 minutes.

mossym

Lumen wrote: »

Read Training and Racing with a Power Meter. Or get a coach.

Understanding the models through forum posts is like eating a five course meal through a straw.

this.

honestly, your new PM will be of little use to you until you actually learn how to use it. get the book, read it, and the reason your question makes little sense will become a lot more clear. i had a pretty good idea how to use a PM before i read the book and i still picked up a lot

FrankGrimes

OP, based on your numbers from your 100km spins, your average power for the 20minute power test will probably be in the vicinity of 300w, probably plus or minus 30 watts* You need to do a warm-up then 5mins at time trial pace, then an easy period, then you start your 20minute test. Google 20-minute power test protocol and you'll get the specific details.

So if you find from you5 first 5-minute interval that 300w is too low, aim higher for the 20-minute test, and vice versa if it's too high. Then you can use Golden Cheetah or one of many websites to calculate your power zones from there and then build the structured training plan others have referenced based on those zones. It's worth the time to read up on this stuff, otherwise your investment in the power meter is kinda wasted.


*the above is not in any way scientific or factual, just a hunch, but if you're looking for a number to aim at for your first power test, it'll serve.

RockWerchter

Amprodude wrote: »

Looks like you were going hard. But as an A1/2 rider you are quite strong anyway to be in that league. What was your Avg HR? Mine was 147 but today but I know if I was racing it would be a bit higher.

See that's what I don't understand with the above. Do I need to find the point of where my legs are starting to burn or is just an effort that I can manage without my heart rate going into red zone? Or is it an effort that is hard but comfortably manage for 20mins?

My Average HR was 147 too, I'm quite fatigued due to still being in high volume training mode.

Definitely read the book, it's great, even if you do get a coach it's important to read it to understand what they are telling you.

lukegjpotter

What I would advise you to do, as well as getting and reading the "Training and Racing with a Power Meter" book, is to look on Strava.

Sometimes when I see a guy at a race, I'd look at the other riders he rode with. Some of them might have a Power Meter.
I was looking at the Orwell Club league, and see that one guy put out 250W for an hour on the Sally Gap finish. He was in the Scratch group.

So look on Strava for guys who are riding at the level you want to be at. Also look at their Watts per Kilo (which is most important when comparing yourself to others).

Searching manually like this is a pain in the ass, but make sure you follow the guys you want to keep track of.

Sometimes racecraft is more important than pure horsepower.

Beasty

Any "Strava" data of average power when riding in a group (particularly a race) is going to be fairly meaningless as no account will be taken of pushing on the front and sheltering in the group resulting in a large variation in power output, and Strava does not do Normalised Power (last race I did NP was 41w higher than AP)

hf4z6sqo7vjngi

10mins easy
5min absolute balls out to get a proper 20min result
10mins easy in between
20min measured all out effort, don't look at power or targets during it, only time. A large majority fck up their first test. You should feel like the world is ending at 15minutes and death is close at 19mins.
5min easy
Most use .95 of the 20 number or .925 (some people put out a big 20 but cannot sustain for 60 minutes, I fall into that category)

No point guessing numbers on a 100k ride but a glance tells me you have decent power for your weight. A power meter is a useless tool unless you use it right, get the book or a coach as each session should have a purpose.

pedro_colnago

Do the 20 min threshold test and see where u are at the moment, and then get a coach. Repeat threshold test in a few weeks. See where you are then. No point in having lots of data and not knowing what it really means. Way too many variables for getting advice on a cycling forum. Also there are a couple of good books out there as regards to training with the use of power meters, well worth a read.

fat bloke

I know what you mean, it is hard on your first test to pick a number to aim for, so there's nothing you can do really only go for it and see

One option might be to put the garmin in your pocket so you can't see it at all and just do it blind. See what the numbers are at the top of your 20 minute hil.
Then the following week see can you maintain 5 or 10w more.

Best of luck, it's good craic. I don't think you need to be the Professor Frink with the models and the numbers and the extrapolaaaaytion hoo hey hoo hey, like others claim.

tunney

Amprodude wrote: »

I did 100km today with average power 217w and normalised power 254w. I'm new to powermeter and I don't know what to focus on. It was a hard effort this 100km spin. I'm trying to figure out what watts I need to be training on to improve. I want to do that 20min threshold test and I'm trying to figure out what watts I should be aiming for. I have done three spins now with the powermeter. On one of the rides my avg power was 236w with normalized power of 289watts. My other ride was 232 watts with normalised power of 283 watts. If that means anything what could I focus on to get a target watt for a 20 min threshold test?
Thanks.

the main things you need to learn calibration and zeroing

outfox

I tend to park one of my bikes inside a west facing window which gets sun in the afternoon. It is black. Does anyone know if the side facing the sun will fade gradually?
I know this is a bit of a ridiculous question, but such are the issues that plague my sad existence.

Amprodude

outfox wrote: »

I tend to park one of my bikes inside a west facing window which gets sun in the afternoon. It is black. Does anyone know if the side facing the sun will fade gradually?
I know this is a bit of a ridiculous question, but such are the issues that plague my sad existence.

It's this kind of smartness that I hate when asking for advice on here. Im not any expert, i want to improve, i bought powermeter, I ask for advice and then I get this. Fair play to most posters on here that genuinely offered me the best piece of advice. Obviously I'm not knowledgeable on the subject of powermeters but I love learning and applying the advice given to use. However I hate smartasses who make a mockery of a thread. Mods please remove the above post by outfox as it's not relevant to what I need to know here thanks. BTW thanks to everyone else on here who have given great advice and help and improved my knowledge more on powermeters.

pedro_colnago

It seems a bit harsh but You kind of let yourself a bit open to it a little bit, But don't worry bout it too much dude we all do that at some point. But again as most posters have said get the books recommended, have a read of them, then use the power meter as a tool to tell you how you are training at that time (improving-going backwards) by means on the 20 min tests etc etc rather than putting ur wattage figures out there to be analysed/ridiculed etc etc. also have a coach look at them rather than putting them up on a forum. Definitely worth the price of a book or two seeing as u probably spent the bones of a thousand euro on the power meter. Ul be up to speed in no time then.

Arthurdaly

OP, buy training and racing with a power meter and get WKO software. This book will outline power tests and also give you metric to compare yourself against the various cycling categories. Watts per Kilo and 5 sec, 1min, 5 min and 20 min intervals are the most relevant metric for road racing. To answer your question re watts, at 71kg I would normally 190 - 210 watts sitting in a 80km A3 bunch and maybe 230 - 260 when active.

Beasty

outfox wrote: »

I tend to park one of my bikes inside a west facing window which gets sun in the afternoon. It is black. Does anyone know if the side facing the sun will fade gradually?
I know this is a bit of a ridiculous question, but such are the issues that plague my sad existence.

If you have nothing useful to add please do not post in a thread like this

Lusk_Doyle

Amprodude wrote: »

It's this kind of smartness that I hate when asking for advice on here. Im not any expert, i want to improve, i bought powermeter, I ask for advice and then I get this. Fair play to most posters on here that genuinely offered me the best piece of advice. Obviously I'm not knowledgeable on the subject of powermeters but I love learning and applying the advice given to use. However I hate smartasses who make a mockery of a thread. Mods please remove the above post by outfox as it's not relevant to what I need to know here thanks. BTW thanks to everyone else on here who have given great advice and help and improved my knowledge more on powermeters.

I heard that having the bike indoors versus outdoors or in a shed has an impact on the calibration. Not knowing this could distort your readings.

JK.BMC

Did you buy new tyres after your last puncture? I think a 50euro quality tyre is more important than an expensive power meter for you right now. And lots of safety pins - I always forget them when I go racing and nothing is more fred-revealing than a flapping back-number in the middle of a big group. Has happened to me - pure embarrassment. As for the powermeter etc, what is the 'average' relevant for? To what end/goal? What will you do when you discover your average?
I read that Philip Gilbert doesnt use a power meter. He isn't average at all, so we are all different...

pedro_colnago

Sometimes I really really wonder about power meters, Power meters only tell you how fit you are or aren't. A simpler way of knowing is the traditional way of blowing up and getting dropped. They don't make you any fitter. I love my power meter it constantly tells me how weak I am!..... As if I didn't know already.

outfox

Amprodude wrote: »

It's this kind of smartness that I hate when asking for advice on here. Im not any expert, i want to improve, i bought powermeter, I ask for advice and then I get this. Fair play to most posters on here that genuinely offered me the best piece of advice. Obviously I'm not knowledgeable on the subject of powermeters but I love learning and applying the advice given to use. However I hate smartasses who make a mockery of a thread. Mods please remove the above post by outfox as it's not relevant to what I need to know here thanks. BTW thanks to everyone else on here who have given great advice and help and improved my knowledge more on powermeters.

Sorry Amprodude. I actually meant to post my post as a new thread (genuinely). But I had your thread open at the time, and mixed the two up. I was kind of wondering where my thread went, and had to search my posts to find it.
I can assure you that I wasn't being sarcastic - I know absolutely nothing about power, so I had no idea if your original question made sense or otherwise.
Judging by your reaction, I'm thinking the paint fade question in my post is even stupider than I originally thought. But I'll post it in its own thread now, and see how many sarcastic replies I get.

Bambaata

pedro_colnago wrote: »

Sometimes I really really wonder about power meters, Power meters only tell you how fit you are or aren't. A simpler way of knowing is the traditional way of blowing up and getting dropped. They don't make you any fitter. I love my power meter it constantly tells me how weak I am!..... As if I didn't know already.

They key with power meters is to develop you to race better, i dont really glance at the PM whilst racing but the device allows my coach and I to structure training to make me better. Race analysis can also help and if you really are in tune with your figures and are on the attack you can use it to maintain the effort and not blow up too soon.

pedro_colnago

Bambaata wrote: »

They key with power meters is to develop you to race better, i dont really glance at the PM whilst racing but the device allows my coach and I to structure training to make me better. Race analysis can also help and if you really are in tune with your figures and are on the attack you can use it to maintain the effort and not blow up too soon.

I know thanks I was attempting to be facetious/humourous given the last few posts were a bit heavy. I agree with having a coach look at the data tho, makes a big difference.

Amprodude

JK.BMC wrote: »

Did you buy new tyres after your last puncture? I think a 50euro quality tyre is more important than an expensive power meter for you right now. And lots of safety pins - I always forget them when I go racing and nothing is more fred-revealing than a flapping back-number in the middle of a big group. Has happened to me - pure embarrassment. As for the powermeter etc, what is the 'average' relevant for? To what end/goal? What will you do when you discover your average?
I read that Philip Gilbert doesnt use a power meter. He isn't average at all, so we are all different...

Yes I did. I bought good tyres this time. I also always have my race numbers well attached on so if you think you know who I am here then maybe try thinking again. Anyway this really hasn't any relevance to what I spend my money on a powermeter. I can afford one and I'm going to make use of it eventhough I haven't a clue how it works but I will in time. It's a cycling forum and it's great for learning. Jealous much of my powermeter?

Amprodude

outfox wrote: »

Sorry Amprodude. I actually meant to post my post as a new thread (genuinely). But I had your thread open at the time, and mixed the two up. I was kind of wondering where my thread went, and had to search my posts to find it.
I can assure you that I wasn't being sarcastic - I know absolutely nothing about power, so I had no idea if your original question made sense or otherwise.
Judging by your reaction, I'm thinking the paint fade question in my post is even stupider than I originally thought. But I'll post it in its own thread now, and see how many sarcastic replies I get.

Just as well you don't coach or offer advice on cycling related topics because you would have the potential to mix that up too and many of us would be wondering afterwards.

Now have you anything useful you can add to the thread on powermeters or are you just being a pain for being the sake of it? or is it because I disagreed with your comments on other threads of the cycling forum? Let it go it's not worth having such a grudge. It's bad for you dude. Enjoy life.

VR46

Here's a good article on Pinot with power stats

may as well dump it in this thread. Well worth a read.

Chips Lovell

Cut out the petty bickering.

Thank you

Lusk_Doyle

OP are you using the power meter as part of a structured training plan?

Amprodude

Lusk_Doyle wrote: »

OP are you using the power meter as part of a structured training plan?

That's the plan alright Lusk_Doyle. Hoping to develop my zones as I read up more on it with some of the books suggested on here and then apply them as part to my training plan. It's a work in progress that I eventually hope to get right and use effectively as part of my training plan.