Strange problem with car when going over certain speed

cruhoortwunk

I have noticed a problem recently with the car. I only drive it once every 2 weeks or so, but when I am on the motorway going over 125kmh or so is when I notice. Difficult to explain but it just doesnt seem as secure on the road as usual. It's like there isn't as much traction. The best way i can describe it is its like a smaller car where you feel a bit unsteady/unsecure going over a a certain speed. Or like its a really windy day with crosswinds and you it seems like more effort to keep it straight. Or like just after passing a lorry when you come out of the shelter and feels like the car is sucked to the side a bit.
Just before I noticed it I had the back tyres replaced and tracking done, not sure if its related.
Got someone else to try it recently and they didnt notice but they are not used to this car. Also passed the NCT no problem.
I can't be imagining it surely? Have noticed it the last 4 times I drove it on the motorway.
Any theories?

TheChizler

Is there a vibration or something? You'll notice the wind a lot more when you're going fast, a small change in direction will have a big affect at speed.

cruhoortwunk

TheChizler wrote: »

Is there a vibration or something? You'll notice the wind a lot more when you're going fast, a small change in direction will have a big affect at speed.

No real vibration, but I find I need both hands all the time to keep it straight. (I usually have one hand on the wheel and the other on my knee when at a cruising speed.)

Special Circumstances

Did you get print out of the alignment before/after?
What brand tyres, what pressures?

There seem to be many tyre places that can't do a proper tracking to save their lives.

07Lapierre

What Car is it?

TheChizler

cruhoortwunk wrote: »

I need both hands all the time

:eek: I would hope so!

Nekarsulm

Check that there isn't a "buckle" in a tyre. Sometimes, if you have hit a kerb a clout, or a particularly vicious pothole, some of the nylon cords that make up the structure of the tyre can snap.
Sometimes there raises a "bump" on the tread of the tyre, and sometimes its a "twist" in the structure of the tyre. Can give a strange "floaty" feeling at certain speeds, especially if its a back tyre.
Jack up each corner and spin that wheel, to spot it. Or ask a garage/tyre place to chrck them.
Its not always noticeable when the car is stationary.

Quazzie

Check your tyre pressures. What you are describing when tyres are overinflated.

How long ago was the NCT? How long have you noticed the problem for? It sounds like the tracking is off to me.

bazz26

What brand tyres were put on the car and what make/model car is it?

cruhoortwunk

Deleted User wrote: »

How long ago was the NCT? How long have you noticed the problem for? It sounds like the tracking is off to me.

NCT was today, had tyres tracked around christmas and noticed the issue then. Before I had the tyres tracked and replaced, I hit a bastard of a rock on the side of the road and got a very quick flat. Could that wheel be damaged?
07 Civic saloon

cruhoortwunk

Fellas doin the NCT said that one rear tyre (the one used to replace the spare I had on a for a few days) was 6 years old. Thread looks ok but it seems to be a different tyre brand than the one on the other side.

Foxhole Norman

What brand tyres are they though?

gctest50

cruhoortwunk wrote: »

NCT was today, had tyres tracked around christmas and noticed the issue then. Before I had the tyres tracked and replaced, I hit a bastard of a rock on the side of the road and got a very quick flat. Could that wheel be damaged?
07 Civic saloon

could be a few things then

spring could be broken
suspension arm could be damaged / split

this sort of craic - less extreme maybe :



ideally, you need to take the tyre off that rim and cut it in two so it can never be used again
then cut the wheel into a few pieces

cruhoortwunk

Foxhole Norman wrote: »

What brand tyres are they though?

2 Kingstars on the front. A WINDA and a (seemingly Bridgestone) Turanza on the back.

cruhoortwunk

gctest50 wrote: »

could be a few things then

spring could be broken
suspension arm could be damaged / split

this sort of craic - less extreme maybe :



ideally, you need to take the tyre off that rim and cut it in two so it can never be used again
then cut the wheel into a few pieces

Would you not notice that at slower speeds too though?

davwain

TheChizler wrote: »

Is there a vibration or something? You'll notice the wind a lot more when you're going fast, a small change in direction will have a big affect at speed.

I agree this happens particularly with older model-year cars.

Nekarsulm

cruhoortwunk wrote: »

Would you not notice that at slower speeds too though?

NCT guy should notice anything like that during the "shakey" test.

Foxhole Norman

cruhoortwunk wrote: »

2 Kingstars on the front. A WINDA and a (seemingly Bridgestone) Turanza on the back.

You need new tyres.

cruhoortwunk

Foxhole Norman wrote: »

You need new tyres.

The Kingstars are new.

Foxhole Norman

cruhoortwunk wrote: »

The Kingstars are new.

My point stands :pac:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056930471

Seriously, get decent tyres. I wouldn't put anything I haven't heard of on my car. You also have 2 of the same tyre per axle.

Nekarsulm

To be honest, Kingstars, and most of their ilk (Chinese cheapies) are probably best reserved for trailers.

bazz26

cruhoortwunk wrote: »

2 Kingstars on the front. A WINDA and a (seemingly Bridgestone) Turanza on the back.

Rubbish tyre won't help your cause anyway.

cletus

At the very minimum get a matching pair on the back axle

Blue850

cruhoortwunk wrote: »

, but when I am on the motorway going over 125kmh or so is when I notice.
Any theories?

So the problem starts when you break the speed limit?

Special Circumstances

Sigh....

gctest50

cruhoortwunk wrote: »

Would you not notice that at slower speeds too though?

my point is it could be almost anything between

- being battered off a rock
- all sorts of tyres
- unknown damage

you need someone who knows what they are at to get under it and look for damage

Special Circumstances

gctest50 wrote: »

my point is it could be almost anything between

- being battered off a rock
- all sorts of tyres
- unknown damage

you need someone who knows what they are at to get under it and look for damage

No harm to get it checked out.
I have a pretty poor opinion of most tyre sales and tracking setups so I'm still still leaning toward a combination of some or all of :
3 Crap tyres and one perished bridgestone.
Random tyre pressures
Crap alignment but still just about passing NCT.

ltdslipdiff

Is it a hybrid by any chance? The rack can give bother in them, I had one with 100+k miles on it and it needed constant correction at motorway speeds, there are loads of threads on the web with rack issue. Have another one now and as the mileage is climbing I'm noticing the steering going the same way, its like it catches ever so slightly on the column and you have to apply pressure on it causing an over correction. Both cars had good tyres (Toyo's and Uniroyals) were well taken care of and NCT'd up to date.

cruhoortwunk

Blue850 wrote: »

So the problem starts when you break the speed limit?

I meant to say I'm in Germany, so under the speed limit

Renegade Mechanic

Blue850 wrote: »

So the problem starts when you break the speed limit?

:rolleyes:

Anyway, OP, differently branded tyres will also have different thread patterns and grip ratings so going over small bumps on the the road at speed, where the weight of the car can shift between the differently gripping tyres, can result in an unsecured feeling as the cars grip influence takes it from one side to the other.
And, tbt, at speeds in excess of "the law", quality really really counts.

Check for wheel nut tightness, just in case.

Check for tyre pressure, 30-35 psi depending on vehicle weight.

As mentioned, mabye get a mechanic to properly snoop around the area that hit the rock. Like in that pic, if the damage was on top of the wishbone, it might be missed, and mighnt flex enough on the skaker.

Actually, get him to spend a few minutes checking for play in all wheels, you would be very surprised at how soon after a test, jjoints can start playing and a worn bottom ball joints would certainly be the most likely cause of what you describe.

Hachiko

I would never touch a used car with winda/kingstar/lombardo deluxe crap.

If someone cant afford decent rubber what does that say about them trying to maintain it.

cruhoortwunk

Special Circumstances wrote: »

No harm to get it checked out.
I have a pretty poor opinion of most tyre sales and tracking setups so I'm still still leaning toward a combination of some or all of :
3 Crap tyres and one perished bridgestone.
Random tyre pressures
Crap alignment but still just about passing NCT.

Fair enough the 3 chinese tyres are crap I'm sure, but all 4 have plenty of thread, including the bridgestone.
Pressure:I inflated all the tyres to an even pressure last week, and it had no effect.
Alignment:Alignment could well be off, am I better going to a tyre place or a mechanic for this?

Henry Ford III

cruhoortwunk wrote: »

Fair enough the 3 chinese tyres are crap I'm sure, but all 4 have plenty of thread, including the bridgestone.

Doesn't matter.

If you insist on using baragin basement tyres don't expect good performance.

Special Circumstances

cruhoortwunk wrote: »

Fair enough the 3 chinese tyres are crap I'm sure, but all 4 have plenty of thread, including the bridgestone.
Pressure:I inflated all the tyres to an even pressure last week, and it had no effect.
Alignment:Alignment could well be off, am I better going to a tyre place or a mechanic for this?

Which tyre is 6 years old? Bought a car with two continentals on the back that were years old and perished/hardened with age - could step the back out at will on roundabouts, the grip was gone from them.

Did you get a print out from the alignment?

What are the side slip figures from the NCT test?
The Side Slip Test:
This test simulates driving on a straight, flat road without touching the steering wheel. This measurement indicates how many metres a vehicle would deviate to the left (-) or to the right (+) hand side over a distance of 1km.

cruhoortwunk

Special Circumstances wrote: »

Which tyre is 6 years old? Bought a car with two continentals on the back that were years old and perished/hardened with age - could step the back out at will on roundabouts, the grip was gone from them.

Did you get a print out from the alignment?

What are the side slip figures from the NCT test?
The Side Slip Test:
This test simulates driving on a straight, flat road without touching the steering wheel. This measurement indicates how many metres a vehicle would deviate to the left (-) or to the right (+) hand side over a distance of 1km.

The bridgestone is the 6 year old one, that was fitted in place of the spare. Will check the side slip stats later, would they simulate driving over 120kmh though?

Foxhole Norman

I'm 100% sure that changing all four tyres to decent brands will cure the traction problem you're having.

cruhoortwunk

Right cheers lads, I'll go for that.

ZENER

I do love these GUESS THE CAR threads.

Ken

H3llR4iser

Quazzie wrote: »

Check your tyre pressures. What you are describing when tyres are overinflated.

I would say this is the very first thing to check - sometimes tire fitters get the pressures awfully wrong.

And yes, if you really want to keep the front Chinese rubber, at least get two matching rear tires!

Special Circumstances

Apparently they're all even pressure now. But the actual pressure is a secret.

cruhoortwunk

Special Circumstances wrote: »

Apparently they're all even pressure now. But the actual pressure is a secret.

They were around 33 last I checked a few weeks ago

H3llR4iser

cruhoortwunk wrote: »

They were around 33 last I checked a few weeks ago

Still, without knowing the car model and tire size, it's impossible to say if that's correct or not I'm afraid.

33 Psi will be fine for, say, a Renault Clio with 175/65 tires, but it would be awfully low on my 159 with 225/50s.

cruhoortwunk

H3llR4iser wrote: »

Still, without knowing the car model and tire size, it's impossible to say if that's correct or not I'm afraid.

33 Psi will be fine for, say, a Renault Clio with 175/65 tires, but it would be awfully low on my 159 with 225/50s.

2007 Honda Civic SES 1.8
Not sure of tyre size but can check later

kennethsmyth

cruhoortwunk wrote: »

2007 Honda Civic SES 1.8
Not sure of tyre size but can check later

I have one of those, its 32 psi all around (i do 31) note i have noticed the car likes good tyres and the same type on an axle. i have bridgestones on front and hankooks on back. It drives much better than when the crappy plastic ones were on the front previouly - it would actually be ok in a straight line but it used to swing wide on any roundabout!

Get better tyres.

cruhoortwunk

Turned out the alignment only barely passed the NCT on side slip test. And it was gradually getting worse.
That was the problem