Housemate refusing to leave?

empacher

I am the sole tennent on the lease for my apartment. Landlord leaves it to me to fill the other room.

girl moved in 8weeks ago. Things arent working out. She's constantly making noise coming home drunk, slamming doors at 5am. Has smoked in the house a few times despite being told not to.

Ive spoke to her three times about having people back/ making noise late.

gave her 30 days notice by written letter, informed the landlord. He was cool with it. Now shes saying she wont leave.

When the 30 days are up what can i do?

My plan would be to change the locks and she can collect her stuff by appointment.

Hoping though she comes to reason in that time. She also is not on the lease if that helps.

the_syco

empacher wrote: »

I am the sole tennent on the lease for my apartment.

Are you subletting her room? If you are, she's a licensee, with sweet f**k all rights, and you can give her a weeks notice if you want.

empacher wrote: »

Now shes saying she wont leave.

A licensee should be given "reasonable notice" to leave. The PTRB doesn't come into play.

Maybe have a strong male friend over for a cup of tea when she should leave, in case she does anything stupid (for your protection, nothing else). If she refuses to leave, I'd imagine she becomes a trespasser? Others may have a better understanding of the situation than I do.

househero

Sounds like your landlord is preparing you for a shafting. Are you legally entitled to sublet a room? Get rid of her and prob don't fill the room until your sure its legit

empacher

the_syco wrote: »

Are you subletting her room? If you are, she's a licensee, with sweet f**k all rights, and you can give her a weeks notice if you want.


A licensee should be given "reasonable notice" to leave. The PTRB doesn't come into play.

Maybe have a strong male friend over for a cup of tea when she should leave, in case she does anything stupid (for your protection, nothing else). If she refuses to leave, I'd imagine she becomes a trespasser? Others may have a better understanding of the situation than I do.

techically she is sub letting from me, but ive never legally set myself as a subleter. If thars a thing.

empacher

househero wrote: »

Sounds like your landlord is preparing you for a shafting. Are you legally entitled to sublet a room? Get rid of her and prob don't fill the room until your sure its legit

What do you mean by shafting? Legal trouble or the hassle of it all?

I wouldnt have filled out paper work or anything to sublet. but am doing it by the landlords instruction and permission.

the_syco

empacher wrote: »

but am doing it by the landlords instruction and permission.

Is she paying you the rent, and has she rented the room from you? If so, it sounds like she's subletting.

empacher

the_syco wrote: »

Is she paying you the rent, and has she rented the room from you? If so, it sounds like she's subletting.

Yes to bith

the_syco

empacher wrote: »

Yes to bith

Ever give her any sort or lease that you both signed?

empacher

the_syco wrote: »

Ever give her any sort or lease that you both signed?

No lease i have one i signed 2 years ago that lep rolling after it expired

murphaph

Seems to be a legit sublet. Kick her out.

djburchgrove

Turn her bedroom into the toilet, she'll be gone soon enough!

Mrs OBumble

househero wrote: »

Sounds like your landlord is preparing you for a shafting. Are you legally entitled to sublet a room? Get rid of her and prob don't fill the room until your sure its legit

This is nothing to do with the LL: the OP will be responsible for paying the full rent no matter whether the room is filled or not.


OP, legally you can indeed change the locks and tell her to collect her stuff by appointment.

However you need to think about what she might do when she comes home (possibly drunk, and so with lowered inhibitions) and cannot get into the house. If she calls the guards, and has some evidence that she lives there, then things may not go well for you: even though she is legally trespassing they may just see a vulnerable woman and a bullying "landlord". Alternatively if she decides to break in, she may well do damage that you end up paying for. And (assuming you are male) she might be the sort that would claim you have sexually assaulted her or somesuch.

I'd advise having a plan for what you will do with her stuff on her "move out day" if she hasn't moved herself, and also for somewhere that she can go rather than sleeping on the street. This may include a backpackers hostel, emergency hostel or somesuch - you may even want to find out about the council's homeless services and make sure that "D-day" happens at a time when they're open.

And there's a careful balancing act over the next few days /weeks: you need to be very firm and clear that she needs to leave and is expected to be gone by whatever date - but still not provoke her to the point where she steals / damages your stuff while you're at work.

Good luck. I've never had to do this myself, but friends had to do it for one housemate. It's tough.

Cuddlesworth

empacher wrote: »

Yes to bith

She sublets to a live in landlord. She has few if any rights, the PRTB won't entertain her. Neither will any court as long as you show a slight bit of restraint.

BabySlam

Can you speak to her calmly when she is sober?

hfallada

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

This is nothing to do with the LL: the OP will be responsible for paying the full rent no matter whether the room is filled or not.


OP, legally you can indeed change the locks and tell her to collect her stuff by appointment.

However you need to think about what she might do when she comes home (possibly drunk, and so with lowered inhibitions) and cannot get into the house. If she calls the guards, and has some evidence that she lives there, then things may not go well for you: even though she is legally trespassing they may just see a vulnerable woman and a bullying "landlord". Alternatively if she decides to break in, she may well do damage that you end up paying for. And (assuming you are male) she might be the sort that would claim you have sexually assaulted her or somesuch.

I'd advise having a plan for what you will do with her stuff on her "move out day" if she hasn't moved herself, and also for somewhere that she can go rather than sleeping on the street. This may include a backpackers hostel, emergency hostel or somesuch - you may even want to find out about the council's homeless services and make sure that "D-day" happens at a time when they're open.

I have a feeling gardai will do what gardai do best. Which is tell her that eviction is a civil issue and that there is nothing can/will do. I don't know how many cases on boards of gardai point plain refusing to get involved in eviction, as its not there job

I imagine she has friends or family to move in with. I wouldn't be worrying about emergency housing at all. Unless she literally arrived into this country a few weeks ago and knows no one. But if she has friends to go out and get **** faced with. She has friends who can crash on their sofa

OP I would change the locks and inform her that she stuff is on the street. She could be very aggressive and putting her stuff on the street might be the wisest idea. You owe her nothing with her childish behaviour of not moving out

AndyJB

empacher wrote: »

I am the sole tennent on the lease for my apartment. Landlord leaves it to me to fill the other room.

girl moved in 8weeks ago. Things arent working out. She's constantly making noise coming home drunk, slamming doors at 5am. Has smoked in the house a few times despite being told not to.

Ive spoke to her three times about having people back/ making noise late.

gave her 30 days notice by written letter, informed the landlord. He was cool with it. Now shes saying she wont leave.

When the 30 days are up what can i do?

My plan would be to change the locks and she can collect her stuff by appointment.

Hoping though she comes to reason in that time. She also is not on the lease if that helps.

Terrible situation you're in.

You need to protect yourself so when speaking with or dealing with the tenant make sure you have someone else with you to witness what's said and to prevent any potential false allegations of any sort.

Give threshold a call, they can probably tell you what you're/her actual rights are. Call the PRTB to confirm does this fall under their remit.

If you're really concerned about the situation visit your local garda station and ask if they could give you some advise. Also put a call into citizens advise centre.

If you cant reslove the situation, as you're now on a rolling lease with your landlord you could always leave yourself. You'd probably have to give 30 days notice.

Best of luck and do let us know how you get on.

murphaph

I wouldn't honestly waste my time ringing all those agencies...they'll probably all tell you something different and none will be able or willing to put themselves in the firing line for any advice they offer if it's wrong anyway.

The facts as we know them:
-The troublesome tenant has no relationship with the property owner
-They pay their rent and share of bills to the OP who is the the only tenant the owner deals with
-The owner has sanctioned the sub-letting of a room in the property in this manner

The OP is the troublesome tenant's landlord and happens to live in the same property, so the troublesome tenant is not a tenant at all, just a licensee and can be removed and I would have removed her already with her childish antics. If she's still there on the evening you've told her to leave by, then remove her from the premises.

In an ideal world you should get written confirmation from the LL (owner) that you are the head tenant and that any other occupants are licencees there as long as you allow them to remain. Handy to have if she calls the guards but not essential as (assuming everything you've told us is true) she has absolutely no rights as a tenant as she isn't one.

cerastes

What is the responsibility here, I wouldnt get into subletted arrangements,

But is the OP the subletees landlord now? do they owe any obligation under part 4 to that person? I thought I read something along those lines?
As per the first line of my reply, I didnt read into any of it detail as it was never applicable to me.
I wouldnt really think the person is a licensee.
An official sublet arrangement would mean the landlord is aware and gives consent, which means the person would have rights (Id have thought).
Although none more than a tenant, but more than a licensee (who has none, so not difficult)

In which case, < 6months no rights, send them packing, >6 months, look into it in more detail.
Any other scenario where they dont have rights, send them packing, but in the case of bat **** crazy women, get the landlord involved if necessary (for back up/ proof in case she follows it up with the Gardai and any false claims, it can happen), look into what their rights are and know how to deal with that. Read the RTA2004 and subletting

BabySlam

cerastes wrote: »

What is the responsibility here, I wouldnt get into subletted arrangements,

But is the OP the subletees landlord now? do they owe any obligation under part 4 to that person? I thought I read something along those lines?
As per the first line of my reply, I didnt read into any of it detail as it was never applicable to me.
I wouldnt really think the person is a licensee.
An official sublet arrangement would mean the landlord is aware and gives consent, which means the person would have rights (Id have thought).
Although none more than a tenant, but more than a licensee (who has none, so not difficult)

In which case, < 6months no rights, send them packing, >6 months, look into it in more detail.
Any other scenario where they dont have rights, send them packing, but in the case of bat **** crazy women, get the landlord involved if necessary (for back up/ proof in case she follows it up with the Gardai and any false claims, it can happen), look into what their rights are and know how to deal with that. Read the RTA2004 and subletting

The tenant is not vacating the property to sub-let it.

Mrs OBumble

murphaph wrote: »

If she's still there on the evening you've told her to leave by, then remove her from the premises.

And if she refuses to leave, how would you do that - pick her up by the scruff of the neck and lift her out? Yell and scream so much that she runs away? Call the guards yourself and say she's trespassing?

AndyJB

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

And if she refuses to leave, how would you do that - pick her up by the scruff of the neck and lift her out? Yell and scream so much that she runs away? Call the guards yourself and say she's trespassing?

You got there just before me Mrs OBumble, great points.

murphaph

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

And if she refuses to leave, how would you do that - pick her up by the scruff of the neck and lift her out? Yell and scream so much that she runs away? Call the guards yourself and say she's trespassing?

I'll leave it up to your imagination.