Landlord didnt mention payment for repair

AnzeShane

Hi all,

The landlord said that I have to pay for the repairs of an item in the house. They went and fixed the job without informing anyone in the house that we had to pay it prior to fixing it. Im just wondering are they allowed to do this if we have to pay for it or do they have to inform us first then we source someone to repair it?

Thanks

Wabbit Ears

It really does matter what was repaired and why it needed repairing.

Did you ask him to repair it?

ted1

OP did you break the item? That's what matters

Mrs OBumble

No, the LL does not have to allow you to get an under-skilled friend to do a half-arsed repair job on his/her house.

If it was a substantial enough break that the LL found out about it - or something besides fair wear and tear that you left behind when you moved out - then you have to pay.

AnzeShane

What happened is that the oil ran out and we went to bleed the air out but turned out it was clogged and couldnt get the new oil in, now they are saying we have to pay

cruizer101

Yeah I'd say you have to pay, although the damage was not caused directly by you it was through your negligence and I'm sure there is some term in the lease along these lines

qt3.14

Get an invoice and pay it.

ForestFire

In general I would agree that on a case like this you have to pay.

But what is the set-up of the oil?
Is there a filter on the line from the tank to the boiler?
If there is no filter, then is the system set-up correctly?

Is the cost to replace the filter (I guess less than €50)
Or is there more substantial cost to the boiler.

I would say it the system was not protected correctly in the first place you have a case, But I am not a plumber and I'm not sure on the general consensus on this.

Wabbit Ears

ok, then, no. Pay the man.

AnzeShane

Ok, most post here are saying pay him. That was not the question being asked. Please stop reffering to that as it is not an issue, just wanted info on wether they should of informed us first

TheChizler

Well how did they find out about it? Surely you told them first? What do you expect to happen when you tell a landlord that something needs fixing?

Is the issue more that they came to the property unannounced?

bucketybuck

AnzeShane wrote: »

What happened is that the oil ran out and we went to bleed the air out but turned out it was clogged and couldnt get the new oil in, now they are saying we have to pay

Have you asked the landlord how this was your fault?

BoatMad

in my view its unreasonable for you to be asked to pay for what is a faulty oil supply system, No heating system shield require work simply because the oil ran out and air locked. If it got sludge in it, it was because the system was either not installed properly or not maintained properly.

Greenmachine

AnzeShane wrote: »

Ok, most post here are saying pay him. That was not the question being asked. Please stop reffering to that as it is not an issue, just wanted info on wether they should of informed us first

Your attitude stinks. Oil leaking out of boiler, would be considered an urgent maintenance issue.

bucketybuck

Greenmachine wrote: »

Your attitude stinks. Oil leaking out of boiler, would be considered an urgent maintenance issue.

That might be relevant if there had been any oil leaking from the boiler.

BoatMad

Greenmachine wrote: »

Your attitude stinks. Oil leaking out of boiler, would be considered an urgent maintenance issue.

read the post , the oil supply ran out ( not leaked) the system air locked ( thats standard. whats not standard is that the sludge choked the system .

The landlord is trying to pin years of poor maintenance or even bad installation on the unfortunate tenants

ted1

AnzeShane wrote: »

What happened is that the oil ran out and we went to bleed the air out but turned out it was clogged and couldnt get the new oil in, now they are saying we have to pay

You broke it , so of course you should pay. You shouldn't let it run out

BoatMad

ted1 wrote: »

You broke it , so of course you should pay. You shouldn't let it run out

Thats simply nonsense, no central heating system " breaks" because the oil ran out.

dilallio

If you attempted to bleed the system but incorrectly adjusted the wrong valve (there are generally 2 - one for bleeding the air and the other for adjusting the fuel mix), then you could indeed have caused a lot of damage to the boiler.

If this is the case, then the landlord is correct in getting a qualified person to repair the damage.

Michael D Not Higgins

We don't know exactly how it got clogged. If it is indeed a problem with the installation, lack of filter, etc. you should take a dispute with the PRTB if the landlord will not back down. If it was because of your actions, such as not correctly bleeding the system, or whatever, then it is your fault and you should pay.

Wabbit Ears

Fact is they did attempt to bleed the system which ended up in it being clogged so how or why it clogged is irrelevant. They should have let the landlord deal with this bit but they did it themselves and it needed repair work to rectify.

It would be a whole different story if they had just filled it with oil and informed the landlord it was no longer working after the tank was refilled.

Mrs OBumble

BoatMad wrote: »

If it got sludge in it, it was because the system was either not installed properly or not maintained properly.

Or they tipped the tank. I know where my bets would sit.

Irrespective of that: OP, no the LL does not have to consult you first re whether to get it fixed and whether you have a friend who can do it cheaply.

If you wanted to just get it fixed yourself, then you would have done so.

Instead you notified the LL - and at that point s/he became responsible for the repair, and you became liable for the cost if it was due to your actions.

runawaybishop

AnzeShane wrote: »

Hi all,

The landlord said that I have to pay for the repairs of an item in the house. They went and fixed the job without informing anyone in the house that we had to pay it prior to fixing it. Im just wondering are they allowed to do this if we have to pay for it or do they have to inform us first then we source someone to repair it?

Thanks

They do not have to inform you that they will be getting repairs carried out, ask your permission or ask you to source someone. T

They do, however, need to seek permission to enter the premises unless the repair is an emergency. They also need to pay for repairs themselves if they were not caused by you. From what you have posted it looks like you let the oil run out which caused the issue, so you may indeed be liable for the cost.

bucketybuck

Wabbit Ears wrote: »

Fact is they did attempt to bleed the system which ended up in it being clogged so how or why it clogged is irrelevant. They should have let the landlord deal with this bit but they did it themselves and it needed repair work to rectify.

It would be a whole different story if they had just filled it with oil and informed the landlord it was no longer working after the tank was refilled.

It is nowhere near a fact. Bleeding the oil system after a fill is a perfectly reasonable thing to do, and the reason for the system clogging is perhaps the most relevant thing there could be regarding this thread.

runawaybishop wrote: »

From what you have posted it looks like you let the oil run out which caused the issue, so you may indeed be liable for the cost.

This is not certain at all.

runawaybishop

bucketybuck wrote: »

This is not certain at all.

Yes thats why i said "may" and "looks like", the OP will need to clarify.

Wabbit Ears

Sorry, but no, Filling the tank is reasonable, attempting to bleed a oil tank is not. I have no idea of the proper procedure to do this and I sincerely doubt the vast majority of people do. Are you really actually saying that its common knowledge how to properly bleed an oil fed heating system?

BoatMad

Wabbit Ears wrote: »

Sorry, but no, Filling the tank is reasonable, attempting to bleed a oil tank is not. I have no idea of the proper procedure to do this and I sincerely doubt the vast majority of people do. Are you really actually saying that its common knowledge how to properly bleed an oil fed heating system?

anyone I know that has a oil fired central heating system tends to either know how to bleed it or they pay a plumber to do it. Its not an uncommon issue. its certainly within the remit of a DIY person and is typically explained in the operation manual supplied with the burner

If they bleed it incorrectly and damaged something ( which is unlikely ) I would agree they are liable. However they described the system as having clogged , that is either a poor installation or more likely poor maintenance, both of which are the landlords responsibility

Michael D Not Higgins

BoatMad wrote: »

anyone I know that has a oil fired central heating system tends to either know how to bleed it or they pay a plumber to do it. Its not an uncommon issue. its certainly within the remit of a DIY person and is typically explained in the operation manual supplied with the burner

My parents have an oil central heating system and I was taught as a teenager by my dad how to bleed the air. It's not difficult and can be done easily enough after googling the procedure.

emeldc

Wabbit Ears wrote: »

Sorry, but no, Filling the tank is reasonable, attempting to bleed a oil tank is not. I have no idea of the proper procedure to do this and I sincerely doubt the vast majority of people do. Are you really actually saying that its common knowledge how to properly bleed an oil fed heating system?

It's actually a simple procedure, but then some people would call a handyman to change a light bulb. I've bled mine dozens of times over a ten year period and I've also tipped up the tank and I've never got dirt in the jets. But all it takes is a speck. I'd want to know when the filter was changed last if there is a filter

Del2005

AnzeShane wrote: »

What happened is that the oil ran out and we went to bleed the air out but turned out it was clogged and couldnt get the new oil in, now they are saying we have to pay

Did you refill the tank before you tried to bleed it and if you did refill did you leave it settle for a few hours before trying to bleed? If you did both of these than it's most likely the LLs fault and they should cover it, if you didn't pay up.

Mark Tapley

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

No, the LL does not have to allow you to get an under-skilled friend to do a half-arsed repair job on his/her house.

If it was a substantial enough break that the LL found out about it - or something besides fair wear and tear that you left behind when you moved out - then you have to pay.

You continually make negative assumptions without having all the facts. If you insist on posting in such a combative mode you could at least ascertain the facts before you attack.

El_Duderino 09

In reality there's no way to determine how much of it you caused. Sedimentation occurs in oil tanks. That's hardly the tenant's business but if you shook the tank or propped it up to get the last few drops out, then it could be your fault.

If it's the result of build-up of sediment over years without any effort to clean the tank out, then it's back on the LL.

As a matter of interest, how many LLs on here have had the oil tank cleaned out in their rented property?

Normally you're not obliged to pay anything unless you are given a receipt. I'd be asking for an itemised bill. If you caused the blockage you need to pay to have the blockage cleared. If the ll wants to throw in a service or have the tank cleaned out at your expenses then I would object.

Sligo1

If OP bled the rads and fecked up the system he is liable. However, if it is a faulty system and the boiler has not been maintained (and this is what caused the problem) this is landlords remit. Boiler should be serviced every 1-1.5 years. And this is the LLs responsibility.

the_syco

AnzeShane wrote: »

Im just wondering are they allowed to do this if we have to pay for it or do they have to inform us first then we source someone to repair it?

Thanks

AnzeShane wrote: »

Ok, most post here are saying pay him. That was not the question being asked.

Actually, the question you asked if you have to pay.

AnzeShane wrote: »

Please stop reffering to that as it is not an issue, just wanted info on wether they should of informed us first

No. His house, he decides who fixes the stuff that he owns.

I'd say he's getting you to pay if the person who fixed the oil boiler mentioned that it had been tampered with.

BoatMad

the_syco wrote: »

No. His house, he decides who fixes the stuff that he owns.

well not really

As a Landlord, you must:
Register the tenancy agreement with the PRTB. If you do not register then you will not be able to avail of the PRTB’s dispute resolutions service and you may be prosecuted.
Provide your tenant with a rent book (if no written lease is in place) and receipts of payment
Make sure that your property is in good condition
Maintain the property to the standard it was at the start of the tenancy
Reimburse the tenants for any repairs carried out on the structure
Insure the property
Provide you tenant with information and contact details of any agent who deals on your behalf.

Michael D Not Higgins

BoatMad wrote: »

well not really

How does that not allow the landlord to decide who maintains his property? He must reimburse the tenant if they have incurred a cost to maintain it but that doesn't mean they get first stab at any repair.

BoatMad

Michael D Not Higgins wrote: »

How does that not allow the landlord to decide who maintains his property? He must reimburse the tenant if they have incurred a cost to maintain it but that doesn't mean they get first stab at any repair.

I didn't dispute that bit , Its clearly the landlords job to fix or have fixed on his behalf the heating system. Its not the landlords job to arbitrarily decide the tenant should pay for that. Not knowing the detail here, the proper functioning of the heating system and its maintenance is clearly a matter for the landlord to fix, maintain and PAY for.

Michael D Not Higgins

BoatMad wrote: »

I didn't dispute that bit , Its clearly the landlords job to fix or have fixed on his behalf the heating system. Its not the landlords job to arbitrarily decide the tenant should pay for that. Not knowing the detail here, the proper functioning of the heating system and its maintenance is clearly a matter for the landlord to fix, maintain and PAY for.

The bit you quoted was about who is doing the fixing not the paying.

Anyway, the damage caused can be considered over and above normal wear and tear and is thus the repsonsibility of the tenant to cover out of their security deposit. Whether they want to dispute this, they will have to do with the PRTB if the landlord doesn't agree.

BoatMad

Anyway, the damage caused can be considered over and above normal wear and tear and is thus the repsonsibility of the tenant to cover out of their security deposit

We dont have the facts to come to that conclusion. No damage is caused to any standard oil fired heating system by letting the oil run out

Michael D Not Higgins

BoatMad wrote: »

We dont have the facts to come to that conclusion. No damage is caused to any standard oil fired heating system by letting the oil run out

Yeah which I summed up in if they don't agree with the landlord then take a dispute to the PRTB.

El_Duderino 09

BoatMad wrote: »

We dont have the facts to come to that conclusion. No damage is caused to any standard oil fired heating system by letting the oil run out

Unless the tank has quite a bit of sediment which can cause gunk to block the system just by running very low or running out...

Or the tenant has made a mess of the bleeding...

There is too much missing information to make a reasoned judgement beyond tenant vs landlord. Is there a plumber here who could give their opinion of the likelihood of it being one or the other?

the_syco

BoatMad wrote: »

well not really

Your list. It means nothing to the point I made.

BoatMad wrote: »

We dont have the facts to come to that conclusion. No damage is caused to any standard oil fired heating system by letting the oil run out

As per the below, the oil ran out, they went to bleed the air out, and somehow the boiler became broke.

AnzeShane wrote: »

What happened is that the oil ran out and we went to bleed the air out but turned out it was clogged and couldnt get the new oil in, now they are saying we have to pay

Landlord then gets someone in to fix the boiler, asks the repair person could what have happened without tampering. My guess is the response was along the lines of "tampering caused the issue", and the landlord got the tenants to pay.

The cost decides however, if it was the labour to fix the issue, or labour + part needed to fix the issue. I'm guessing the latter.

GerardKeating

BoatMad wrote: »

We dont have the facts to come to that conclusion. No damage is caused to any standard oil fired heating system by letting the oil run out

True, half the time, that's how I find out that i need Oil

But I would never bleed it myself, normally ask the Oil Delivery Guy, or once asked the LL for help.

Victor

Greenmachine wrote: »

Your attitude stinks.

**cough**

No need for personal comments.

Moderator