Are you a Progress Denier?

Kermit.de.frog

The second in command, Joan Burton, at the weekend described the hard left TD's in the Dáil and others as "Progress Deniers" when they talk about the country.


Presumably this is to put a subconcious link in the the public mind with "holocaust deniers" for example which is quite a hard hitting, nasty term. I guess the idea is to attach distasteful connotations for the public.

The environmentalists have tried this in recent years too with the term "climate deniers" appearing. That actually backfired from some quarters quite badly.

Whilst Joan Burton is right that there are many out there who would prefer to see Ireland in chaos and can gain from chaos whilst many are constantly told things are getting worse not better from various sources it is also a risky strategy. Normal people out there might not like this term for the reasons said if it sticks. It is a very cynical use of a loaded term.

EDIT: Also labels are a way to stop debate as well. X makes an argument, Y says "progress denier!".

Are you a progress denier?

Kevin McCloud

In a political situation is it?

darkpagandeath

How can they be with all their smart phones ?

sbsquarepants

Well I don't deny that I rang Enda to tell him I had tons of money, no wait I'm confused - I didn't ring him, I couldn't afford phone credit:)

PopePalpatine

I saw the term "progress denier" and I thought it would have something to do with the religious far-right. :pac: I'd say "climate deniers" were whipped up into a frenzy by their heroes on Fox News.

Kevin McCloud

darkpagandeath wrote: »

How can they be with all their smart phones ?

Has Joan a smartphone?

Mr Freeze

Progress Deniers to Holocaust Deniers is quite a jump!

I would never have thought of the Holocaust when Progress Deniers was mentioned.

jimgoose

<Pulls back sleeve to show Jobsbridge ID number tatooed on forearm, speaks in "Jackie Mason" voice> You! You did this!!

Grayson

PopePalpatine wrote: »

I saw the term "progress denier" and I thought it would have something to do with the religious far-right. :pac: I'd say "climate deniers" were whipped up into a frenzy by their heroes on Fox News.

Or Evolution Deniers.

The US far right are the ones that popped into my head too.

conorhal

'Deniar' a term afixed when seeking to suggest sombody is refusing to accept an objective truth. I look at this government and think 'progress' would be kicking them out, now that's an objective truth. Whatever Joan's moaning about is doubtless an attempt to demonize anybody that disagrees with her. This FG/Lab government has a really nasty authoritarian streak and deploying 'language' like that certiantly doesn't make me think much of them. It kind of reminds me of the suggestion that she had been 'held hostage' by protestors.

darkpagandeath

Kevin McCloud wrote: »

Has Joan a smartphone?

Did you not See it when the poor elderly woman was trapped in a car terrified for her life by a death squad baying for her head ? I hear the ranger's had to be sent in to free her from her captors. luckily only one missile got launched. Btw Our tax money paid for it.

The Diabolical Monocle

Mr Freeze wrote: »

I would never have thought of the Holocaust when Progress Deniers was mentioned.

That cause you weren't wearing a tinfoil helmet.

wake up !!!111!

Turtyturd

Such a stupid thread, and harsh on us holocaust deniers to be linked with that lot.

Dyr

A cornered Joan is a dangerous Joan, she's looking at being the leader who wiped labour out of irish politics and all she has as a parachute is her massive pensions. Her address to the party faithful (well the ones that haven't gone AWOL) was dire and now Alan "wet look bryclreem is still cool" Kelly is measuring up her place as comrade-in-chief

Expect a lot more crowing from Joan, its all shes good at.

Kevin McCloud

Bambi wrote: »

A cornered Joan is a dangerous Joan

Similar to cornering a mink.

Dyr

Kevin McCloud wrote: »

Similar to cornering a mink.

Probably more like cornering a seagull

Sir Osis of Liver.

Nothing screams, "Hey! Look at me! I'm in denial!" like a bald irish fella with a pony tail.

Dyr

Sir Osis of Liver. wrote: »

Nothing screams, "Hey! Look at me! I'm in denial!" like a bald irish fella with a pony tail.

Hi Twink!

kowloon

Progress is just a theory, like evolution and climate change. I prefer the proper, biblical interpretation.

KungPao

kowloon wrote: »

Progress is just a theory, like evolution and climate change. I prefer the proper, biblical interpretation.

And what's that?

Sir Osis of Liver.

kowloon wrote: »

Progress is just a theory, like evolution and climate change. I prefer the proper, biblical interpretation.

The Moses one ?

Hey, look at the baby in the basket floating in Denial.

Shurimgreat

I'm definitely a Progress Denier.

Life was far better under Bertie, Cowen and Fianna Fail, particularly under Cowen. I'm positively nostalgic for the days of 450,000 unemployed, and 25 billion annual deficits.

Kermit.de.frog

I do wonder what the people who voted for the labour side of the government thought had to happen in 2011? It was cuts or national bankruptcy and destitution. How they thought otherwise I have no idea.

Kevin McCloud

I havent a clue Kermit, politics is complicated. Any update on the weather?

Shurimgreat

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

I do wonder what the people who voted for the labour side of the government thought had to happen in 2011? It was cuts or national bankruptcy and destitution. How they thought otherwise I have no idea.

The Irish electorate just like kicking people that's all.

But bringing back FF into government is surely not the solution.

In any case it doesn't matter who is in government as you say, Labour, FG, FF or Sinn Fein, there is no alternative to cuts .

imitation

What does she mean anyway ? Did the country get better in the past 20 years ? Sure it did. Ehat about the past 5 years ? No way !

Just from my point of view

Taxes are higher.

Public health is falling to bits after years of the most moronic morotorium ever. I had an appointment cancelled, "we will give you a ring 6 weeks before". Im still waiting 7 months later.

The center of many big towns has decayed horribly.

Roads are in a crap state, despite all the extra dosh from lpt and motor tax hikes.

Thing is, the money is all just being used to service our huge debt, I can't see it getting better, were just making sure our overlords still get there ROI. Government strategy is to keep playing along and hope we get some hyper boom that makes 75 billion an insiginifcant amount of money.

wretcheddomain

imitation wrote: »

Ehat about the past 5 years ? No way !

I regret to inform you but Joan is referring to folks such as you.

To claim that Ireland has not improved - in any way - since 2010 is palpably absurd.

The fact is that as much as we may deplore the banality of our leader, and the incompetence of many politicians, the country has improved on many economic and employment levels.

Folks simply expect too much of a given government, always setting the bar to an impossibly achievable level.

I, for one, may not agree with everything the FG/Labour coalition has done, but I can say with confidence that they're the least worst option existing at the moment and have done a somewhat reasonable job at pulling our country out of the depths it sank to since the last administration.

shruikan2553

imitation wrote: »

What does she mean anyway ? Did the country get better in the past 20 years ? Sure it did. Ehat about the past 5 years ? No way !

Just from my point of view

Taxes are higher.

Public health is falling to bits after years of the most moronic morotorium ever. I had an appointment cancelled, "we will give you a ring 6 weeks before". Im still waiting 7 months later.

The center of many big towns has decayed horribly.

Roads are in a crap state, despite all the extra dosh from lpt and motor tax hikes.

Thing is, the money is all just being used to service our huge debt, I can't see it getting better, were just making sure our overlords still get there ROI. Government strategy is to keep playing along and hope we get some hyper boom that makes 75 billion an insiginifcant amount of money.

But Joan gave us a way of pretending unemployment is lower. Thank you for progress!

Kermit.de.frog

shruikan2553 wrote: »

But Joan gave us a way of pretending unemployment is lower. Thank you for progress!

What is your evidence that it is not lower?

The complaints are always the same - sound bites but no evidence.

shruikan2553

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

What is your evidence that it is not lower?

The complaints are always the same - sound bites but no evidence.

Poor choice of words, what I meant was:

But Joan gave us a way of pretending unemployment is lower than it is. Thank you for progress!

No need to get your panties in a bunch Joan.

donegaLroad

Reminds of the time Bush referred to the French as 'cheese eating surrender monkeys' when they refused to back the invasion of iraq.