Irish Soccer team

Crooked Jack

So after a great weekend for international Irish sport with Frampton's stunning display of arse-whoopery and the men in green facing down England, a few people in work got to talking about how Ireland does best in sports where we compete as one all-Ireland team.
Generally people agreed that we performed better as one team but the stickler always seemed to be the soccer team, with fans of the six county side pretty much opposed to any union.
So I was wondering, what does AH think of the idea of an all-Ireland soccer side.

And why is it that soccer fans in particular (although in my experience mainly unionist northern fans) are so opposed to the idea?

Personally I think it's cause of the northern team's associations with loyalism. This makes fans obviously opposed to an all Ireland team while some southern fans see the northern side and want nothing to do with them.

Anyway AH, have at it.

coopdog85

Crooked Jack wrote: »

So after a great weekend for international Irish sport with Frampton's stunning display of arse-whoopery and the men in green facing down England, a few people in work got to talking about how Ireland does best in sports where we compete as one all-Ireland team.
Generally people agreed that we performed better as one team but the stickler always seemed to be the soccer team, with fans of the six county side pretty much opposed to any union.
So I was wondering, what does AH think of the idea of an all-Ireland soccer side.

And why is it that soccer fans in particular (although in my experience mainly unionist northern fans) are so opposed to the idea?

Personally I think it's cause of the northern team's associations with loyalism. This makes fans obviously opposed to an all Ireland team while some southern fans see the northern side and want nothing to do with them.

Anyway AH, have at it.

Rugby twat.

lertsnim

I would be opposed. I wouldn't want to be sharing the stands with Love Ulster types.

pmy.murphy

I dunno, ask Willie Frazer what he thinks when he comes to Dublin with his friends

Amirani

We do well in sports that don't have many countries participating.

Diabhal Beag

The North wouldn't want to be associated with the current low quality Republic side. They're doing grand on their own at present.

iMac_Hunt

Even if it were to happen, we'd still be terrible.

The_Valeyard

Lovely voting options OP......

WesternZulu

Lot easier be successful in a sport where there are little over a handful of countries that are actually any good as opposed to Ireland playing as one team.

Crooked Jack

coopdog85 wrote: »

Rugby twat.

Haha. You really dont know me.

Wilberto

Yes. That's the reason! It's definitely not because soccer is probably the most globally competitive team sport there is (or, at least far more competitive than the particular sports you referred to).

I mean, even if we did become an "All Ireland" soccer nation, I genuinely don't see many (if any) Northern getting into our team. Jonny Evans is of course one as we're mightily short in that department but after that, who else is there that would be a drastic increase on the our own side.


So, no, as I eluded to earlier, the issue is with the competitive nature of this team sport compared to others, and nothing to do with the "All Ireland" nature of the teams.

Pretty overlooked fact, we (ROI) were the breakaway FA. The splinter group, if you will.

Lapin

Such a long post OP for a thread that won't last.

Wilberto

lertsnim wrote: »

I would be opposed. I wouldn't want to be sharing the stands with Love Ulster Northern Ireland types.

Fixed your post on behalf of the natives of Donegal, Cavan and Monaghan.

Mint Sauce

Shure most NI eligible players coming on the scene are already opting for the ROI side anyway.

kfallon

We were shíte for years in rugby under a one country team.

dodderangler

kfallon wrote: »

We were shíte for years in rugby under a one country team.

True but we were still better at rugby than our football team was at football.
And seriously I am sick of hearing this Shiite in pubs about tierry Henry handling the ball. Let's be honest. Even if it didn't happen we wouldnt of gotten far anyway.

ChunkyLover54

dodderangler wrote: »

True but we were still better at rugby than our football team was at football.

Our football team in the 90's was relatively far stronger than our rugby team.

kfallon

dodderangler wrote: »

True but we were still better at rugby than our football team was at football.
And seriously I am sick of hearing this Shiite in pubs about tierry Henry handling the ball. Let's be honest. Even if it didn't happen we wouldnt of gotten far anyway.

From 87-94 we were better at football than rugby!

And thanks for mentioning that other thing, that's really stirring up a (very boring) hornet's nest even tho I pretty much agree with you

Berserker

Crooked Jack wrote: »

Generally people agreed that we performed better as one team but the stickler always seemed to be the soccer team, with fans of the six county side pretty much opposed to any union.

The hardcore RoI fans are just as much against it. They look down on the NI team, referring to them as a "pub team", which is seriously rich when you look at the poor standard of play from the RoI team of late.

The biggest opposition to any merge would be the associations themselves. They punch well above their weight, particularly the IFA and a merge with the FAI would result in them losing that power.

Finally, the rugby team is doing well because they are professionals nowadays. They have been playing as one team for decades and they were wooden spoon candidates prior to professionalism. It has nothing to do with the fact that they are an all Ireland team.

Guy:Incognito

Wilberto wrote: »

I mean, even if we did become an "All Ireland" soccer nation, I genuinely don't see many (if any) Northern getting into our team. Jonny Evans is of course one as we're mightily short in that department but after that, who else is there that would be a drastic increase on the our own side.

.

Well , if the whole lot of them came in to our squad we'd be 16 places higher up the rankings

Witchie

I would love to see it, but it won't happen. It would need the IFA and FAI to merge and the turkey's are not thick enough to vote for Christmas and do themselves out of nice cushy prestigious well paid jobs.

Cookie_Monster

No, should remain separate as should all other sports IMO. Separate countries, separate teams regardless of the history.

COYVB

Couldn't happen without a single domestic league

Crooked Jack

COYVB wrote: »

Couldn't happen without a single domestic league

Isnt there precedent for this though? Dont Derry play in the southern league? And I know for a fact Newry and Warrenpoint were considering it a number of years ago as well

Lt J.R. Bell

Crooked Jack wrote: »

So after a great weekend for international Irish sport with Frampton's stunning display of arse-whoopery and the men in green facing down England, a few people in work got to talking about how Ireland does best in sports where we compete as one all-Ireland team.
Generally people agreed that we performed better as one team but the stickler always seemed to be the soccer team, with fans of the six county side pretty much opposed to any union.
So I was wondering, what does AH think of the idea of an all-Ireland soccer side.

And why is it that soccer fans in particular (although in my experience mainly unionist northern fans) are so opposed to the idea?

Personally I think it's cause of the northern team's associations with loyalism. This makes fans obviously opposed to an all Ireland team while some southern fans see the northern side and want nothing to do with them.

Anyway AH, have at it.

Any decent Northern Player (even the mercenaries due to our Citizenship Rules) is automatically entitled to play for the Republic. (assuming they haven't been capped at Senior Level for NI). Many of them have crossed paths over the years, remember Alan Kernaghan ? (SP)

As bad as our team might be, none of the current NI team would get a sniff of the Republic Squad.

Status Quo, nick the good Northern Players.

Soccer has a different environment to the Rugby heads. We shouldn't pander to the soccer heads over the flag or anthems either. IFA, like in the past, would seek to dominate the FAI as well.

Saying that, I would definitely welcome an All Island domestic league

Lt J.R. Bell

Wilberto wrote: »

Yes. That's the reason! It's definitely not because soccer is probably the most globally competitive team sport there is (or, at least far more competitive than the particular sports you referred to).

I mean, even if we did become an "All Ireland" soccer nation, I genuinely don't see many (if any) Northern getting into our team. Jonny Evans is of course one as we're mightily short in that department but after that, who else is there that would be a drastic increase on the our own side.


So, no, as I eluded to earlier, the issue is with the competitive nature of this team sport compared to others, and nothing to do with the "All Ireland" nature of the teams.

Like the Rugby, there would end up being a batch of "political" selections to ensure Ulster got represented. Though, Boss, Bowe, Trimble and Ferris weren't political selections of course, they were there on merit

Crooked Jack

Lt J.R. Bell wrote: »

Like the Rugby, there would end up being a batch of "political" selections to ensure Ulster got represented. Though, Boss, Bowe, Trimble and Ferris weren't political selections of course, they were there on merit

Rugby is based on the 9 county province of Ulster. Hardly political then

thelad95

Lt J.R. Bell wrote: »

Like the Rugby, there would end up being a batch of "political" selections to ensure Ulster got represented. Though, Boss, Bowe, Trimble and Ferris weren't political selections of course, they were there on merit

Political selections have never happened on the Irish Rugby team. Not in the professional era anyway.

People saying that none of the NI players would get on the Irish team should take a quick look at the world rankings.

SEPT 23 1989

The 2 sets of "home" fans running pitched battles in the stands would make quite the spectacle

Crooked Jack

SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »

The 2 sets of "home" fans running pitched battles in the stands would make quite the spectacle

But they'd find it harder to identify each other now that they'd all be wearing the same jersey

anncoates

All for it in the political sense - as much to annoy loyalists as anything else - but there's not many players in the last decade of so I'd care abut having, plus I assume European places would be lost for domestic league teams from both associations?

anncoates

Crooked Jack wrote: »

Isnt there precedent for this though? Dont Derry play in the southern league?

Fairly exceptional circumstances (the troubles) there though. Not sure it'd be a goer these days.

Crooked Jack

Crooked Jack wrote: »

But they'd find it harder to identify each other now that they'd all be wearing the same jersey

Yeah, Man United jerseys.

Paz-CCFC

ChunkyLover54 wrote: »

Our football team in the 90's was relatively far stronger than our rugby team.

You could argue as well that, at the height of both national teams (80s/90s football side v 00s/10s rugby), the football side fared much better. The best that Ireland has done in the football is the second knockout stage of the World Cup. In the Rugby World Cup, it's the record is the first knockout stage. And they don't have to go through a tough qualifying campaign, either.

Whilst rugby enthusiasts always argue that not much silverware has been won by the football side, there's nothing comparable to the Six Nations. If the national football team played in a five match annual tournament, then I'm sure they'd have gotten a few trophies over a century. Somewhat comparable would be the qualifying campaigns for the Euros and World Cup, but they're spread over a longer period, with 2 -3 times the matches. Somewhat comparable might be the 1988 Euro Qualifiers, where Ireland finished top of a very competitive (eight match) campaign, ahead of Bulgaria, Belgium and Scotland (only two points separating 1st and 4th). You could say the Four Nations from a few years is similar to the old Four Nations in rugby, as well.

Basically, rugby has had good and bad times, football has had good and bad times. Both will experience both as well, in the future.


On the issue of both sides joining. It would increase the pool of players a bit, but we'd still have a fraction of the likes of England, Germany, Spain, USA, Brazil, Argentina etc.

circadian

Crooked Jack wrote: »

Isnt there precedent for this though? Dont Derry play in the southern league? And I know for a fact Newry and Warrenpoint were considering it a number of years ago as well

UEFA and FIFA would almost certainly make this a prerequisite as one association, one national team.

Why would they allow two associations to put forward one national team? What precedent does that create?

Derry joining the FAI took quite some time to work out and was the result of unusual circumstances.

Kev_2012

We have an International football team? I know we have an International Rules team and a soccer team alright...

Lt J.R. Bell

Crooked Jack wrote: »

But they'd find it harder to identify each other now that they'd all be wearing the same jersey

That did not really stop them sending bullets to Neil Lennon or their history with Jimmy Quinn.

Nice to see things have quietened down in the IFA League crowd though. No more nonsense there

iDave

A lot of barriers to this. Sounds great in theory but in reality not likely.
A merged league and national team would require a merger of the IFA & FAI. The IFA have a special position within FIFA along with the FA, SFA and FAW where they rotate the vice presidency and have a unique position to influence the rules of the game. They would more than likely have to give this up. No way would they ever agree to that. Also those who hold high positions in both organisations could lose their position or be restricted in their progress to the top. Turkey voting for Christmas.
Then stadiums. A lot of money gone into Lansdowne Road and Windsor Park. Both will have to host internationals to be viable. So do we rotate home grounds? Not satisfactory for fans on both sides of the border to lose half their games. You can kiss goodbye naming rights cash then.
Then security. The Setanta Cup has been used by tossers on both sides to cause trouble. Regular home and away league games will make it even easier for scumbags to go looking for fights with those nasty prods/taigs. PSNI & Gardaí will love that!
Can we really then support the same national team as some of these people. I have nothing in common with Frazer/Fleg/Orange types who have less than desirable attitude to Irish people. Windsor Park once described as a Catholic no go zone was the scene of severe anti-Irish bile in 93. Supporting the same team as those people, come on will never happen!
Imagine a bus full of fans from Dublin going to a home game in Belfast getting pelted by our fellow home fans!

Nesta99

Diego Simeone wrote: »

We do well in sports that don't have many countries participating.

Like GAA?

Lt J.R. Bell

Crooked Jack wrote: »

Rugby is based on the 9 county province of Ulster. Hardly political then

Cavan, Monaghan, Donegal have hardly ever been bastions of Rugby ,bar the odd player to emerge

Lt J.R. Bell

thelad95 wrote: »

Political selections have never happened on the Irish Rugby team. Not in the professional era anyway.

People saying that none of the NI players would get on the Irish team should take a quick look at the world rankings.

1. There was a LOT of whinging from the Ulster Branch during O'Sullivan's reign that there was no starters from Ulster. Some of the bench selections of Ulster players were considered "political".

2. World Rankings? When did NI last qualify for a tournament ? Rankings don't truly confirm quality. Look at the US sure

Name 3 players from the NI team that would walk into the Rep of Ireland first team

signostic

Kev_2012 wrote: »

We have an International football team? I know we have an International Rules team and a soccer team alright...

I like International Rules as there is always a 50% chance that we will be world champions at it.

Micky Dolenz

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