Independent agri advisor

L1985

Hey guys we have a lot going on in the next 18 mths so was looking at getting an independent agri advisor as teagasc are always crazy busy and would need a bit of advice over the next while. I'm going in for the young farmer and the national reserve first off and was waiting for some confirmation from the accountant got it there so starting to set up the paper work. Got one agri guy recommended and was speaking to him today the thing is he said his price for doing the young farmer scheme and national reserve only was €500.now I prob won't be able to meet him itl all be done over the phone and he just confirmed a few bits for me today. When I asked him about glas and other things we would have going on he said that would be extra charge (I got the feeling a lot extra) just want to know is that a lot?

Kovu

Our guy gets €350 per year flat rate for all, he does everything that's needed regards forms etc.
He's not Teagasc either, in a private partnership with another adviser. I was with him a few weeks ago talking about Y. Farmer & Reserve and no extra charge was mentioned at all and he's the one who'll be switching us to Glas in the near future.

L1985

Thanks kovu I was thinking it was too much!! I wanted to get some decent advice but to be honest iv done all the leg work on the young farmers myself and couldn't see the value of 500 and for him to say it was only for that I thought it was too much! It's not a difficult form to fill out. I'll try find another in our area for glas maybe

AGalway

Are u new to farming? Have u a herd number already? As far as I know there Is nothing stopping you applying for the young farmer and national reserve schemes yourself online. You register on agfood.ie and the applications for these schemes will appear on your profile! As regards my query re: being a new applicant, if you are applying this year for the first time you will not be eligible to make a Glas application, the Glas scheme is only open to people who had an SPS application in 2014. The price of this plan is €400-€500. If you gain access to the scheme you will be required to complete a nutrient management plan which will cost €400-€500 also. Whether you are in Glas or not it is no harm to have a nutrient management plan as If you have a DAFM inspection one will be requested anyway!
Hope this info helps!

L1985

Hi thanks for your reply. Dad's been farming for years and we applied under a joint herd number for the young farmers. There is going to be a fair few changes in how we farm going forward and there is different grants Etc including glas that I was interested in. I work full time and dad wouldn't be great at paper work or have the best mindset towards grants etc so I was thinking an advisor would help me out and cut down on some of my legwork!.i have applied for young farmers myself kinda through teagasc but I had to keep chasing them so someone independent should be easier! I found someone to look at our glas application anyway and he was recommended by someone I trust! Thanks for that last part-never even heard it mentioned before!!!!thats kinds why I need someone-only so much boards tells ya

Dawggone

What you are discussing above is box tickers.

Independant Agri advisors are completely different.

stretch film

Dawggone wrote: »

What you are discussing above is box tickers.

Independant Agri advisors are completely different.

Doctors fill out sick certs and gaurds a multitude of forms .
More respect needed for the lowly agri advisor methinks.

L1985

Yeah I guess it came across that way prob cause that's what's in my head at the minute!! no I need more then that as I said we are changing our farm set up and the way we farm. Dad hasn't changed the way he's farmed in 20 years so im looking at assessing it as well and getting advice on where we could try new things. Even getting dad to soil test and scan cows was a big deal telling him about spending 500 on a nutrient plan will prob cause a meltdown!! That's why when the 1st guy I spoke to was 500 for young farmers only I was so shocked.this guy said he'd be 350 for the year exc glas.

Dawggone

stretch film wrote: »

Doctors fill out sick certs and gaurds a multitude of forms .
More respect needed for the lowly agri advisor methinks.

For me..An independent Agri advisor must know a helluva lot more than me.

The kinda guy that knows his own head.
The guy that knows most, or all, of the published, peer reviewed, intelligent, cutting edge, info on the subject that you are paying him to know.

The rest are just fecking box tickers. Parasites.

Count Mondego

Dawggone wrote: »

For me..An independent Agri advisor must know a helluva lot more than me.

The kinda guy that knows his own head.
The guy that knows most, or all, of the published, peer reviewed, intelligent, cutting edge, info on the subject that you are paying him to know.

The rest are just fecking box tickers. Parasites.

What's the teagasc equivalent over there like? I'd imagine the guy you're using based on the job description above is private and expensive.

stretch film

Dawggone wrote: »

For me..An independent Agri advisor must know a helluva lot more than me.

The kinda guy that knows his own head.
The guy that knows most, or all, of the published, peer reviewed, intelligent, cutting edge, info on the subject that you are paying him to know.

The rest are just fecking box tickers. Parasites.

Agree with ya .my tongue was firmly planted .
Its all about the schemes as you know and if one of these box tickers aint signing off your application its going in the bin.

Dawggone

Count Mondego wrote: »

What's the teagasc equivalent over there like? I'd imagine the guy you're using based on the job description above is private and expensive.

Teagasc equivalent...I've no idea..
I don't use box tickers.
Plenty info on here for free if you need it.
The guy I use is a business partner and yes he is private.

Dawggone

stretch film wrote: »

Agree with ya .my tongue was firmly planted .
Its all about the schemes as you know and if one of these box tickers aint signing off your application its going in the bin.

Jobs for the boys.

C0N0R

Dawggone wrote: »

For me..An independent Agri advisor must know a helluva lot more than me.

The kinda guy that knows his own head.
The guy that knows most, or all, of the published, peer reviewed, intelligent, cutting edge, info on the subject that you are paying him to know.

The rest are just fecking box tickers. Parasites.

I agree, dealt with a few in New Zealand and would love to find something similar over here

freedominacup

Dawggone wrote: »

For me..An independent Agri advisor must know a helluva lot more than me.

The kinda guy that knows his own head.
The guy that knows most, or all, of the published, peer reviewed, intelligent, cutting edge, info on the subject that you are paying him to know.

The rest are just fecking box tickers. Parasites.

How much peer reviewed research with direct relevance to day to day management at farm level is generated every year dawg. In this country it's next to nothing. Nice little report in the rag this week about a study on tmr vs feed to yield. Presented as valid proven research, no mention of where published. Just here it is lads. Little footnote at the end of the article to tell us what great lads the two researchers were.


Independent is very hard to find even when peer reviewed. Sister was doing a bit of genetic research a few years ago. She was extremely pissed off when just after the start of the third year of a three year project it was knocked on the head. Preliminary results weren't suiting certain large players in the industry is all she could surmise. Each sample was just a number to her but others knew the provenance of the material and very few were landing on the right side of the line.

I remember reading an article/interview years ago with a top researcher/lecturer in the US. He reckoned top farmers were years ahead of the research on dairy husbandry probably not as relevant with cereals where much of the advances have to come from a lab initially whether it be disease resistance/treatment or developing seed varieties.

frazzledhome

freedominacup wrote: »

How much peer reviewed research with direct relevance to day to day management at farm level is generated every year dawg. In this country it's next to nothing. Nice little report in the rag this week about a study on tmr vs feed to yield. Presented as valid proven research, no mention of where published. Just here it is lads. Little footnote at the end of the article to tell us what great lads the two researchers were.


Independent is very hard to find even when peer reviewed. Sister was doing a bit of genetic research a few years ago. She was extremely pissed off when just after the start of the third year of a three year project it was knocked on the head. Preliminary results weren't suiting certain large players in the industry is all she could surmise. Each sample was just a number to her but others knew the provenance of the material and very few were landing on the right side of the line.

I remember reading an article/interview years ago with a top researcher/lecturer in the US. He reckoned top farmers were years ahead of the research on dairy husbandry probably not as relevant with cereals where much of the advances have to come from a lab initially whether it be disease resistance/treatment or developing seed varieties.

Was your sis doing genomic research by any chance..........am I warm?

freedominacup

frazzledhome wrote: »

Was your sis doing genomic research by any chance..........am I warm?

No. Not even close.

She was very skeptical about genomic proofs but she had stepped back for a while when kids were small and didn't take into account reduction in cost of computer power.She couldn't figure out how they were getting it done cost effectively.

Genomics is basically statistics you just need powerful enough computers to do the maths quickly. Genomic proofs could have been available 20 plus years ago it's just that the financial figures didn't stack up. Cost of doing proofs vs expected return from proven animals didn't balance until the end of the noughties.

trixi2011

C0N0R wrote: »

I agree, dealt with a few in New Zealand and would love to find something similar over here

+1 on that did you ever deal with farmright over there ?

Greengrass1

L1985 wrote: »

Hey guys we have a lot going on in the next 18 mths so was looking at getting an independent agri advisor as teagasc are always crazy busy and would need a bit of advice over the next while. I'm going in for the young farmer and the national reserve first off and was waiting for some confirmation from the accountant got it there so starting to set up the paper work. Got one agri guy recommended and was speaking to him today the thing is he said his price for doing the young farmer scheme and national reserve only was €500.now I prob won't be able to meet him itl all be done over the phone and he just confirmed a few bits for me today. When I asked him about glas and other things we would have going on he said that would be extra charge (I got the feeling a lot extra) just want to know is that a lot?

500e is steep.
Our advisor is teagasc did up my young farmer application and national reserve application
350/yr is it fir the yr I think no matter what you want done.

the best place to learn anything is a discussion group I'm in two and I can't reccomend them enough.
Keeping me on my toes but go to one that's progressive and HONEST

Blackgrass

freedominacup wrote: »

How much peer reviewed research with direct relevance to day to day management at farm level is generated every year dawg. In this country it's next to nothing. Nice little report in the rag this week about a study on tmr vs feed to yield. Presented as valid proven research, no mention of where published. Just here it is lads. Little footnote at the end of the article to tell us what great lads the two researchers were.


Independent is very hard to find even when peer reviewed. Sister was doing a bit of genetic research a few years ago. She was extremely pissed off when just after the start of the third year of a three year project it was knocked on the head. Preliminary results weren't suiting certain large players in the industry is all she could surmise. Each sample was just a number to her but others knew the provenance of the material and very few were landing on the right side of the line.

I remember reading an article/interview years ago with a top researcher/lecturer in the US. He reckoned top farmers were years ahead of the research on dairy husbandry probably not as relevant with cereals where much of the advances have to come from a lab initially whether it be disease resistance/treatment or developing seed varieties.

Biggest problem with research is who pays, and what 'view' they want projected from this research.
My better half is involved in research also based on Ag chems.
Case in point is the 'Anti's' and Triazole chems under the endocrine disruptors directive. The trade blowing back about yellow rusts and it's evolving resistance on a bush up the Himalaya's producing new races even more virulent than ever before(eg. Warrior race) and how this could wipe 25% off Uk yield and even more in Dawgs part of the world. Nowt motivates politicians than the threat of masses of hungry angry people... Now discount the fact the world is awash with wheat but don't let that get in the way of a story .
Farms in the area have a system of on farm trials we do between ourselves, same thing over 4/5 farms out of 20. We have an independant agronomist who does most the work not much really just look in every so often with a group decision made on ideal timings. Works for us as most Uk crop research eg, fert is sponsored by Yara, Hgca by chem companies and some tarrif and only Niab Tag truely free but that's paid subscription.

You might not like Teagasc but i'd rather pay alot of money there and get truely uninfluenced data out than someones prefered outcome, and if you disagree don't by so naive what researcher bites the hand that feeds them.

larrymiller

Been trying to get hold of adviser for 4 weeks now. He promised he'd be here Friday and no show. Rang him 6 times yesterday and no answer.
This lad left teagasc to go out on his own and dad left teagasc to stay with him. He was our best friend until he got going and now this.
Have a number of a cousins adviser will be calling him in the morning hopefully he can take us.
Has anybody advise on changing adviser so close to new bps and will be applying for top up aswell

stretch film

C0N0R wrote: »

I agree, dealt with a few in New Zealand and would love to find something similar over here

Anyone on here using the LIC consultancy. Independent it cant be, but going in with your eyes open so to speak.

frazzledhome

stretch film wrote: »

Anyone on here using the LIC consultancy. Independent it cant be, but going in with your eyes open so to speak.

We deal with LIC for all straws, huge strides in health and fertility. Only daughter proven bulls as I'd value reliability over the race for 400 EBI stock

I don't use their consultant but know of 3 farms brought back from the brink with their advice.

stretch film

frazzledhome wrote: »

We deal with LIC for all straws, huge strides in health and fertility. Only daughter proven bulls as I'd value reliability over the race for 400 EBI stock

I don't use their consultant but know of 3 farms brought back from the brink with their advice.

Big user of their stuff also. Much more reliable results than others I found.
Interesting comment on 3 farms getting such a shake up.
Have decided to quit winter milking so am open to the idea of having an alternative voice .

C0N0R

trixi2011 wrote: »

+1 on that did you ever deal with farmright over there ?

Not that I can remember, dealt with donkers and one or two selwyn Rakaia vets had a deal with.

trixi2011

C0N0R wrote: »

Not that I can remember, dealt with donkers and one or two selwyn Rakaia vets had a deal with.

we used farm right and a lad called terry hughs highly intelligent lads and if you stuck to there advice you wouldn't go to far wrong

freedominacup

trixi2011 wrote: »

we used farm right and a lad called terry hughs highly intelligent lads and if you stuck to there advice you wouldn't go to far wrong

I had one particular outfit in the yard around a month ago. They obviously didn't like the questions. Took silage, wholecrop and herbage samples were going to do the divil and all to increase my profitably haven't seen sign or light of them since.

Greengrass1

freedominacup wrote: »

I had one particular outfit in the yard around a month ago. They obviously didn't like the questions. Took silage, wholecrop and herbage samples were going to do the divil and all to increase my profitably haven't seen sign or light of them since.

We had a boyo here last autumn.
everything we were doing was wrong and we'd fail without him our reseeds are very 'lacklustre' and we shouldn't be reseeding until we have our indexes up

trixi2011

freedominacup wrote: »

I had one particular outfit in the yard around a month ago. They obviously didn't like the questions. Took silage, wholecrop and herbage samples were going to do the divil and all to increase my profitably haven't seen sign or light of them since.

sounds like a bit of a cowboy, guys I worked with in nz you had to have everything ready for them silage tests, soil tests milk production etc. would not work with you if you weren't properly prepared

Dawggone

freedominacup wrote: »

How much peer reviewed research with direct relevance to day to day management at farm level is generated every year dawg. In this country it's next to nothing. Nice little report in the rag this week about a study on tmr vs feed to yield. Presented as valid proven research, no mention of where published. Just here it is lads. Little footnote at the end of the article to tell us what great lads the two researchers were.


Independent is very hard to find even when peer reviewed. Sister was doing a bit of genetic research a few years ago. She was extremely pissed off when just after the start of the third year of a three year project it was knocked on the head. Preliminary results weren't suiting certain large players in the industry is all she could surmise. Each sample was just a number to her but others knew the provenance of the material and very few were landing on the right side of the line.

I remember reading an article/interview years ago with a top researcher/lecturer in the US. He reckoned top farmers were years ahead of the research on dairy husbandry probably not as relevant with cereals where much of the advances have to come from a lab initially whether it be disease resistance/treatment or developing seed varieties.

Good points all. When I'm talking on Agri advisors it would be tillage...
Lots more research available for tillage but as Blackgrass says below you must know the slant that it's coming from.
TBH tillage is my main interest and main business...dairy to me is basically nutrition and animal husbandry...I know that's an oversimplification.
As regards day to day running of the farm, that's business which is a completely different discipline.

Dawggone

Blackgrass wrote: »

Biggest problem with research is who pays, and what 'view' they want projected from this research.
My better half is involved in research also based on Ag chems.
Case in point is the 'Anti's' and Triazole chems under the endocrine disruptors directive. The trade blowing back about yellow rusts and it's evolving resistance on a bush up the Himalaya's producing new races even more virulent than ever before(eg. Warrior race) and how this could wipe 25% off Uk yield and even more in Dawgs part of the world. Nowt motivates politicians than the threat of masses of hungry angry people... Now discount the fact the world is awash with wheat but don't let that get in the way of a story .
Farms in the area have a system of on farm trials we do between ourselves, same thing over 4/5 farms out of 20. We have an independant agronomist who does most the work not much really just look in every so often with a group decision made on ideal timings. Works for us as most Uk crop research eg, fert is sponsored by Yara, Hgca by chem companies and some tarrif and only Niab Tag truely free but that's paid subscription.

You might not like Teagasc but i'd rather pay alot of money there and get truely uninfluenced data out than someones prefered outcome, and if you disagree don't by so naive what researcher bites the hand that feeds them.

Thanks. Excellent post.

freedominacup

trixi2011 wrote: »

sounds like a bit of a cowboy, guys I worked with in nz you had to have everything ready for them silage tests, soil tests milk production etc. would not work with you if you weren't properly prepared

Cowboy your words not mine lol. International outfit.

stretch film

freedominacup wrote: »

Cowboy your words not mine lol. International outfit.

Not without products of their own to sell ?

freedominacup

stretch film wrote: »

Not without products of their own to sell ?

Only as a happy accident. Their main goal in life, what gets them out of bed in the morning is helping poor fools like me make it to the end of the week.

conor t

freedominacup wrote: »

How much peer reviewed research with direct relevance to day to day management at farm level is generated every year dawg. In this country it's next to nothing. Nice little report in the rag this week about a study on tmr vs feed to yield. Presented as valid proven research, no mention of where published. Just here it is lads. Little footnote at the end of the article to tell us what great lads the two researchers were.

How long did the trial last, never saw one that went on for more than 2-3 months so hard to really know which is better

tommy5678

hi i am sending away my application form for a herd number and flock number tomorrow will i be too late for grants this year. when is the deadline for grants and how long till i have a herd number.

ihatewinter

National Reserve closes tomorrow and Young Farmers Scheme is 15th May. You're leaving things fierce late, these schemes have been opened since the start of January

Herd number could take between 4-6 weeks, mine took 8 weeks 2 years ago

tommy5678

is the youg farmer thing worth much with 20 acres no hope of getting in to the other one is there