Dealing with estate agent

the3rdman

Looking for advice from people who have dealt with estate agents.

I placed a bid on a property almost 5 weeks ago. Since that time I have heard nothing. I assume they are waiting to see if they have other interest in the property before getting back to me. I don't want to ring the estate agent as I don't want to appear to be too eager. But do they have any obligation to get back to me? If someone provides a higher bid and the sellers are happy with it could it be sold without estate agent contacting me?

And also if they did contact me saying they have a higher bid, how would I know they did in fact have another bid and were not just lying?

seamus

the3rdman wrote: »

I placed a bid on a property almost 5 weeks ago. Since that time I have heard nothing. I assume they are waiting to see if they have other interest in the property before getting back to me. I don't want to ring the estate agent as I don't want to appear to be too eager.

"Too eager" would be ringing 5 hours after placing a bid, not 5 weeks. Ring them today. If they don't have any other offers on the property, reiterate your offer and tell them it's good till Friday.

But do they have any obligation to get back to me? If someone provides a higher bid and the sellers are happy with it could it be sold without estate agent contacting me?

No, they have no obligation to come back to you, and yes the seller could just accept another offer without anyone telling you about it.

And also if they did contact me saying they have a higher bid, how would I know they did in fact have another bid and were not just lying?

You wouldn't.

seamusk84

My advice is simple - Anytime you place a bid tell the estate agent the bid expires after a certain time.

In this case I would call up the agent and say the bid ends Wednesday at 5:30. This is the only way to progress things and don't be afraid of doing it. You can always bid again, 5 weeks is mad.

Cathmandooo

seamusk84 wrote: »

My advice is simple - Anytime you place a bid tell the estate agent the bid expires after a certain time.

In this case I would call up the agent and say the bid ends Wednesday at 5:30. This is the only way to progress things and don't be afraid of doing it. You can always bid again, 5 weeks is mad.

What happens when Thursday comes and the agent and their client hasn't accepted the op's offer? All well and good if the op is willing to actually walk away at that stage but they'll lose credibility if they come back to say their offer is still on the table after the expiration.


the3rdman I'd put a call in today, you won't sound too keen after 5 weeks, that's a long time to be kept in the dark. Ask them if they plan on leaving it on the market for a while or will they wrap it up at some stage soon.

seamus

Cathmandooo wrote: »

What happens when Thursday comes and the agent and their client hasn't accepted the op's offer? All well and good if the op is willing to actually walk away at that stage but they'll lose credibility if they come back to say their offer is still on the table after the expiration.

Yep. If you put a time limit on your offer but come back again and make an offer afterwards the EA will chalk you down as a Walter Mitty and might even start avoiding your phone calls.

The purpose of putting a time limit on your offer is to force the EA and the vendor to make a decision because your money is going to walk away if they don't.

It also only works if you're the only bidder. If there are multiple bidders, they'll just go with someone else rather than pander to your demands - unless you offer way over asking in order to just knock everyone else out and secure it.

BailMeOut

EA's IMO are very badly organized and most I have dealt with have very primitive methods of tracking who offered what and when so good chance they have just forgotten about you. Was the offer in writing or just over phone?

jmaralv

Hi guys,

I'm in more or less the same situation. I placed an offer and they told me "the vendor was happy enough and needed confirmation from the bank and the building society" a few days after that they said "the bank was ok unofficially and they needed to approve officially in a meetign with the board"... at this stage all seemed a bit odd for a 2 bedroom apartment, too much hassle, board? building society? Anyways latest communication from the EA was this could take a week and they were waiting to contact me and arrange all the deposit and blah, blah, blah.

Surprisingly, yesterday, almost a week after, they called me saying a new party came into play and they've offered 1k above us (we're a bit under asking price). I think that's not true and the only thing they want is us to increase the offer... Is that even legal?

I'm pretty pissed off at the moment... I've, of course, withdrawn my offer and we'll wait at least until next week to contact them again, but we really love that place. Any suggestion guys?

Thanks!

spaceHopper

jmaralv wrote: »

Hi guys,

I'm in more or less the same situation. I placed an offer and they told me "the vendor was happy enough and needed confirmation from the bank and the building society" a few days after that they said "the bank was ok unofficially and they needed to approve officially in a meetign with the board"... at this stage all seemed a bit odd for a 2 bedroom apartment, too much hassle, board? building society? Anyways latest communication from the EA was this could take a week and they were waiting to contact me and arrange all the deposit and blah, blah, blah.

Surprisingly, yesterday, almost a week after, they called me saying a new party came into play and they've offered 1k above us (we're a bit under asking price). I think that's not true and the only thing they want is us to increase the offer... Is that even legal?

I'm pretty pissed off at the moment... I've, of course, withdrawn my offer and we'll wait at least until next week to contact them again, but we really love that place. Any suggestion guys?

Thanks!

Tell the ea you don't want to hang around and suggest sealed final bidds in an envelope.

seamus

jmaralv wrote: »

I'm in more or less the same situation. I placed an offer and they told me "the vendor was happy enough and needed confirmation from the bank and the building society" a few days after that they said "the bank was ok unofficially and they needed to approve officially in a meetign with the board"... at this stage all seemed a bit odd for a 2 bedroom apartment, too much hassle, board? building society? Anyways latest communication from the EA was this could take a week and they were waiting to contact me and arrange all the deposit and blah, blah, blah.

Sounds to me like they're selling in negative equity, so they need the bank to agree that they're OK to go ahead and accept the price offered. In the case of a building society it may be the case that all such sales require the approval of the board.

Surprisingly, yesterday, almost a week after, they called me saying a new party came into play and they've offered 1k above us (we're a bit under asking price). I think that's not true and the only thing they want is us to increase the offer... Is that even legal?

It's not specifically illegal. In theory one could do the EA for fraud, but you would have to prove that the other offer didn't exist. In the absence of any formal offer register, it would be impossible to prove that someone didn't ring up and make an offer.

I'm pretty pissed off at the moment... I've, of course, withdrawn my offer and we'll wait at least until next week to contact them again, but we really love that place. Any suggestion guys?

I think this happens to everyone at some stage. I guess you need to learn not to fall in love with a property until contracts are signed

If you think they're trying to extract more cash from you and you're not willing to go higher, then I'd tell the EA you're out. If you're ready move now, I'd make sure the EA is aware of that - the other buyer might still yet have to apply for approval, sell their own place, etc. So for the sake of €1k the vendor would be silly to let a buyer walk away who was ready to buy tomorrow.

BeatNikDub

Banks can take WEEKS to accept bids. They do go to boards and even if the EA rings every day they will also be fobbed off until they get reply to say sale can go ahead.
In that time they will take further bids as the property is still on the market.
This happens for house or apartment and is indeed very frustrating for all parties for these kind of sales.
Put your own time limit on it and if it is too much walk away and move on. Unfortunately the EA can do nothing to speed it up when banks are involved.

handlemaster

OP just call the agent say whats the story you have seen another property and your interested in following it if this property is gone

chikatee

Oh god, I can't believe the EA isn't obliged to ring you back to keep you informed after you put in a bid. We put a bid on a house 2 weeks ago tomorrow and we still haven't heard anything back. I presumed that we eventually would hear if a) if was accepted b) it was refused or c) the party that had bid before us had upped their bid. This obviously isn't the case. What should we do?

jmaralv

We've finally been accepted but I'm still convinced this whole procedure is shady.

OP what I finally did was to send my offer (in writing) and tell the it will expire on Friday COB and told them we can't go up (already above asking price though), magically the phoned me back friday 4:15pm saying "our offer was accepted".

IMHO If they don't even think the offer is worth it I'm sure they won't tell the vendor anything, they'll keep showing the property waiting for a better offer and they'll start with that 3rd party uppering offers by 1k (I'm convinced there wasn't anyone offering), anyway, we're going to pay below our cap so I'm happy enough.

Good luck!

BeatNikDub

chikatee wrote: »

Oh god, I can't believe the EA isn't obliged to ring you back to keep you informed after you put in a bid. We put a bid on a house 2 weeks ago tomorrow and we still haven't heard anything back. I presumed that we eventually would hear if a) if was accepted b) it was refused or c) the party that had bid before us had upped their bid. This obviously isn't the case. What should we do?

They should do chikatee. If there is radio silence it generally means there is nothing much to tell you but they should at least come back to say if the vendor shut it down completely. Then, all further bids you will be made aware of until you advise you are out.
The obligation for the EA is with the vendor in informing them of all bids.
However all EA's have to record bids by law now so they should really be on top of all this!
A follow up your end may be the only way but a bid can sit there for a long time with no update if a vendor doesn't accept it and is happy to hang on till something better comes along!
Hope this helps

Grumpypants

In the same boat and it seems crazy anyone employs them to sell their house They just don't seem to care.

Called one with very specific requests, we want x type of house, at x price in x location, please email info on these 3 links from the 10 you have on daft. Heard nothing. Rang and they made out they were doing me a favour showing me one of the houses. never viewed any more from them.

Put a bid in on a house 5 weeks ago the house has been on the market for over 2 years so you would think they would want to move it. I rang back a week later he actually said "oh yeah I meant to ring that guy I'll try calling him now". 3 weeks later still calling he hasn't even spoken to the owner. Again any house with that company has been blacklisted by us.

Trying to put in a bid on a different house now, called last week twice left messages with Secretary as he was out of office. Told her we have the asking price are ready to buy and just want ten mins in the house to see the inside properly yet they can't get it organized. Not even gotten a courtesy call back.

They seem to have an attitude that once it's on there books it will eventually sell and they don't care if it takes 6 weeks or 2 years.

Ten mins of work by any of the three estate agents would have had a sale.

cpoh1

Grumpypants wrote: »

In the same boat and it seems crazy anyone employs them to sell their house They just don't seem to care.

Called one with very specific requests, we want x type of house, at x price in x location, please email info on these 3 links from the 10 you have on daft. Heard nothing. Rang and they made out they were doing me a favour showing me one of the houses. never viewed any more from them.

Put a bid in on a house 5 weeks ago the house has been on the market for over 2 years so you would think they would want to move it. I rang back a week later he actually said "oh yeah I meant to ring that guy I'll try calling him now". 3 weeks later still calling he hasn't even spoken to the owner. Again any house with that company has been blacklisted by us.

Trying to put in a bid on a different house now, called last week twice left messages with Secretary as he was out of office. Told her we have the asking price are ready to buy and just want ten mins in the house to see the inside properly yet they can't get it organized. Not even gotten a courtesy call back.

They seem to have an attitude that once it's on there books it will eventually sell and they don't care if it takes 6 weeks or 2 years.

Ten mins of work by any of the three estate agents would have had a sale.

You are missing the bigger picture here, those houses may actually not really be for sale and it has nothing to do with the estate agent.

cerastes

seamus wrote: »

Yep. If you put a time limit on your offer but come back again and make an offer afterwards the EA will chalk you down as a Walter Mitty and might even start avoiding your phone calls.

The purpose of putting a time limit on your offer is to force the EA and the vendor to make a decision because your money is going to walk away if they don't.

It also only works if you're the only bidder. If there are multiple bidders, they'll just go with someone else rather than pander to your demands - unless you offer way over asking in order to just knock everyone else out and secure it.

BeatNikDub wrote: »

They should do chikatee. If there is radio silence it generally means there is nothing much to tell you but they should at least come back to say if the vendor shut it down completely. Then, all further bids you will be made aware of until you advise you are out.
The obligation for the EA is with the vendor in informing them of all bids.
However all EA's have to record bids by law now so they should really be on top of all this!
A follow up your end may be the only way but a bid can sit there for a long time with no update if a vendor doesn't accept it and is happy to hang on till something better comes along!
Hope this helps

With people considering they are being dicked around, why dont buyers send a letter to the owner at the address or even look them up and post them a letter with their name on it expressing their interest and that if the house is being sold to ask them to get back onto the agent as the buyer although interested would like to move on to another property and will have to if they dont hear anything back from the agent?

Also, what information do agents have to have regarding bids and what do they have to supply the vendor?
How is this investigated if its reported? does the investigation go back as far as to follow up the other potential bidders and ask them if they really made a bid? and if none of the people can be located, is this construed as made up names on a list?

seamus

cerastes wrote: »

Also, what information do agents have to have regarding bids and what do they have to supply the vendor?
How is this investigated if its reported? does the investigation go back as far as to follow up the other potential bidders and ask them if they really made a bid? and if none of the people can be located, is this construed as made up names on a list?

So, the PSRA regulate estate agents, but at the moment it's a voluntary agreement. Where they've voluntarily signed up to the code, they're bound by it.
http://www.psr.ie/website/npsra/npsraweb.nsf/page/publications-codes-en

http://www.psr.ie/website/npsra/npsraweb.nsf/0/B86586662416AA6380257CDF004322A2/$File/Code%20of%20Practice.pdf

For offers in particular:

A Property Services Provider shall report all offers to clients including any details provided by potential customers in relation to:
• the availability of finance to the potential customer,
• the level of borrowing, if any, of the potential customer,
• whether the offer is contingent on the sale by the potential customer of another
property,
• whether the potential customer has had a satisfactory survey of the property
carried out, and
• the suitability to the client of the proposed closing date

......

1.9: Record of Offers
In sales, other than by auction, Property Services Providers shall maintain a record of all offers made for property, including the identity of the person/representative making the offer, the level of the offer and any conditions attached.
Conditional acceptance of such offers shall be recorded by Property Services Providers, but in a format that does not create a Memorandum of Understanding for the purpose of the Statute of Frauds.
Records of offers shall be retained for a period of at least six years from the date of their creation and shall be made available for inspection by the Disciplinary Board

So, in theory, all offers should be formally recorded and available for inspection by the PSRA up to six years after the date. In practice, if you ring up and make the offer, you have no idea if your offer has been recorded. If you are told that there's already an offer of X on a property, you have no idea if that offer actually exists. And the only way to find out is to make a complaint to the PSRA.

So at the very least if you are making an offer on a property, make a phone call and follow it up with an email. Without any kind of paper trail, you have no grounds for a complaint.

The PSRA is a step in the right direction, but it's still operating on a bit of an honour system.
In reality they should be providing a web portal for managing these things - estate agents are required to log all offers via this portal, including the contact details of the person who made the offer. The PSRA can then pick people at random to do quality checks and monitor things like IP addresses and phone numbers to try and catch out suspect bids.

Buyers, for their part, could cut out the middleman and review the bidding history on a property for themselves (a bit like ebay) - minus the personal details of the bidders, of course. That way they could verify themselves that their bid has been recorded, and make sure that an agent isn't telling porkies when they're asked what the current bid is.

Obviously you could also add in other things then like allowing people to bid directly themselves without the EA, getting automatic notifications when their bid has been overridden, etc.

cerastes

That sounds good, but the honour system just undoes all that really, almost no point in having it if its not compulsory.

the3rdman

Thanks for the advice. I have decided to forget about this property. I know the EA is there to work for the seller but in my case it was the EA's antics which put me off. They were rude, unprofessional, unwilling to answer any questions regarding the property. I also found it a bit suspect that after 5 weeks of silence from them, when I did contact them they got back to me to say they just had a higher bid. And days later another further bid.

seamus

If you think it's suspicious, might be no harm sticking in a complaint with the PSRA.

http://www.psr.ie/website/npsra/npsraweb.nsf/page/whatwedo-investigation-en

Schecter01

They are the biggest waste of time

Minister Boyce

Apologies for hijacking the thread - but is it mandatory to sign the standard PSRA Agreements?

Am trading up at the moment, sold our home, buying another. Have received 2 x of these agreements: - One from my own EA who handled our sale and one from the EA dealing with the property we are now buying.

Is it appropriate to sign these? In particular, should we sign the Agreement with the EA in charge of the property we are buying as are not and have not been a client of theirs?

Minister Boyce

Bump ⬆️⬆️⬆️

Any advice on the above query would be appreciated

rathmoresham

I viewed a house today. It's been on the market 2weeks. Today was the 2nd open viewing. No bids on the house. €270k asking. I offered €260k. EA barely acknowledged it and tried rushing me out the door saying that it'll go for near €300k. I demanded that she put the offer to the vendor. She questioned if I had mortgage approval and stated that I needed to email them my mortgage approval details before I could make an offer and the offer had to be done by phone.. On how many levels was this experience wrong???

ABajaninCork

rathmoresham wrote: »

I viewed a house today. It's been on the market 2weeks. Today was the 2nd open viewing. No bids on the house. €270k asking. I offered €260k. EA barely acknowledged it and tried rushing me out the door saying that it'll go for near €300k. I demanded that she put the offer to the vendor. She questioned if I had mortgage approval and stated that I needed to email them my mortgage approval details before I could make an offer and the offer had to be done by phone.. On how many levels was this experience wrong???

None. The EA works for the vendor, not you. The house was only on the market two weeks. It's normal for the EA to ask to see your approval before putting the offer to the vendor. It proves you a) have the finances in place; and b) you are a serious bidder. In this case, they are very probably looking for other bids.

As others have said on this thread. If you want the house, you could try approaching the vendor direct and put the offer in writing to them.

L1011

Do not give the EA your mortgage approval details under any circumstances. If required get a letter street from the bank stating you are approved to cover the bid in question with zero numbers on it.

ABajaninCork

L1011 wrote: »

Do not give the EA your mortgage approval details under any circumstances. If required get a letter street from the bank stating you are approved to cover the bid in question with zero numbers on it.

This is true. It's what I meant to say earlier, but it was very late (or early!!).

Unearthly

I would never show an estate agent my mortgage approval details.

It would be like revealing your cards in a game of poker