Difficulty setting my marathon pace

averagejoe123

Hi,

I am looking for a bit of advice on what pace to set out in for my 1st marathon. This is the Tralee marathon on 15 March 2015.

I have been following Pfitzingers 18/55 plan and have not had any issues hitting distances and paces but have been using a range of paces for my PMPs. These started off at 8 minute miles and are around 7.35s at present.

My current PBs are
5k- 19.47- January 15
10km- 41.57 December 14
HM- 1.37.40 November 14

Each of the above give me a Mcmillan range from to 3.13 off my most recent 5k time to 3.25 off my older HM time. I feel that a 1.34 HM would be within my current ability. There is a 10miler on this weekend I could do.

1. Would it be worth my while interrupting the plan to do the 10 miler to gauge current fitness levels?

2. Given that it is my first marathon should I just ere on the side of caution and go out with the 3.30 pacers?

3. How long into their training would people usually leave it to set their pace?

Many Thanks

Joe

average_runner

averagejoe123 wrote: »

Hi,

I am looking for a bit of advice on what pace to set out in for my 1st marathon. This is the Tralee marathon on 15 March 2015.

I have been following Pfitzingers 18/55 plan and have not had any issues hitting distances and paces but have been using a range of paces for my PMPs. These started off at 8 minute miles and are around 7.35s at present.

My current PBs are
5k- 19.47- January 15
10km- 41.57 December 14
HM- 1.37.40 November 14

Each of the above give me a Mcmillan range from to 3.13 off my most recent 5k time to 3.25 off my older HM time. I feel that a 1.34 HM would be within my current ability. There is a 10miler on this weekend I could do.

1. Would it be worth my while interrupting the plan to do the 10 miler to gauge current fitness levels?

2. Given that it is my first marathon should I just ere on the side of caution and go out with the 3.30 pacers?

3. How long into their training would people usually leave it to set their pace?

Many Thanks

Joe

Going by your half your looking at 3:30 for your marathon. Your 5k time will suggest 3:30/3:25 also, but as far as i remember, tralee is hilly so have to be careful there also.

TFBubendorfer

Your race times are getting worse with longer distance, which is fairly common but shows that you should probably err on the side of caution regarding you planned marathon target.

Assuming your training is going well you should be able to break 3:30 in Tralee but there is no way you are in shape to run 3:13 at the moment.

A 10 miler 6 weeks before a marathon sounds good to me but make sure you take it easy for a few days afterwards in order to recover.


Btw, 7:35 is not your present marathon race pace. Sorry. Better back off a bit in training.

bonaparte2

If it's your first then I would advise to err on the side of caution . Get to twenty miles and see how you feel then on the day itself.
You will learn a massive amount on your first day out . Try to have a positive experience. If you blow up or crash it could turn you right off the event.
. Read the dcm 2014 thread or any number of training blogs for war stories of how things can go wrong.
I was just sub4 on my first. Sub3 now in case you weren't going to ask!
3.30 is a fine target, beat it if you can but change down a gear if it's not there on the day and take your PB.

menoscemo

TFBubendorfer wrote: »

Your race times are getting worse with longer distance, which is fairly common but shows that you should probably err on the side of caution regarding you planned marathon target.

Assuming your training is going well you should be able to break 3:30 in Tralee but there is no way you are in shape to run 3:13 at the moment.

A 10 miler 6 weeks before a marathon sounds good to me but make sure you take it easy for a few days afterwards in order to recover.


Btw, 7:35 is not your present marathon race pace. Sorry. Better back off a bit in training.

+1 especially on the point about running 7:35s as MP at the moment. Good to have a bit of a buffer but 7;50-7:55 would be good to run as MP. Based on the 5k time, your half should be a lot closer to 1:30 than 1:40 so endurance is certainly an issue. That said the P&D programme should definitely give the endurance a boost.

3:30 is a really good 1st Marathon time.

averagejoe123

TFBubendorfer wrote: »

Your race times are getting worse with longer distance, which is fairly common but shows that you should probably err on the side of caution regarding you planned marathon target.

Assuming your training is going well you should be able to break 3:30 in Tralee but there is no way you are in shape to run 3:13 at the moment.

A 10 miler 6 weeks before a marathon sounds good to me but make sure you take it easy for a few days afterwards in order to recover.


Btw, 7:35 is not your present marathon race pace. Sorry. Better back off a bit in training.

I know a 3.13 would be out of the question all right. Training has gone well but I suppose I get carried away easily. I have seen a lot of improvement but the last thing I want is a DNF from my 1st marathon.
I have 3 20 mile runs done with the most being last weeks 10 @ 9 minute miles followed by 10 @ 7.35. The hardest part of this was to settle into the 7.35 pace but after the 1st mile it was fine.

The general consensus seems to be to chill my beans so I think i'll do that and do the rest of my PMPs at 7.50-8.

Cheers

ger664

Agree with the others here. Its your first Marathon so Endurance is where your weakness lies. 3:30 8 Min/Pace is probably where you are at with plenty of room for improvement on your next marathon training cycle.

TFBubendorfer wrote: »

A 10 miler 6 weeks before a marathon sounds good to me but make sure you take it easy for a few days afterwards in order to recover.

From memory (because i will never forget this part of the plan) the P&D plan has a 9-15K tune up race followed by a 16/17 Mile long run the following day 6 weeks out.

averagejoe123

ger664 wrote: »

Agree with the others here. Its your first Marathon so Endurance is where your weakness lies. 3:30 8 Min/Pace is probably where you are at with plenty of room for improvement on your next marathon training cycle.



From memory (because i will never forget this part of the plan) the P&D plan has a 9-15K tune up race followed by a 16/17 Mile long run the following day 6 weeks out.

Ye that’s the plan for this weekend all right. This is where the difficulty lies for me as I haven’t races over 10k in nearly 2 months.

What I’m thinking of doing is either A. to do a parkrun + 5 miles at a decent effort on Saturday followed by the 17 miler on Sunday, or

B. Take a rest day Saturday, Race the 10 miler on Sunday and do the 17 miler on Monday @ 9.30 miles.

Whilst I would like to do the 10 miles on Sunday I feel option A might make most sense. Views?

ger664

Last Year I did Dungarvan 10 on Sunday Morning and 16 miles Late on Monday Evening. It was hard on the Monday but it stood to me big time 4 weeks later. My advice is do option B but forget about pace. Only go as fast as your legs will let you go. Do a loop of 3-4 miles that way if its too much you can bailout early.

averagejoe123

ger664 wrote: »

Last Year I did Dungarvan 10 on Sunday Morning and 16 miles Late on Monday Evening. It was hard on the Monday but it stood to me big time 4 weeks later. My advice is do option B but forget about pace. Only go as fast as your legs will let you go. Do a loop of 3-4 miles that way if its too much you can bailout early.

Looks like im off to Trim so. Cheers for the advice, very much appreciated.

averagejoe123

Just to finish out the thread I ran 68.59 for the 10mile in Trim and 3.27 for the Tralee Marathon. I ran a 1 minute negative split in the marathon and ran within my capabilities. Now that I have the first one done and enjoyed every step I think I will be slightly more agressive with future goals.

For anyone attempting their first marathon I would definitely recommend starting out at the slower end of your marathon pace range and picking it up towards the end if you can.

Recovery has gone well, looking to bring down the shorter PBs before starting training for DCM2015.

menoscemo

averagejoe123 wrote: »

Just to finish out the thread I ran 68.59 for the 10mile in Trim and 3.27 for the Tralee Marathon. I ran a 1 minute negative split in the marathon and ran within my capabilities. Now that I have the first one done and enjoyed every step I think I will be slightly more agressive with future goals.

For anyone attempting their first marathon I would definitely recommend starting out at the slower end of your marathon pace range and picking it up towards the end if you can.

Recovery has gone well, looking to bring down the shorter PBs before starting training for DCM2015.

Great result averagejoe and glad to hear you took the advice on board and everything went well.

Based on the 10 mile time you'll be targeting a sub 90 half soon enough?

averagejoe123

menoscemo wrote: »

Great result averagejoe and glad to hear you took the advice on board and everything went well.

Based on the 10 mile time you'll be targeting a sub 90 half soon enough?

That's the plan all right, 2015 goals are to get a sub;
19 5k
40 10k and
90 half

Going to do my first parkrun since the marathon tomorrow to see where I'm at before starting an 8 week 10k plan on Monday. Not expecting a PB or anything but will be running it on relatively fresh legs so will give a good starting point before the new plan.

After doing the vast majority of my marathon training on cold, wet, dark roads I am very much looking forward to doing a few quality sessions under whatever sun is thrown at us over the next few months.

Loving my running at the moment and I very much doubt this would be the case if I had a bad experience with the marathon. I think these positive memories will go a long way in maintaining motivation and desire to becoming a better runner.....very deep stuff for a Friday afternoon!

JohnDozer

averagejoe123 wrote:

before starting an 8 week 10k plan on

Which 10k plan are you gonna follow? Looking for something to do after Limerick! Great results too by the way

averagejoe123

JohnDozer wrote: »

Which 10k plan are you gonna follow? Looking for something to do after Limerick! Great results too by the way

I'm going to follow the Hal Higdon advanced 10k plan. Looks pretty light on miles so I will be adding in a few additional easy miles here and there.

http://www.halhigdon.com/training/51124/10-K-Training-Guide-Advanced-Program

Good luck in Limerick, happy tapering!