Long Work Hours

Value Hunter

Just curious if anyone can shed some light onto how employers get around the 48 hour legal working week?

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/employment/employment_rights_and_conditions/hours_of_work/working_week.html

I know it's taken as an average, but some roles such as junior doctors and finance professionals seem to work 60 - 70 hours per week year round.

I know of particular jobs in finance which are 14 hours per day five days a week.

professore

The law only states you can't be forced to work more than 48 hours in a week, not that you are forbidden from working it. As long as you agree, there's no problem.

Value Hunter

professore wrote: »

The law only states you can't be forced to work more than 48 hours in a week, not that you are forbidden from working it. As long as you agree, there's no problem.

Thanks for that,

Any idea if hours of work in contracts can be made out for longer than 48 hours?

i.e if a company says in your contract your hours are 7am to 9pm, I assume signing is given your agreement?

Opens up more areas, like do you get blackballed if you refuse to work unpaid overtime? Do people who refuse 'Not make it through' a training program?

King George VI

Value Hunter wrote: »

Opens up more areas, like do you get blackballed if you refuse to work unpaid overtime? Do people who refuse 'Not make it through' a training program?

Unpaid overtime? I'd have thought that was illegal.

In my old job they told us not to stay a minute later than we were rostered because we wouldn't be paid for it. If we did have to stay because we were stuck on a call (IT support) then we'd claim that as time in lieu.

professore

Johnny Carson wrote: »

Unpaid overtime? I'd have thought that was illegal.

In my old job they told us not to stay a minute later than we were rostered because we wouldn't be paid for it. If we did have to stay because we were stuck on a call (IT support) then we'd claim that as time in lieu.

Unpaid overtime is common in salaried jobs.

professore

Value Hunter wrote: »

Thanks for that,

Any idea if hours of work in contracts can be made out for longer than 48 hours?

i.e if a company says in your contract your hours are 7am to 9pm, I assume signing is given your agreement?

Yes, but you can still refuse to work more than 48 hours.

Value Hunter wrote: »

Opens up more areas, like do you get blackballed if you refuse to work unpaid overtime? Do people who refuse 'Not make it through' a training program?

Absolutely ... Unless in public sector or unionised private sector, where you can go to your union

jelem

the system "hides" and protects the employer - employment tribunals are many years and court to enforce unless you
protected by union - screw the employer down to the last word of last page of contract and they will still try.
one of my ex employers stated " i was breaking my contract by not accepting His NEW (employment law solicitor stated "fundementally different contract not minor updates or changes") contract and tried by putting it in writing that i had to sign by a date fixed by him.
unless union THERE is NO protection unless YOU have 20 or 30,000 to pursue employer in court ( of which any minor lie by employer
can turn the case against you and which you will have trouble denying -
YES i have had an employer lie under oath in tribunal only to contradict himself on cross examination - nothing happen so far for that-
should be jailed.
they do not teach you at school to mistrust contracts and question all sentences as supposed employers your "supposed Peers" supposedly honest.

Stheno

jelem wrote: »

the system "hides" and protects the employer - employment tribunals are many years and court to enforce unless you
protected by union - screw the employer down to the last word of last page of contract and they will still try.
one of my ex employers stated " i was breaking my contract by not accepting His NEW (employment law solicitor stated "fundementally different contract not minor updates or changes") contract and tried by putting it in writing that i had to sign by a date fixed by him.
unless union THERE is NO protection unless YOU have 20 or 30,000 to pursue employer in court ( of which any minor lie by employer
can turn the case against you and which you will have trouble denying -
YES i have had an employer lie under oath in tribunal only to contradict himself on cross examination - nothing happen so far for that-
should be jailed.
they do not teach you at school to mistrust contracts and question all sentences as supposed employers your "supposed Peers" supposedly honest.

Not heard of NERA?

Manach

Long hours are part of some industry cultures. That it is perceived to be the done thing to put in late hours or all nights and hence be a team player. While there are of course times when some extra hours are needed, the practice has become endemic as part of project plans expecting it with the hours not recorded on timesheets. Ironically, ignoring the long term health damage, it is the very work that requires a measure of creativity from a fresh mind that suffers.

Raising this or informing bosses that such practices are not right, it definitely a CLM - career limiting move.

Mrs OBumble

professore wrote: »

The law only states you can't be forced to work more than 48 hours in a week, not that you are forbidden from working it. As long as you agree, there's no problem.

Ahh, I'm not sure that's true. Well it kind of is, in that the onus is on employers not to allow it. But just because you agree does not mean they can let you do it.

But certainly in some industries where long hours and multiple part time jobs are common, the employer-association and accountant advice is to actively monitor where staff are working, so that the overall total is not breached.

Back to the OP, hospitals "get away with it" for junior doctors because there's a specific exemption for them.

Otherwise, there are no exemption and it shouldn't be happening. If it is, complain to Workplace Relations (new name for NERA).