Cost of Travel

Jayronimo

So oil is at its lowest price in 5yrs,over 40% drop in cost since its peak price.Why is it then that fares for travel have recently risen in price.Surely we should see a reduction in travel costs?

opinions,please

Jamie2k9

Jayronimo wrote: »

So oil is at its lowest price in 5yrs,over 40% drop in cost since its peak price.Why is it then that fares for travel have recently risen in price.Surely we should see a reduction in travel costs?

opinions,please

Which mode of transport, trains fares might have something to do with the small gap of €16 million in operating costs.

I'm sire it's the same for Dublin Bus.

LXFlyer

Look at the companies' financial position, it is chronic.

Also, state funding has fallen, and there is an acceptance by government that the companies are underfunded.

Until these rectify themselves, there's not really much opportunity to cut fares.

Losty Dublin

Most public transport companies purchase their fuel several months in advance. This ensures that they aren't affected by short term market fluctuations or supply issues on the international oil markets. They also benefit from favourable rates for advance and bulk purchases which again helps to keep costs down.

Until recently falling prices hasn't come into it so the tactic of advance purchasing has worked in their favour. Similarly, it won't have an affect on the costs of running their day to day operations until whenever it is that they need to negotiate rates for new purchases of fuel.

Mrs OBumble

CityLink prices rising by 6% on average next Monday

(Non-subsidised, BTW.) http://www.citylink.ie/index.php/xmas-timetables

Victor

Jayronimo wrote: »

So oil is at its lowest price in 5yrs,over 40% drop in cost since its peak price.Why is it then that fares for travel have recently risen in price.Surely we should see a reduction in travel costs?

opinions,please

From: http://www.irishrail.ie/about-us/annual-reports

Revenue (fares, advertising, etc.) €176,954,000
Amortisation of capital grants €90,454,000
Public Service Obligation €108,559,000
Safety grants €7,709,000
Profit on sale of tangible assets €723,000
Total income (Railway Undertaking) €384,399,000

Fuel €38,997,000

Fuel as % of total income 10.1%

n97 mini

Fare prices should be coming down as fuel is hugely cheaper than it was a year ago.

end of the road wrote: »

bi-law

That's your most curious misspelling yet!

end of the road

n97 mini wrote: »

Fare prices should be coming down as fuel is hugely cheaper than it was a year ago.

yeah, the world really works like that. i don't know of any rail company who has brought down fares. depending on when and what way the oil is bought prices wouldn't be realistically passed onto the companies anyway.

n97 mini wrote: »

That's your most curious misspelling yet!

and that has what to do with rail fares and fines

n97 mini

end of the road wrote: »

yeah, the world really works like that. i don't know of any rail company who has brought down fares. depending on when and what way the oil is bought prices wouldn't be realistically passed onto the companies anyway.

Actually my usual fare was €2.50 on Leap and now it's €2.41 (the competing Dublin Bus route went from €2.50 to €2.60)

end of the road wrote: »

and that has what to do with rail fares and fines

We are discussing by-laws. Wouldn't want folks to get confused.

Hilly Bill

n97 mini wrote: »

Actually my usual fare was €2.50 on Leap and now it's €2.41 (the competing Dublin Bus route went from €2.50 to €2.60)



We are discussing by-laws. Wouldn't want folks to get confused.

spelling doesnt matter when you know whats been said anyway.

n97 mini

Yeah but don't assume. You know what they say about assume.

Hilly Bill

Hang on i'll ring dictionary corner.

end of the road

n97 mini wrote: »

Actually my usual fare was €2.50 on Leap and now it's €2.41 (the competing Dublin Bus route went from €2.50 to €2.60)

good for you.

n97 mini wrote: »

We are discussing by-laws. Wouldn't want folks to get confused.

yeah, right

end of the road

n97 mini wrote: »

Yeah but don't assume. You know what they say about assume.

you know exactly what was said. your little childish digs have no place here

n97 mini

end of the road wrote: »

the oil is bought prices wouldn't be realistically passed onto the companies anyway.

Rubbish. Of course they would, and are.

end of the road

n97 mini wrote: »

Rubbish. Of course they would, and are.

not rubbish at all if their doesn't seem to be anything to suggest as such. what are CIE doing to pass on the oil price decrease to customers. how do you even know they would or could even afford to.

n97 mini

end of the road wrote: »

not rubbish at all if their doesn't seem to be anything to suggest as such.

CIE companies buy fuel on the open market. In case you hadn't noticed (hint: filling stations) diesel prices are significantly down.

end of the road

n97 mini wrote: »

CIE companies buy fuel on the open market. In case you hadn't noticed (hint: filling stations) diesel prices are significantly down.

and? they may pre-buy in bulk for a certain length of time for all we kno. so again, that doesn't suggest how, or that they pass on the decrease to the customer

n97 mini

They don't.

end of the road

n97 mini wrote: »

They don't.

they don't what.

n97 mini

Buy fule in advance. You're talking about hedging, right, and not just filling the tanks at the start of the week?

Hilly Bill

n97 mini wrote: »

CIE companies buy fuel on the open market. In case you hadn't noticed (hint: filling stations) diesel prices are significantly down.

When was the last time you saw a train pull into a maxol garage?

"This is your driver speaking, on behalf of Irish Rail i would like to apologise for this short delay while we get some fuel. Does anyone want anything in the shop whilst im there? "

n97 mini

Hilly Bill wrote: »

When was the last time you saw a train pull into a maxol garage?

Who said anything about Maxol? Remember what I said about assume?

oppenheimer1

end of the road wrote: »

yeah, the world really works like that. i don't know of any rail company who has brought down fares. depending on when and what way the oil is bought prices wouldn't be realistically passed onto the companies anyway.



and that has what to do with rail fares and fines

Fuel might be coming down in price but IR have an army of overpaid useless staff to pay.

Losty Dublin

Hilly Bill wrote: »

When was the last time you saw a train pull into a maxol garage?
"

Never!

They use Topaz

poggyone

n97 mini wrote: »

CIE companies buy fuel on the open market. In case you hadn't noticed (hint: filling stations) diesel prices are significantly down.

They buy in bulk, the fuel used today could have been bought years ago in a long term contract at a fixed price.

end of the road

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

Fuel might be coming down in price but IR have an army of overpaid useless staff to pay.

oh yeah i agree. management certainly aren't worth what they are payed.

end of the road

poggyone wrote: »

They buy in bulk, the fuel used today could have been bought years ago in a long term contract at a fixed price.

as i suspected. thanks

Hilly Bill

n97 mini wrote: »

Who said anything about Maxol? Remember what I said about assume?

You didn't say anything about it.I had to ring dictionary corner.

n97 mini

poggyone wrote: »

They buy in bulk, the fuel used today could have been bought years ago in a long term contract at a fixed price.

Have you something to back that up? IE's annual report mentions nothing of it and seems to imply they're subject to current market prices.

Losty Dublin

n97 mini wrote: »

Have you something to back that up? IE's annual report mentions nothing of it and seems to imply they're subject to current market prices.

Most large transport companies do as well. It helps to protect them from wandering prices for budgetary reasons, it helps to protects supply chains and it offers them discounts for bulk purchasing.

L1011

Losty Dublin wrote: »

and it offers them discounts for bulk purchasing.

Discounts for bulk purchasing on refined diesel are minuscule. I've seen people convinced that they could get 20% off if they formed a groupscheme (the "pipeline card" in the UK) when its more like 2%-5%.

CIEs consumption is probably no better - actually, possibly less - than DCIs usage and the DCI rate really isn't much less than retail.

LionelNashe

MOH wrote: »

In fairness, the OP has already said they're going to pay the fine because they don't want to risk the court case

Alright, I didn't know that. I couldn't be arsed reading through the pages of posts about bulk purchasing of fuel or whatever it is that the thread has descended into.

n97 mini

LionelNashe wrote: »

Alright, I didn't know that. I couldn't be arsed reading through the pages of posts about bulk purchasing of fuel or whatever it is that the thread has descended into.

Couldn't be arsed reading, but nonetheless felt we'd benefit from your opinion. Hmmm.

LionelNashe

n97 mini wrote: »

Couldn't be arsed reading, but nonetheless felt we'd benefit from your opinion. Hmmm.

Just to be clear, I couldn't be arsed reading the last few pages of the thread because it was derailed by a couple of posters, you being one of them

Victor

Off-topic posts about the purchasing of fuel moved from here: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057361911

Moderator

oppenheimer1

end of the road wrote: »

oh yeah i agree. management certainly aren't worth what they are payed.

As well as a lot of ordinary staff too. Although management have created the conditions for low productivity to flourish.

poggyone

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

As well as a lot of ordinary staff too. Although management have created the conditions for low productivity to flourish.

You aint very knowledgeable if you think the working staff are the problem.

independent.ie/irish-news/politics/exclusive-exminister-passes-note-to-taoiseach-seeking-crony-appointment-30934975.html

This is the problem in one perfect example.
The public are been played for fools while these greedy pigs get fat.

oppenheimer1

poggyone wrote: »

You aint very knowledgeable if you think the working staff are the problem.

independent.ie/irish-news/politics/exclusive-exminister-passes-note-to-taoiseach-seeking-crony-appointment-30934975.html

This is the problem in one perfect example.
The public are been played for fools while these greedy pigs get fat.

That's got nothing to do with my comment. Nothing at all. Working staff are a problem, particularly the number of them and the amount they get paid. We don't even get a good service despite this.

Victor

poggyone wrote: »

You aint very knowledgeable if you think the working staff are the problem.

independent.ie/irish-news/politics/exclusive-exminister-passes-note-to-taoiseach-seeking-crony-appointment-30934975.html

This is the problem in one perfect example.
The public are been played for fools while these greedy pigs get fat.

For any one appointment to have an effect on fares (€0.005 x 200,000,000 passengers), they would need to be paid €1m per year, which they aren't.

On topic please.

Moderator

poggyone

Victor wrote: »

For any one appointment to have an effect on fares (€0.005 x 200,000,000 passengers), they would need to be paid €1m per year, which they aren't.

On topic please.

Moderator

Look after the penny's and the pounds look after themselves .
Do you really think she is a one off?
The whole NTA is waste of money, jobs for the boys & girls. No qualification required other than who you know.
What do the NTA do, that the department of transport cant?
Millions of euro to be saved right there.

Victor

poggyone wrote: »

What do the NTA do, that the department of transport cant?

Get on with the job and stop the endless hand-wringing.