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Why did Fianna Fail bring in upward only rent reviews?

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  • 06-01-2015 9:54pm
    #1
    jetsonx
    Registered Users Posts: 1,326 ✭✭✭


    Anybody know the rationale why Fianna Fail brought in upward-only rent reviews?


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    #2
    The_Valeyard
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,452 ✭✭✭✭The_Valeyard


    Cause they were a bunch of cnuts?


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    #3
    gizmo555
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,948 ✭✭✭gizmo555


    jetsonx wrote: »
    Anybody know the rationale why Fianna Fail brought in upward-only rent reviews?

    Where did you get the notion that they did?


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    #4
    For Forks Sake
    Registered Users Posts: 11,477 ✭✭✭✭For Forks Sake


    jetsonx wrote: »
    Anybody know the rationale why Fianna Fail brought in upward-only rent reviews?

    Being FF it was probably done for a bet.


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    #5
    Damien360
    Registered Users Posts: 6,265 ✭✭✭Damien360


    If your rental property was always going to get higher rents guaranteed throughout your investment then finance for the build and sale would be easier to get. It also pushes up the selling price of that same investment making more tax for the government.

    Who do you think was very cosy to the previous government and the current one it should be said. The bankers and the builders.

    Nama are trying to get the highest return on these failed investments. If the current government pulled the plug on upward only rents then nama's return would be a lot less.

    And so the boom to bust cycle continues and we have learned nothing.


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    #6
    Berserker
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,046 ✭✭✭Berserker


    jetsonx wrote: »
    Anybody know the rationale why Fianna Fail brought in upward-only rent reviews?

    When did they do that?


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    #7
    jetsonx
    Registered Users Posts: 1,326 ✭✭✭jetsonx


    2009


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    #8
    Wildlife Actor
    Registered Users Posts: 485 ✭✭Wildlife Actor


    Upward only rent reviews have existed for centuries. It's a private contract. Banning them is the question.


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    #9
    seamus
    Registered Users Posts: 68,317 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    jetsonx wrote: »
    Anybody know the rationale why Fianna Fail brought in upward-only rent reviews?
    They didn't?

    Upward-only rent reviews are agreements between property owners and commercial tenants that rent will be reviewed on a regular basis, but it will only ever be increased where necessary. In other words, the landlord can increase the rent if they feel like it, and the tenant cannot ask for a reduction in rent because they have signed a contract saying that the rent cannot be revised downward.

    During boom times, commercial property owners in popular urban areas held all the cards; if you wanted to trade in an area, you agreed to whatever the hell the landlord asked for. Including insane provisions whereby you can never get a rent reduction.

    When the bust came and companies had difficulty meeting the rent, landlords would rather see their property empty than change the rental agreements, and so businesses started closing right, left and centre.

    So they decided to make upwards-only rent reviews unenforceable.

    Landlords brought in upwards-only rent reviews, not FF. FF just let them happen because it was party time and they didn't want to hear anyone whinging.


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    #10
    goose2005
    Registered Users Posts: 4,798 ✭✭✭goose2005


    Because the purpose of the Irish economy is to generate wealth for the owners of land and property. The rest of us are insects.


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    #11
    oppenheimer1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,084 ✭✭✭oppenheimer1


    jetsonx wrote: »
    Anybody know the rationale why Fianna Fail brought in upward-only rent reviews?

    Where did you get the idea that Fianna Fail brought this in? There's a lot of things you can blame them for but you can't blame them for this.

    Upward only rent reviews became a thing during the boom, when landlords held the upper hand. Landlords included the clause to protect themselves from a falling market, whether that be sure to a local over supply due to say a new shopping centre opening or a collapse in the national market. Tenents were desperate for prime retail units during the boom, so they signed up freely and willingly to the conditions. If landlords had asked for their first born in exchange for a prime pitch on Grafton St, there would have been a queue of traders lining up.

    The reason that these agreements cannot be torn up is because it would be unconstitutional and set a dangerous precedent that property rights were not guaranteed. Additionally the state could be sued for loss of income by the landlords and they would win. The country would be on the hook for even more, just so the latest British chain could fleece the Irish consumer for even more.


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    #12
    jetsonx
    Registered Users Posts: 1,326 ✭✭✭jetsonx


    Well in 2009, with a change in property legislation, they had an ideal opportunity to ban retrospective rent-reviews but FF being Fianna Fail - they decided they would not ban the practice.


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    #13
    Berserker
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,046 ✭✭✭Berserker


    jetsonx wrote: »
    Well in 2009, with a change in property legislation, they had an ideal opportunity to ban retrospective rent-reviews but FF being Fianna Fail - they decided they would not ban the practice.

    As others have said, the agreements were between private landlords and tenants. It is a private agreement. The landlord proposed it and the tenant agreed. Nothing to do with FF. Such agreements have been around for a long, long time.


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    #14
    washman3
    Registered Users Posts: 3,646 ✭✭✭washman3


    The_Valeyard wrote: »
    Cause they were a bunch of cnuts?

    Plus the fact that Fine Gael/Labour would have done the exact same thing and since they have gone into power have done zilch to reverse this shameful policy. All to do with vested interests.!! Many,many TDs and senators or their friends and cronies are up to their necks in the 'property game'. Upward only means more cash for all of them. Ever take a close look at the type of clientele throwing TDs in the air at a count centre when they've just been elected.??
    The jubilation they show is that of somebody winning the lotto, and for many of these parasites it is like winning the lotto.
    Simple rule of thumb many big party politicians believe in, 'landlords vote, tenants don't.!!
    Also ever wonder why 20% of voters would still for vote for Fianna Fail..???


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    #15
    jetsonx
    Registered Users Posts: 1,326 ✭✭✭jetsonx


    washman3 wrote: »
    Ever take a close look at the type of clientele throwing TDs in the air at a count centre when they've just been elected.??

    Yes, I know the type - the grey haired men with beefy red faces.


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    #16
    seamus
    Registered Users Posts: 68,317 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    washman3 wrote: »
    Plus the fact that Fine Gael/Labour would have done the exact same thing and since they have gone into power have done zilch to reverse this shameful policy.
    Well FF eventually did ban upwards-only rent reviews in 2010.

    You can't really ban them retrospectively, not without getting yourself into a lot of difficulty. Our constitution specifically prohibits retrospective legislation. While it is possible to enact retrospective legislation in some cases, it's an absolute minefield.

    It also has implications for basic contract law. Banning future contracts from containing certain clauses is easy. But doing it retrospectively has more implications than just the thing you were trying to solve.


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    #17
    Geuze
    Registered Users Posts: 13,084 ✭✭✭✭Geuze


    jetsonx wrote: »
    Anybody know the rationale why Fianna Fail brought in upward-only rent reviews?

    I read that UORRs were introduced in the 70s.


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    #18
    Tony EH
    Registered Users Posts: 18,913 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    jetsonx wrote: »
    Anybody know the rationale why Fianna Fail brought in upward-only rent reviews?

    They didn't bring in upward only rent reviews, but they certainly never did anything to combat it, or address the appalling state of private renting in Ireland.

    I wonder, though, how many of them were landlords themselves.


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    #19
    daUbiq
    Registered Users Posts: 420 ✭✭daUbiq


    A cull of Fianna Fail and its supporters is needed.


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    #20
    Vandango
    Closed Accounts Posts: 604 ✭✭✭Vandango


    jetsonx wrote: »
    Well in 2009, with a change in property legislation, they had an ideal opportunity to ban retrospective rent-reviews but FF being Fianna Fail - they decided they would not ban the practice.

    Yet the current shower of cúnts have done nothing to amend it.


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    #21
    Godge
    Closed Accounts Posts: 21,727 ✭✭✭✭Godge


    Vandango wrote: »
    Yet the current shower of cúnts have done nothing to amend it.


    Upward-only rent reviews are banned in all new commercial leases since 28 February 2010 so I don't know what you are looking for to be done.

    It is not possible to do anything more than that - if the government changed the law to ban them for older leases, they would be sued by landlords who lost money and those landlords would get compensation from the government - how would you like that?


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