Retention

Moggaman

Hi
I got Planning in 2006 for a 2 storey house. In the original drawing i asked for a room connected to the back of the house and a balcony above that. They asked me to remove the room and balcony. I changed the drawings and got planning but when i built it i built the room at the back with the balcony..room is probably 25sq metres with a 25sq m balcony on top. Now i am looking at selling and am wondering how the retention application might be looked upon by the council..the planner involved has since retired..Also. in the event of retention being refused, can you be forced to demolish after 7 years?
Thanks

BryanF

I won't speculate on the retention outcome, it'll depend in overlooking etc. don't forget the site assessment (waste treatment) as part of the rentention application.
Planning granted in 2006 +5years duration = 2011, so you're 7years just became 4'ish


Best of luck, don't break the law in future.

Moggaman

Sorry what do you mean my 7 yrs is now 4ish?

sydthebeat

Moggaman wrote: »

Sorry what do you mean my 7 yrs is now 4ish?

He means the statute of limitations for you only starts when the original permission expires.
So for you its
2006+5+7= 2018

So you have over 3 years yet in which you can be subject to enforcement action.

sydthebeat

Moggaman wrote: »

Sorry what do you mean my 7 yrs is now 4ish?

He means the statute of limitations for you only starts when the original permission expires.
So for you its
2006+5+7= 2018

So you have over 3 years yet in which you can be subject to enforcement action.

seamus10

Hi All,

I require some advice relating to a planning issue that has arisen in relation to a property that I planning on purchasing.

My way of context: family expanding, looking at selling our semi detached house in Navan and moving to our "dream" detached house (built 1995) in Slane close to where wife is from originally.

Got a professional surveyor to perform a structural survey which showed the house is structurally fine.

Also got him to look at the planning file in the local Co Co offices. It would appear the orientation of the property on the site is different to how it is shown on the original plans (by about 45 degrees). It does not appear that there are any enforcement notices on the planning file.

Does a change in orientation required a revised planning submission/permission?

We have put down a refundable booking deposit and haven't yet signed contracts. Our solicitor has yet to received title documents and compliance certificates from Seller.

Just wondering what is the best approach here:

a) Tell estate agent of issue and request that seller applies for retention of planning on the entire property as a condition of sale (if needed, as we really like the house? we would potentially consider splitting associated costs with seller). I suspect the seller will be slow to do this in case retention application is not successful and instead will seek cover from an opinion of compliance.

b) Tell estate agent and request price agree to be reduced by (at least) the costs associated with us obtaining retention of planning at some point in the future if the opinion of compliance provided by the seller doesn't hold up.

c) Say nothing and wait to see what the seller provides by way of cert (or opinion) of planning compliance. If this passes scrutiny of solicitor for mortgage application purposes, proceed with sale.

Any advice welcome!

Many thanks in advance.

Gumbo

seamus10 wrote: »

Hi All,

I require some advice relating to a planning issue that has arisen in relation to a property that I planning on purchasing.

My way of context: family expanding, looking at selling our semi detached house in Navan and moving to our "dream" detached house (built 1995) in Slane close to where wife is from originally.

Got a professional surveyor to perform a structural survey which showed the house is structurally fine.

Also got him to look at the planning file in the local Co Co offices. It would appear the orientation of the property on the site is different to how it is shown on the original plans (by about 45 degrees). It does not appear that there are any enforcement notices on the planning file.

Does a change in orientation required a revised planning submission/permission?

We have put down a refundable booking deposit and haven't yet signed contracts. Our solicitor has yet to received title documents and compliance certificates from Seller.

Just wondering what is the best approach here:

a) Tell estate agent of issue and request that seller applies for retention of planning on the entire property as a condition of sale (if needed, as we really like the house? we would potentially consider splitting associated costs with seller). I suspect the seller will be slow to do this in case retention application is not successful and instead will seek cover from an opinion of compliance.

b) Tell estate agent and request price agree to be reduced by (at least) the costs associated with us obtaining retention of planning at some point in the future if the opinion of compliance provided by the seller doesn't hold up.

c) Say nothing and wait to see what the seller provides by way of cert (or opinion) of planning compliance. If this passes scrutiny of solicitor for mortgage application purposes, proceed with sale.

Any advice welcome!

Many thanks in advance.

It needs retention to regular use the current situation.
If the seller provides a very now it may be useless for you in the future.

But deffo ask the questions as they seller may have confirmation from the original planner at the time that ok'd the revised layout.

Don't play dumb and get it sorted before handing over your money as it becomes your problem once you move in.

seamus10

kceire wrote: »

It needs retention to regular use the current situation.
If the seller provides a very now it may be useless for you in the future.

But deffo ask the questions as they seller may have confirmation from the original planner at the time that ok'd the revised layout.

Don't play dumb and get it sorted before handing over your money as it becomes your problem once you move in.

Hi KCEIRE,

Thanks for the response.....

Would you know if we would have any comeback from the Professional who would provide cert of compliance? I. E if a professional issues a cert of compliance on a property that is not compliant surely this is negligent?

I have been told by a solicitor friend that often people don't bother reviewing planning in Co Co. Offices but just rely on the paperwork provided. ...curious as to whether or not our diligence would be considered extreme or troublesome by the seller or is it normal.

Metric Tensor

It would be normal by my reckoning. If I'm acting for a purchaser and asked to check the planning status I check the records held by the local authority.

You'd be amazed at the percentage of houses that have planning issues.

In my opinion you should take path (a) and under no circumstances offer any contribution.

If the seller mentions walking away you have to let him - more than likely he'll be back but even if he isn't you have to buy with your head, not your heart. Which, I realise is tough when you really like a house. Even if you plan to hold the house forever you'd just be making trouble for your children or to whomever you bequeath the house.

sydthebeat

the issue of orientation needs to be put into context..

is the house far in off the public road, away from view on a large site ?
is the house on the roadside on the usual 1/2 acre site and 22m building line?
is it on a corner site between two public roads?

there are differing opinions which can be formed due to the context... some might see the change as being minor depending on the context....

Angry bird

Standard practice is for the seller to seek retention application and unusual to see purchaser doing it. I see it all the time that the sale is held up until final grant on planning, as in after appeal period or indeed decision by Bord Pleanala on the appeal. 12 weeks for planning with council assuming no further information request or indeed a refusal. If appealed you can add 4 months if not more to that.

seamus10

sydthebeat wrote: »

the issue of orientation needs to be put into context..

is the house far in off the public road, away from view on a large site ?
is the house on the roadside on the usual 1/2 acre site and 22m building line?
is it on a corner site between two public roads?

there are differing opinions which can be formed due to the context... some might see the change as being minor depending on the context....

Hi Sydthebeat,

The house is not on the road side but situated about 10m from the road ditch on a 0.8 acre site. Property would not be visible from road unless drive gate open. The property overlooks fields to the front and a house was built on a neighbouring site after this house. If anything the change in orientation provided this second house with greater privacy.Entrance to site is as per planning application. Site is in the country....

One thing that was also spotted by the surveyor is that the internal layout of the house is "mirrored" compared to plans submitted.

Does this reduce the problem?