80dmd silage

Greengrass1

The aim for 2015 is to have 50t of 80-DMD silage for my winter milkers.
I'm going to set aside my 20 ac of hybrid and itailian to do this I'll be happy enough with 70+dmd for the drys
Any one able to tell me how they would go about it. I need to graze it as I'll be tight for ground on first round. But I could go 1st of Feb and have it grazed first

Milked out

Greengrass1 wrote: »

The aim for 2015 is to have 50t of 80-DMD silage for my winter milkers.
I'm going to set aside my 20 ac of hybrid and itailian to do this I'll be happy enough with 70+dmd for the drys
Any one able to tell me how they would go about it. I need to graze it as I'll be tight for ground on first round. But I could go 1st of Feb and have it grazed first

Weather permitting if you could graze it good and tight in feb and cut it the end of April or start of may, perhaps wilt with a tedder and don't leave it down too long then go for 2nd cut six weeks later? No experience of hybrids here but I think Stan mentioned it's the early cutting date which can help as much as anything else which would be my view also.

Greengrass1

Milked out wrote: »

Weather permitting if you could graze it good and tight in feb and cut it the end of April or start of may, perhaps wilt with a tedder and don't leave it down too long then go for 2nd cut six weeks later? No experience of hybrids here but I think Stan mentioned it's the early cutting date which can help as much as anything else which would be my view also.

That would be the idea 6 week silage.
Would it go to stem if left to grow from Feb to mid April?

Milked out

Greengrass1 wrote: »

That would be the idea 6 week silage.
Would it go to stem if left to grow from Feb to mid April?

I guess it would take close on a week to graze it in feb assuming weather suits so by the time the fert is out of it with slower growth for feb possibly march aswell I guess mid April would prob be as early as you could go? What are the heading dates for the hybrids? Id say you be alrite if it's similar to most grasses as it's the first week of June most varieties head out. It would be no different than a cut of march to may grass which mist would have and goin to stem isn't a problem then?

Greengrass1

Milked out wrote: »

I guess it would take close on a week to graze it in feb assuming weather suits so by the time the fert is out of it with slower growth for feb possibly march aswell I guess mid April would prob be as early as you could go? What are the heading dates for the hybrids? Id say you be alrite if it's similar to most grasses as it's the first week of June most varieties head out. It would be no different than a cut of march to may grass which mist would have and goin to stem isn't a problem then?

No idea on heading dates I presume end of may June.
Would you use the two units a day in lower growth?

Milked out

Greengrass1 wrote: »

No idea on heading dates I presume end of may June.
Would you use the two units a day in lower growth?

Might be no harm to check out the variety you have. I don't know On the 2 units as there seems to be varying opinions on it, best bet could be to test it if you were thinking of cutting which may suit ye as ye have yer own gear anyway, can go when results are in then.

Greengrass1

Milked out wrote: »

Might be no harm to check out the variety you have. I don't know On the 2 units as there seems to be varying opinions on it, best bet could be to test it if you were thinking of cutting which may suit ye as ye have yer own gear anyway, can go when results are in then.

Sounds like a plan.
I had so much about silage going around in my head I had myself confused

whelan2

sales rep was telling me the other day of a lad and his dmd was 56

Greengrass1

whelan2 wrote: »

sales rep was telling me the other day of a lad and his dmd was 56

Fcuk. How is it so bad?

whelan2

Greengrass1 wrote: »

Fcuk. How is it so bad?

dunno, he said alot of first cut came back very disappointing

Greengrass1

whelan2 wrote: »

dunno, he said alot of first cut came back very disappointing

I think were going to have to get out of the habit of taking massive cuts of silage.
Its really hard on soil imo

freedominacup

Greengrass1 wrote: »

I think were going to have to get out of the habit of taking massive cuts of silage.
Its really hard on soil imo

I was just going to post that with your own gear and esp with bales you should be aiming for 80 on all cuts. That said only managed 77 and 74 here this year. Missed a chance in first week of May and then didn't get to cut until 15th lost a half dozen points in that few days. Can't really explain the second cut picked up 6 weeks to the day after first cut. Put out 50 units initially see what growth rates are like for first three weeks and then put out balance. Never more than 80 units applied here for first cut. 80+ is the target for both cuts every year. Usually hit it.

Greengrass1

freedominacup wrote: »

I was just going to post that with your own gear and esp with bales you should be aiming for 80 on all cuts. That said only managed 77 and 74 here this year. Missed a chance in first week of May and then didn't get to cut until 15th lost a half dozen points in that few days. Can't really explain the second cut picked up 6 weeks to the day after first cut. Put out 50 units initially see what growth rates are like for first three weeks and then put out balance. Never more than 80 units applied here for first cut. 80+ is the target for both cuts every year. Usually hit it.

That's an idea. Put out enough for 3 weeks growth after first grazing and top up then?
Index 1 ground so it'll need the works.
Any need for ant more than 74 DMD for dry cows?

stanflt

Reseeded within 5 years
Grazed in spring
Cut before 5 may


And your laughing

Muckit

Very hard to tick all the boxes there stan

freedominacup

Muckit wrote: »

Very hard to tick all the boxes there stan

The planning for it starts in early January muckit. Heifers will be on whatever is being taken from outfarms asap in spring for starters.

Mad4simmental

If I let cattle out before paddys day it will have to be on a boat.

Greengrass1

I need 200t of DM of silage that will cover me for 16 wks full time for what stock I should have next winter.
28ac field is what we usually cut silage off here. Should easily get 200t off this?

Greengrass1

stanflt wrote: »

Reseeded within 5 years
Grazed in spring
Cut before 5 may


And your laughing

18ac reseeded in last two yr the other 10 around 5 yr old will have to stay there for another 2.
If I can get 80dmd next yr I'll be laughing.

Greengrass1

freedominacup wrote: »

The planning for it starts in early January muckit. Heifers will be on whatever is being taken from outfarms asap in spring for starters.

My father is telling me to hold my horses planning silahe for 15 and we have only just started feeding.
Can't help but not plan though

Bullocks

Greengrass1 wrote: »

My father is telling me to hold my horses planning silahe for 15 and we have only just started feeding.
Can't help but not plan though

He is like mine but sure when we have seen as many seasons as them we probably won't be getting too excited about planning for things that weather may scupper anyhow

mahoney_j

A lot depends on ur sr gg,ground needs to be skint in early spring and hit with slurry.ifvyour pushing sr u may have to go back and graze again in late March/early april .my advice is split ur first cut in 2 ,aim to have one lot ready to cut early/mid May and rest first of June .80 Dmd silage is not easily achieved.also 69/70 dmd is perfect for drys.also bale surpluses aggressively based on weekly growth rates and demand .trick is not to wait for crops to bulk up.cutting at 3/5 bales per acre and tedding will give quality feed.

Greengrass1

mahoney_j wrote: »

A lot depends on ur sr gg,ground needs to be skint in early spring and hit with slurry.ifvyour pushing sr u may have to go back and graze again in late March/early april .my advice is split ur first cut in 2 ,aim to have one lot ready to cut early/mid May and rest first of June .80 Dmd silage is not easily achieved.also 69/70 dmd is perfect for drys.also bale surpluses aggressively based on weekly growth rates and demand .trick is not to wait for crops to bulk up.cutting at 3/5 bales per acre and tedding will give quality feed.

Sr will definitely not be high
Not even 2 on whole platform with what cows will be here next yr.
Will be just under 3 with silahe ground out.
Yeah your right idea would be to cut that hybrid first and graze it first. No slurry but it was mucked in September and has a fair cover on it now.
Other 10 ac could be left till end of may

9935452

mahoney_j wrote: »

A lot depends on ur sr gg,ground needs to be skint in early spring and hit with slurry.ifvyour pushing sr u may have to go back and graze again in late March/early april .my advice is split ur first cut in 2 ,aim to have one lot ready to cut early/mid May and rest first of June .80 Dmd silage is not easily achieved.also 69/70 dmd is perfect for drys.also bale surpluses aggressively based on weekly growth rates and demand .trick is not to wait for crops to bulk up.cutting at 3/5 bales per acre and tedding will give quality feed.

i have to agree but most people arent willing to cut that early or have crops that light. For pit silage there is a thinking that you cant have a light crop , you need to screw the contractor by having a heavy crop.
Plus the large majority or your winter feed is your first cut , if you dont have a good first cut, you might not have enough feed for the winter.

C0N0R

If it's grazed bare in the back end ie no cover on it over winter is that sufficient? We have never been able to graze silage ground prior to closing it up, Monaghan doesn't have the same growing conditions as some of you folk!

C0N0R

9935452 wrote: »

i have to agree but most people arent willing to cut that early or have crops that light. For pit silage there is a thinking that you cant have a light crop , you need to screw the contractor by having a heavy crop.
Plus the large majority or your winter feed is your first cut , if you dont have a good first cut, you might not have enough feed for the winter.

That's the argument me and the auld boy have here, my theory is good silage can be supplemented with meal or straw cheaply where as ****e silage has to be supplemented with good quality meal. And besides if a hectare grows ten tonne a year does cutting it three or five times change that?

Timmaay

1st cut test results were very average (70 dmd), cut end of may. My dad turned around and told me that we cut it too early, should be waiting till at least 7th June!! Another reason why I give up on winter milk ha!

9935452

C0N0R wrote: »

That's the argument me and the auld boy have here, my theory is good silage can be supplemented with meal or straw cheaply where as ****e silage has to be supplemented with good quality meal. And besides if a hectare grows ten tonne a year does cutting it three or five times change that?

There is a little more to it than possibly taking 5 cuts. Economics is one. The crop would end up being so light that it could cost more than the bales are worth to bale then ie you are still going to burn the bones of a gallon an acres to mow it, turn it , rake it , bale and wrap , draw it .
Fertiliser, 6 weeks for the nitrogen to disperse. do you spread fertiliser after each cut .
Time is another one , it takes roughly the same amount of time to mow , turn , rake bale wrap and draw in silage for each cut , sometimes at that time of year you wouldnt have time to do another cut ..
That said , i agree , i would prefer to have good quality silage , cattle will thrive on it , less waste.
One thing which i cant understand either is people who cut silage with fields that are covered in rushes. You are putting fertiliser out to grow them. burning diesel to mow them, paying a man to bale and wrap them, feeding them to cattle, and then piking them out and spreading them back on the fields.
One field at home had 11 bales of hay last year and was covered in rushes, I sprayed it heavily in the spring and got a great kill, stunted the growth though, 3.5 bales this year . The father said there must have been a hell of a lot rushes in it last year,

just do it

What's the harvesting plan for such silage? Day 1 cut after mid-day, shake immediately, day 2 shake again, and day 3 row in and bale?

Greengrass1

What we did this yrs for 3rd cut was cut it Monday afternoon left in rows picked up on a Wednesday.
Ended up 72dmd 36dm. Get tempted some days to eat it.
Thus was cut in September so doubt I would have gotten higher DM?
Is there any trials done on if you loose any DMD points the longer its left cut?

mahoney_j

Feck this 80 dmd silage talk on xmas day,I've to face into 2 80 dmd xmas dinners over the next 8 hours !!!

Connemara Farmer

mahoney_j wrote: »

Feck this 80 dmd silage talk on xmas day,I've to face into 2 80 dmd xmas dinners over the next 8 hours !!!

You may need to get the agitator ready.

Greengrass1

mahoney_j wrote: »

Feck this 80 dmd silage talk on xmas day,I've to face into 2 80 dmd xmas dinners over the next 8 hours !!!

Ye unlucky fcuker it'll be hard enough eat one

mahoney_j

Connemara Farmer wrote: »

You may need to get the agitator ready.

Toilet door left open toilet seat up and ,roll of kitten soft at the ready #prepaired

Cavanjack

mahoney_j wrote: »

Feck this 80 dmd silage talk on xmas day,I've to face into 2 80 dmd xmas dinners over the next 8 hours !!!

This is the reason why we keep farming regardless if we are making money or not. We're obsessed

mahoney_j

mahoney_j wrote: »

Feck this 80 dmd silage talk on xmas day,I've to face into 2 80 dmd xmas dinners over the next 8 hours !!!

Never want to see a slice of Turkey and ham for another year.2 Michelin star standard dinners down and now I'm like a young bull on after grass!!,had dinner in both sets of grandparents so no cooking or cleaning up for me!!#stuffed

Greengrass1

mahoney_j wrote: »

Never want to see a slice of Turkey and ham for another year.2 Michelin star standard dinners down and now I'm like a young bull on after grass!!,had dinner in both sets of grandparents so no cooking or cleaning up for me!!#stuffed

Ye won't need Any soakage for beer tomorrow night.

mahoney_j

Greengrass1 wrote: »

Ye won't need Any soakage for beer tomorrow night.

Just went out to scrape down mats and throw a quick look around the sheds ,great to get a bit of cold crisp air and a bit of exercise,got the father a bottle of midleton rare when on holidays earlier in year,might help him same it.as for tomorrow ,heading to limerick to rugby then back to Nenagh for the night

billie holiday

Personally with the inconsistent weather in may I think 80 dmd will be hard and worse than that small. I am moving away from early light dark green cuts of grass full of efluent. I prefer dry bulk in the usually good first half of june. More room for spring grazing then too. Meal is cheap and convenient. In some ways. Silage spoils and heats at feed out. It's complicated but that's my current thinking anyway

Greengrass1

billie holiday wrote: »

Personally with the inconsistent weather in may I think 80 dmd will be hard and worse than that small. I am moving away from early light dark green cuts of grass full of efluent. I prefer dry bulk in the usually good first half of june. More room for spring grazing then too. Meal is cheap and convenient. In some ways. Silage spoils and heats at feed out. It's complicated but that's my current thinking anyway

Are you tedding? I'm going to pick up two days after mowing - mowed with conditioner mower. And see what it's like
This yrs silage is best we've had in a long time but its still not good enough for winter milkers. The way I see it is if cows won't milk off steamy grass mid summer how can you expect them to on steamy silage?

milkprofit

Greengrass1 wrote: »

Are you tedding? I'm going to pick up two days after mowing - mowed with conditioner mower. And see what it's like
This yrs silage is best we've had in a long time but its still not good enough for winter milkers. The way I see it is if cows won't milk off steamy grass mid summer how can you expect them to on steamy silage?

The best silage for winter milkers is- none -urn them into spring mikers problem solved

Greengrass1

milkprofit wrote: »

The best silage for winter milkers is- none -urn them into spring mikers problem solved

Haha that won't be happening here as much as I would like it to

kowtow

Greengrass1 wrote: »

Thus was cut in September so doubt I would have gotten higher DM?
Is there any trials done on if you loose any DMD points the longer its left cut?

There was an excellent trial in Germany I think, conclusion was cut and bale same day, spread out very wide after mowing (from memory), turn, fast wilt, bale with plenty of wrap.

Will try and find a link somewhere but have a feeling that DMD loss is high when left out more than 24 hours.

(Link below is not the one I was thinking of, but quite interesting on wide spread...)

http://www.dow.com/silage/stretch/research/compstudy.htm

trixi2011

kowtow wrote: »

There was an excellent trial in Germany I think, conclusion was cut and bale same day, spread out very wide after mowing (from memory), turn, fast wilt, bale with plenty of wrap.

Will try and find a link somewhere but have a feeling that DMD loss is high when left out more than 24 hours.

your right on that one kowtow read that trial/similar trial when I was in college rapid wilting they were calling it. I do think the weather would be a bit warmer in Germany tho

kowtow

Milked out wrote: »

...think Stan mentioned it's the early cutting date which can help as much as anything else which would be my view also.

according to Laidlaw D value declines by 0.25 units / day after 1st May for intermediate heading rygrass, which he equates to a reduction of 1.3kg of milk per fortnight.

Zr105

kowtow wrote: »

There was an excellent trial in Germany I think, conclusion was cut and bale same day, spread out very wide after mowing (from memory), turn, fast wilt, bale with plenty of wrap.

Will try and find a link somewhere but have a feeling that DMD loss is high when left out more than 24 hours.

(Link below is not the one I was thinking of, but quite interesting on wide spread...)

http://www.dow.com/silage/stretch/research/compstudy.htm

But with such a different weather system it can't really be equated to here with any sort of accuracy

Milked out

kowtow wrote: »

according to Laidlaw D value declines by 0.25 units / day after 1st May for intermediate heading rygrass, which he equates to a reduction of 1.3kg of milk per fortnight.

Our advisor says not to leave down longer than 24 hrs also, I think he also says p level could drop also

conor t

I think the optimum is one or two days depending on weather, milder weather would increase respiration rates reducing DM and maybe DMD due to less sugars??

billie holiday

Yeah I try and ted for 12 hours. You are right in stem mid season is not milky but accept that and I use more meal

Greengrass1

billie holiday wrote: »

Yeah I try and ted for 12 hours. You are right in stem mid season is not milky but accept that and I use more meal

I can't though. Gave milkers bales off paddock's yesterday and milk is easily up 2l per cow this am and there on 6kgs