Now Ye're Talking - to a Car Designer

Dav

This week, I'd like you all to meet enda1 who's been a Boardsie for over 10 years. He works as a car designer (for whom he'd rather not say as there are confidentiality agreements he must adhere to with his employers).

I think we take cars and other vehicles for granted at times, they're an incredibly complex cluster of machines and systems working in harmony to get us from A to B quickly, comfortably and above all else, safely. With so many factors to keep on top of, I'm sure a lot of us may not even know where to start when it comes to building one from the ground up.

So welcome enda1 to the hotseat, be sure to enjoy your spin and... you know what, I was about to go off on some cliched car puns there, but I'm sure everyone's tyred of such things

Don't forget, if you'd like to sign up to be in the AMA hotseat, you can fill out this form.

Michael D Not Higgins

What part(s) of the car do you design?

Delirium

when can we expect to see The Homer on the roads?



:P

helimachoptor

On average how long does it take a for a design to go from drawing board to sign off?

For example designing the new mondeo, how long does that take?

Are there specific external/internal designers or do you do both?

lepoatnam

I've been an avid car fan for years and often flirted with the idea of becoming a designer but alas I never did, so here are my 3 questions, where did you study, have any of your designs ever got onto the road or made it to a show in the form of a concept, are there jobs in Ireland for car designers or do you have to go to Europe/US/Japan/wherever?

enda1

Hey.

I'll get back to this tonight but to start you off with a base understanding of what I do:

-I work at and have worked at OEMs. i.e. Those whose names you see on the cars - not Tier 1, 2 etc. suppliers

-I am in engineering design not styling. Engineering design is about the getting the product specification and form translated into a working product with the usual constraints of time, money resource etc.

-More specifically I have mostly worked in safety analysis. So designing the majority of the metal of a car and at times interior systems so perform under the most stringent safety regulations and consumer wants worldwide and sometimes at the simplest (just make it legal). By analysis, this means using tools such as FEA, test results, experience etc. to make design decision to drive the progress of the programme.

Till tonight as I've a new language to learn in order to best fit in in the next company of very fast cars I'll be working for

Peregrine

Where do you work? Like a city or a country name, I know you can't name the company.

Do you work for a manufacturer or a design studio?

Stone Deaf 4evr

what car do you drive yourself and why did you choose that one?

Dades

Speaking as a classic enthusiast (and DIYer), do you think cars are overdesigned these days?

How many of today's cars will still be on the road in 30-40 years time given the amount of electronics and moving parts?

Michael D Not Higgins

Stone Deaf 4evr wrote: »

what car do you drive yourself and why did you choose that one?

In addition to that, if you drive a car your company makes how much of a discount do they offer?

endacl

Ferrari for a day, or Lada for a lifetime. Both free.

Choose.

Zebrano

Hi.
This is great fair play.

Is the future of car manufacturing in steel or aluminium. Which poses more of a challenge from a safety point of view.

Thanks
Zebrano

Cookie_Monster

enda1 wrote: »

Till tonight as I've a new language to learn in order to best fit in in the next company of very fast cars I'll be working for

f1?

The slightly cryptic nature of the response and the excessive confidentiality agreements highlighted above definitely fit with F1

have you done any work on newer generations of power plants like EV or hydrogen? How do you think these will fit in to consumer vehicles in the next few years?

Unknown Soldier

Hi,

Do you think there is another "ground breaking" car etc, yet to be produced? For example, the Nissan Qashqai created it own segment and others did the same in the past history of motoring.

Electric?

enda1

Nim wrote: »

Where do you work? Like a city or a country name, I know you can't name the company.

Do you work for a manufacturer or a design studio?

In the UK, though I've worked on the continent and will again soon.

Manufacturer

Stone Deaf 4evr wrote: »

what car do you drive yourself and why did you choose that one?

A boring old Citroen C5. I travel over 100km a day so would be a fool not to drive something comfortable and economic! That said I've my eye on a 911...

Dades wrote: »

Speaking as a classic enthusiast (and DIYer), do you think cars are overdesigned these days?

How many of today's cars will still be on the road in 30-40 years time given the amount of electronics and moving parts?

Cars today are just as capable I firmly believe of doing the miles required to go that distance, the difference is that they'll all be shipped off to Africa or the likes as Western consumers (and government) have turned the car into a near-disposable object. Previously people kept cars for longer than the now now now generation do.

This is a hugely complicated question though. The amount of moving parts in cars has probably come close to a peak as the complexity of the internal combustion engine has boomed through environmental pressures. Electric and maybe future hydrogen fuel-cell technologies are fundamentally simpler in terms of part complexity so I guess it will lead to fewer parts. But then you've all the internal comforts and marketing wishes of customers such as automated seats, mirrors etc.... who knows!
Computer systems which ballooned to cope with all this have mostly simplified too and become more standardised (I'm lead to believe though this really isn't my field of knowledge).

Do I think they're over designed... Hmm. Well people walk away from seriously bar impacts that they would not have walked away from in the past so in that sense, no.
People recover from situations (the car recovers from situation too) that they wouldn't have been able to in the past, so in that sense, no.
People can drive a long distance comfortably while talking to a passenger and it not cost a fortune, so in that sense, no.

Overall honestly no. I am not one who particularly looks back, I'm not the nostalgic type and without some of this design I dare say a fair few people on boards.ie wouldn't be with us today! There some aspects of car design that seem over the top in the tacky-plastic add-on sense but sure that's a small price to pay for a far superior product in almost every other sense.

Finally, for the purist, you can still get those cars out there!

endacl wrote: »

Ferrari for a day, or Lada for a lifetime. Both free.

Choose.

Ferrari for a day, definitely. Unless that means I'd have to walk for the rest of my life... Probably no different with the Lada in that sense actually!

Zebrano wrote: »

Hi.
Is the future of car manufacturing in steel or aluminium. Which poses more of a challenge from a safety point of view.

Thanks
Zebrano

For me, maybe contentiously, steel. Steel has made massive strides of late. New high grade steel have super high strengths meaning you can make significant weight savings without the need to go near aluminium. Volume-wise much less of the material is needed to do the same job also so in effect for package constraints it's a much nicer material to work with. Also it is much easier to form. Manufacturing is easier allowing for more efficient shapes. Aluminium has a classic problem of joining techniques. Generally they are weak, costly, expensive or all three.

Lastly, you don't need to get into bed with the Saudis if you go for steel...

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

f1?

The slightly cryptic nature of the response and the excessive confidentiality agreements highlighted above definitely fit with F1

have you done any work on newer generations of power plants like EV or hydrogen? How do you think these will fit in to consumer vehicles in the next few years?

I could say who I work for but I just don't particularly want to. It's self inflicted confidentiality really. I don't work in F1 and wouldn't want to. Conversely to perceived wisdom, the engineering challenges are less difficult and the the pay is worse!

I've worked on hybrids yes. EV is not particularly different if there's an engine too. I've never worked on a vehicle without an engine. I'd like to work on hydrogen in particular, but pure electric too as they would pose some interesting challenges plus open some interesting avenues in structural design.

Unknown Soldier wrote: »

Hi,

Do you think there is another "ground breaking" car etc, yet to be produced? For example, the Nissan Qashqai created it own segment and others did the same in the past history of motoring.

Electric?

As marketing has finally properly broken through into motoring, finally people are getting cars that they want and they asked for. The old rigid segmentation barriers are being broken down and because the cost of entry for the consumer to the product market is now so low - there is more room for fashion in cars. Therefore also at the upper end there is more of flexibility in pricing as you can charge more for fashion *cough* Evoque *cough*.

To really answer your question though, I thing the next real groundbreaking technology in cars will be autonomy. When my car car drive me to work - I'll be a happy man! (But that could put me out of business because they may no longer crash so the regulations could slowly start to be relaxed!!)

enda1

helimachoptor wrote: »

On average how long does it take a for a design to go from drawing board to sign off?

For example designing the new mondeo, how long does that take?

Are there specific external/internal designers or do you do both?

Cars can take from about 3 years if there's a base to work on (upgrade/redisign etc.) to 8/9 years. I'd guess for the Mondeo they should not be looking at more than 5 years.

Eoin

Which everyday brands do you think are the most innovative (exterior design / research / whatever)? And conversely, which ones do you think are trading on their previous reputation a little?

Zebrano

What kind of understanding do u think the vechicle repair industry has about uhss and 2 phase steels and the correct repair procedures.

What do u think has been the biggest stride forward in automotive safety since the seat belt.

Does your company have a good working relationship with tatcham.

Will there ever be a demolition man safety style system. Have any companys done any reasearch into this.

Do you have any dogs

Kinet1c

Do you think Elon Musk is going to revolutionise your industry? What's your opinion on him?

Kenny Logins

Electronic handbrakes. Why?

enda1

Eoin wrote: »

Which everyday brands do you think are the most innovative (exterior design / research / whatever)? And conversely, which ones do you think are trading on their previous reputation a little?

I particularly like Volvo's and Mercedes's approach to research and development of methodology and material. They give a lot back to the community in terms of improving method and pusing the boundaries of technology. Visual styling-wise I think Land Rover have done wonders in reinvigorating their brand. Likewise Citroen with their really cool-funky DS line.

Zebrano wrote: »

What kind of understanding do u think the vechicle repair industry has about uhss and 2 phase steels and the correct repair procedures.

What do u think has been the biggest stride forward in automotive safety since the seat belt.

Does your company have a good working relationship with tatcham.

Will there ever be a demolition man safety style system. Have any companys done any reasearch into this.

Do you have any dogs

No dogs. Don't have an interest in animals whilst living in towns/cities and moving country/city every year. Maybe in the future.

I know little to nothing of repair industry. However I think that if you have permanent deformation of high strength steels in crash structures, they'd have to be replaced - not repaired. Most likely the car would be scrap.

I've never performed insurance evaluation. Some vehicles I've worked on have certainly never considered it even! (Think post £250k even north of £600k ) For those that do seriously look at it, it's a very important marketing tool but something I'd not class as safety related. It is something that we put a lot of thought and design into in particular to sell to fleet markets, unfortunately though at times it can compromise even certain safety attributes.

Re: Demolition man. If an occupant is stopped suddenly, their organs will turn to mush. So no. Air bags go a massive way to filling the void and proving "gentle" deceleration of the occupant in the limited space and time available to stop them. Plus allowing a potentially unconscious occupant post-impact to be safely extricated from the vehicle and not suffocate!

Kinet1c wrote: »

Do you think Elon Musk is going to revolutionise your industry? What's your opinion on him?

I think some of what he has been blowing trumpets about will revolutionise the industry. However, don't believe for a second that the bigger automakers are not similarly deeply researching these avenues.

Opinion on him: He's a visionary and people like him are needed to push the boundaries and upset stale thought. So go him!

Kenny Logins wrote: »

Electronic handbrakes. Why?

No idea.

Zebrano

For those that do seriously look at it, it's a very important marketing tool but something I'd not class as safety related. It is something that we put a lot of thought and design into in particular to sell to fleet markets, unfortunately though at times it can compromise even certain safety attributes.

Is this in relation to tatcham and how can it compromise certain safety attributes

ba_barabus

1. With increasingly stringent regulation of diesel engine emission coming up in further EURO Regulations will Auto Makers be able to produce reliable filters for diesel engines or are they going to concentrate on petrol and alternative fuels?

2. Is there a credible plan for switching to hydrogen fuels in the near future?

3. Is there signs that EU regulators will for autonomous vehicles on people who actually like to drive and not be driven?

cherryghost

How long til you think we see viable long-journey green cars?

Ken.

Have you ever worked on a car and felt proud of your work only for its design or something else you developed ripped to shreds by a car show(Top gear etc) or magazine?.
Did it piss you off?

Senna

Has motor sport contributed much to commercial car safety design in the last decade or two?

lovelyoner

What did you study in college?

Are you well paid?

braddun

when will we see flying cars


why cant Europeans and americans make reliable cars like the japanese

enda1

Quick note to say I will answer all these this evening, I've just a very busy day ahead of me. Bear with me please and keep'em coming!

2 Espressi

What advice would you give to students who was to work in the motor industry?

Are there any particular skills you learned in school that were useful in your job?

What did you find helpful getting into the industry?

enda1

Zebrano wrote: »

Is this in relation to tatcham and how can it compromise certain safety attributes

Yes. Unless I've understood you incorrectly, I think you were talking about the low speed insurance tests for repairability score yeah?

ba_barabus wrote: »

1. With increasingly stringent regulation of diesel engine emission coming up in further EURO Regulations will Auto Makers be able to produce reliable filters for diesel engines or are they going to concentrate on petrol and alternative fuels?

2. Is there a credible plan for switching to hydrogen fuels in the near future?

3. Is there signs that EU regulators will for autonomous vehicles on people who actually like to drive and not be driven?

I think that diesel's nearing extinction. The world will come to realise that the negative health effects are not worth the economy benefits.

I've no interest in driving myself on public roads full of morons, rain and fog and cars driving bumper to bumper at 80 miles per hour. Good riddance to it I think. Leave the pleasure driving to controlled environments.

cherryghost wrote: »

How long til you think we see viable long-journey green cars?

I don't really know. I know little about save the planet engines -I've a lot more experience in V8, V10 and V12s (Though really the engine under the bonnet or behind the driver is not my area of expertise)

ken wrote: »

Have you ever worked on a car and felt proud of your work only for its design or something else you developed ripped to shreds by a car show(Top gear etc) or magazine?.
Did it piss you off?

The only cars I've ever worked on which I've had a role in designing have been heaving praised by journalists - including Top Gear so I can't say I've yet to have this happen to me.

Senna wrote: »

Has motor sport contributed much to commercial car safety design in the last decade or two?

At the top end we're starting to see carbon fibre crash structures which is something which definitely comes from F1. I presume though am not sure, that many of the electronic stability and control systems have roots in F1 too.

lovelyoner wrote: »

What did you study in college?

Are you well paid?

I studied mechanical engineering. I think I'm well paid yes. My speciality is highly in demand at the moment so rates are rising by the month. Because I contract through a limited company, I am paid holy also so don't worry about being overworked as I could be as a salaried employee. Pay starts after about 3 years experience at about 25 pounds per hour and you'll pocket, of that about 80%. Pay rates go up to about 60 per hour give or take.

braddun wrote: »

when will we see flying cars


why cant Europeans and americans make reliable cars like the japanese

No time soon. Why can't Japanese make emotive cars like the Europeans and Americans? I guess it comes down to culture and respect. The Japanese as a culture have more of a culture of respect for the customer and shame if things go wrong. They'd prefer to make a reliable boring car than an avant guard rust bucket.

2 Espressi wrote: »

What advice would you give to students who was to work in the motor industry?

What did you find helpful getting into the industry?

Are there any particular skills you learned in school that were useful in your job?

I utilise first principles on a daily basis in work. I'd advise anybody studying now to try to get a grasp the mathematical fundamentals of the subject. Don't believe that this is just useless academia that get's left behind at the gates of a college. Some engineers it's true don't continue with too mathematical a career, but in certain aspects of mechanical analysis and design, strong fundamentals are key.

Also do really strive for good results as these honestly do remain important for longer than perhaps they should. I've been approached for jobs on the basis of these before...

Zebrano

Is it possible for air bags to go off if a car is hit and the ignition is off

Why don't air bags always go off when it looks like a car is hit hard enough and vice versa

Can u name any of the previous cars u have a hand in designing

Are u responsible for any of the major safety systems seen nowadays in mass produced cars

Not sure you answered this earlier. What has been the biggest leap forward in automotive safety since the seat belt

rameire

Cheers for your time.

in relation to safety and Lights, and the European Rule for DRL's for all New cars.

why cant they ( manufacturers ) go above and beyond the call of regulations and actually just make it that as soon as the engine goes on, your full rear and headlights go on.
it will stop the countless threads on boards and people becoming angry when they see idiots driving with only their front DRL's on in the middle of the night in a rain storm.

oh, and are wing mirrors an after thought on cars when designing, they always seem to whistle,
and they cause rain splash and dirt on side windows.

Omackeral

As a kid, I was always fascinated by Volvo's having their lights lights on all throughout the day. Is this true or am I imagining it. Think an 8 year old me asked my dad why and he said it's because it's dark in Scandinavia for longer. Am I making all this up or was that the case? Could they be switched off?

Also, I think we had a Renault 18 back in the late 80's/early 90's and seem to recall that the headlights had mini wipers on them. Do you remember this and if so, what's that about? Was it for snow or dirt? Was there a water valve too?

Does Lewis Hamilton look like Theo Walcott and are they the same person?

Mr.David

Have you ever been involved in a crash?

If so, would be curious to hear of the circumstances!

:pac:

enda1

Zebrano wrote: »

Is it possible for air bags to go off if a car is hit and the ignition is off

Why don't air bags always go off when it looks like a car is hit hard enough and vice versa

Can u name any of the previous cars u have a hand in designing

Are u responsible for any of the major safety systems seen nowadays in mass produced cars

Not sure you answered this earlier. What has been the biggest leap forward in automotive safety since the seat belt

No. There is usually a/multiple accelerometers which must provide a reading to one or more ECUs which determine fire/no-fire.

This also answers the second question, the fire/no-fire is determined based on the accelerations reached. The airbag doesn't always go off.

Depending on the vehicle I've worked on, I've been responsible for the side-crash performance, pedestrian impact performance, seat-belt archorage retention, ISOFIX - and am now also responsible for front and rear high speed and roof crush. So yeah, most structural performance. The systems have been primarily, the Body in White, Doors and Seats.

I've only been in the game for about 7 years, and seatbelts came in what, in the 60s? So in my time, I guess ISOFIX has been a major improvement. The proper protection of babies and young children has improved immensley in vehicles.

rameire wrote: »

Cheers for your time.

in relation to safety and Lights, and the European Rule for DRL's for all New cars.

why cant they ( manufacturers ) go above and beyond the call of regulations and actually just make it that as soon as the engine goes on, your full rear and headlights go on.
it will stop the countless threads on boards and people becoming angry when they see idiots driving with only their front DRL's on in the middle of the night in a rain storm.

oh, and are wing mirrors an after thought on cars when designing, they always seem to whistle,
and they cause rain splash and dirt on side windows.

I agree, I wish they'd just quit the messing about and have the lights on at all times. Ask Mr.David (below) about the whistling - he's q bit of experience onn that. I must say, I've never (noticed or) experienced that in a car before...

Omackeral wrote: »

As a kid, I was always fascinated by Volvo's having their lights lights on all throughout the day. Is this true or am I imagining it. Think an 8 year old me asked my dad why and he said it's because it's dark in Scandinavia for longer. Am I making all this up or was that the case? Could they be switched off?

Also, I think we had a Renault 18 back in the late 80's/early 90's and seem to recall that the headlights had mini wipers on them. Do you remember this and if so, what's that about? Was it for snow or dirt? Was there a water valve too?

Does Lewis Hamilton look like Theo Walcott and are they the same person?

Don't all the Scandi cars do this? To be honest a quick google could solve all this...

Yes they're the same person, obvs

Mr.David wrote: »

Have you ever been involved in a crash?

If so, would be curious to hear of the circumstances!

:pac:

Yes. I've repressed that memory though!

kirving

The safety systems of a modern car are incredible. Even the disparity between the two ends of the safety spectrum in cars that can be bought today is quite large. What FEA packages do you use for simulation? How do you think new technology will impact your job? Will there be less of a requirement for 10+ airbags in a car which will intervene before a crash?

(Working in a Teir one supplier myself, and the level of detail that goes into absolutely every single part on a modern car is beyond belief.)

enda1

Kevin Irving wrote: »

The safety systems of a modern car are incredible. Even the disparity between the two ends of the safety spectrum in cars that can be bought today is quite large. What FEA packages do you use for simulation? How do you think new technology will impact your job? Will there be less of a requirement for 10+ airbags in a car which will intervene before a crash?

(Working in a Teir one supplier myself, and the level of detail that goes into absolutely every single part on a modern car is beyond belief.)

I use as solvers, LS-DYNA and RADIOSS. Pre: Hypermesh, Ansa, Primer, Hypercrash. Post: Hyperview, THis, D3PLOT, Hypergraph, Animator 3.

The law and consumer tests would need to change for passive safety systems to be relaxed. I do hope it will happen though. The hope would be that eventually cars will no longer impact other cars or stationary objects. However, pedestrian, cyclist etc. impacts will most probably always happen. I think safety design will move much more towards environmental safety than occupant safety. This for all motoring lovers out there could lead to some very frumpy looking cars... On the other hand, if passive safety systems get lessened, there's more package for absorbing impacts of pedestrians, and package is absolute key to delivering pedestrian safety so knows where design could head.

alias no.9

enda1 wrote: »

To really answer your question though, I thing the next real groundbreaking technology in cars will be autonomy.

Kenny Logins wrote: »

Electronic handbrakes. Why?

If electronic parking brakes are a step towards autonomy, I'm not sure I want to see the next step.

Boards.ie: Niamh

Thanks for al of the questions folks and a big thank you to enda1 for taking the time to answer them!

I'm going to close this up now. No new AMA today as we wouldn;t expect anyone to feel they have to log in over the holidays but we will be back with a new one in January.

If you'd like to sign up to be the subject of a future AMA hotseat, please fill out this form. Please do tell any of your friends who might be interested/interesting (even the non-Boardsie ones :eek:)