What is the best type welder

jjjjjjjk

Hi just wondering what is the best type welder to make bale handlers and other things like that

Zr105

jjjjjjjk wrote: »

Hi just wondering what is the best type welder to make bale handlers and other things like that

All depends really,

Are you talking occasional use?
What's the budget?
Have you a decent power line to the place where you will be doing the welding?

If your talking a lot of regular welding mig is certainly the way to go, but your looking at €1000 and up for a welder, then your going to have to add wire, gas and bottle rental on top of that. Plus you'll need a decent power supply.

The other options are arc welder and for probably the majority of farms they will certainly suffice. Only running costs after purchase are rods and electricity. Downside is you have to chip away the slag.

2 main types, normal(aircooled) and inverter.
Inverters are handy, their light and portable and can run on lighter duty power supplies. You'll get away to about 120amps on a 13amp plug. Things to watch out for(as with any welder) Is the duty cycle, the higher the better. They can be got for reasonable enough money now, have a 160amp parweld here and can't fault it. Can generally weld a bit lighter than a standard welder to.


The normal welder will need a heavier power supply but will generally be able to work at higher amps for longer periods(duty cycle)

Don't bother with cheap rods, they don't weld great and take an age to break off the slag.

As for rod sizes 3.2's will do a lot of what youl need, will work from 80-120+amps, but if you've a decent welder and power to drive it 4mm rods above 120amps are no harm, and quicker to use.


For any welder of any type the biggest thing is to be able to vary the amps by small amounts at a time. 4settings between 40 and 120 amps is no good at all. Most cheaper migs will only have 6 settings, whilst a lot of arc welder a tend to have a completely variable range and make it much handier

learnabout

Inverter welder is best for general farm work . Its light to carry around extension lead! Welds rusty metals and repairs! Just be sure to unwind the extension cable fully if using! Inverters are cheap but pay about 300 or more for a decent one! The ones i'm lidl are impossible for a novice to use! To little power and rods sticking excreta

Cavanjack

jjjjjjjk wrote: »

Hi just wondering what is the best type welder to make bale handlers and other things like that

Not being smart but you mustn't have much experience welding if you are asking this question. To take on making bale handlers and the like you would really want to know what you are at, weather making them for yourself or others. A weld breaking with a 3/4 tonne bale on it could be dangerous.

Miname

Cavanjack wrote: »

Not being smart but you mustn't have much experience welding if you are asking this question. To take on making bale handlers and the like you would really want to know what you are at, weather making them for yourself or others. A weld breaking with a 3/4 tonne bale on it could be dangerous.

give the lad a chance we all start somewhere.

visatorro

friend of mine served his time as a welder. they had a young lad in to sweep the floor of the workshop one summer, during lunch the young lad used to try welding. my friend told him to use the shield or he'd get arc eye, young lad il be grand. next day young lad landed in with big red face and watery eyes and attacked my friend for not telling him what arc eye was! he didn't take up welding after anyway

Zr105

visatorro wrote: »

friend of mine served his time as a welder. they had a young lad in to sweep the floor of the workshop one summer, during lunch the young lad used to try welding. my friend told him to use the shield or he'd get arc eye, young lad il be grand. next day young lad landed in with big red face and watery eyes and attacked my friend for not telling him what arc eye was! he didn't take up welding after anyway

a nasty bloody thing... have caught myself once or twice putting down the torch without looking properly and clipping a bit of whatever im welding

and on a related note, auto shields really are worth the money! so much handier than a hand held shield or one you have to flick down

keep going

Have an old oil cooled welder here , would considerit better than others I've worked with.

Reggie.

Worth your while doing a quick FAS course on welding if ya could. It just gets ya started unless you have someone who could show ya the ropes. Best thing I learned to do was to learn how to weld. Very very handy skill

Cavanjack

Miname wrote: »

give the lad a chance we all start somewhere.

Of course. I'm just advising him to be careful and to start off small.

st1979

Had an oil cooled. used an air cooled but will shoot you if you take my inverter welder. have a thermal arc 175 amp inverter and have had a professional welder using it to make a portal frame shed using ip220 (9" h iron) welding in haunches 4foot long continously with 4 mm rods. and it was only stopping to change rods. Never cut out or anything. Got it 4 yrs now have had to replace the cooling fan twice they cost about 25 euro they are same as in some pc computers. only reason they went was my fault in letting rain in on it.
If I was buying again from scratch I would go for thermal arc 211i fabricator 3 in 1. but cost about a grand compared to 250 for mine. But it will do mig stick and tig. and weighs about 18 kg.
scrap man is getting my oil cooled monster as not worth repairing. and even if it was pmo I wouldn't bother using it. I want a mig but my head tells me no. as most of my work is away from workshop and the breeze will blow away the gas.
btw thermal arc are not the best make around but are a decent enough make.

Miname

I have an invertor (jefferson) and an oil cooled pig. the oil cooled is a disaster round a farm, its a job in itself moving it for those small jobs

f140

Miname wrote: »

I have an invertor (jefferson) and an oil cooled pig. the oil cooled is a disaster round a farm, its a job in itself moving it for those small jobs

have an old cooled here and an arc welder. the oil cooled will weld all day and I much rather using it. Now it just stays in one shed and doesn't leave it as its too cumbersome. have the inverter if I need to weld anywhere else. oil cooled is about 30 years old, had to get it recoiled last year. fully expecting another 30 years out of it. let me see some other welder that will beat that. Now I never abuse it, it had never seen rain or water in its life and is always kept indoors


Now if its possible the item will be bought to the oil cooled rather than the inverter going to the item to be welded.

st1979

How much does it cost to get an oil cooled re coiled

f140

st1979 wrote: »

How much does it cost to get an oil cooled re coiled

€90 inc vat

Nekarsulm

Anyone find that Oerlikon rods seem to have gone to hell, quality wise?
Cheaper Turkish ones welding better for me lately.

Reggie.

Nekarsulm wrote: »

Anyone find that Oerlikon rods seem to have gone to hell, quality wise?
Cheaper Turkish ones welding better for me lately.

Yeah I find the own brand from wholesale welding supplies good aswell

st1979

yea was doing a lot of welding and my polish guy could see no difference between orkelion cito weld at 20 per pack of 2.5kg and ine at 12 euro per 2.5kg pack. but got a 5 kg of hilco red extra at 22 euro and he taught they were far better to weld with.

Nekarsulm

must try the hilco, local store is 15 for oerlikon and 11 for turkish.

Zr105

Reggie. wrote: »

Yeah I find the own brand from wholesale welding supplies good aswell

Really? Found them ok but not wonderful, buggers to stop burning at times, spit like hell and the slag is hard to chip off and has to be chipped every time. Gone to hilco Reds again now and the slag walks off if welding with reasonable heat and they burn much much nicer, the yellow pack think it's ezetrodes would be the normal rod here it would rate the hilcos well above them, and working out cheaper to,2.5kg of ezetrode 3.2's is around €13, 5kg of hilco 3.2's was €20odd I think cant remember exactly

Reggie.

Zr105 wrote: »

Really? Found them ok but not wonderful, buggers to stop burning at times, spit like hell and the slag is hard to chip off and has to be chipped every time. Gone to hilco Reds again now and the slag walks off if welding with reasonable heat and they burn much much nicer, the yellow pack think it's ezetrodes would be the normal rod here it would rate the hilcos well above them, and working out cheaper to,2.5kg of ezetrode 3.2's is around €13, 5kg of hilco 3.2's was €20odd I think cant remember exactly

I found no bother here the last while. Keep an eye out for deals. 2.5 and 3.2 are €5 for 2.5kg this week

st1979

Where abouts can u get rods for a fiver. be worth stocking up.

Nekarsulm

Reggie. wrote: »

I found no bother here the last while. Keep an eye out for deals. 2.5 and 3.2 are €5 for 2.5kg this week

That's great value, the Oerlikon 3.2mm come in 1.9kg boxes.

Reggie.

http://wholesaleweldingsupplies.ie

They come in a handy plastic container too

Just look for the rods section

Zr105

Reggie. wrote: »

http://wholesaleweldingsupplies.ie

They come in a handy plastic container too

Just look for the rods section

Was it the yellow or red pack you got? Was the red pack we got, a box of 2.5's with the welder and then got a box of 3.2's and found both boxes the same...

The plastic box is handy tho, the hilcos are currently dumped into it

Reggie.

Zr105 wrote: »

Was it the yellow or red pack you got? Was the red pack we got, a box of 2.5's with the welder and then got a box of 3.2's and found both boxes the same...

The plastic box is handy tho, the hilcos are currently dumped into it

They are the same. The plastic box was extra at one time but they seem to send them all out in it now

delaney001

Reggie. wrote: »

Worth your while doing a quick FAS course on welding if ya could. It just gets ya started unless you have someone who could show ya the ropes. Best thing I learned to do was to learn how to weld. Very very handy skill

Did one recently and couldn't agree more. Amazing how much easier a process it is when you start out right.

Reggie.

delaney001 wrote: »

Did one recently and couldn't agree more. Amazing how much easier a process it is when you start out right.

It'll just give ya a foundation.

stretch film

Old oil cooled cant be beaten when comes to heavier work in situ. But surely when it comes to bringing the mountain to muhammad the inverter is one of the best additions to the farm tool kit. Throw it on ure back up a ladder or plug it into a domestic 3pin if needs be. Flexibility saves some time .

mayota

Nekarsulm wrote: »

Anyone find that Oerlikon rods seem to have gone to hell, quality wise?
Cheaper Turkish ones welding better for me lately.

Noticed that earlier in week. Better head up to the home place now and take them out from within in the range!

st1979

when do you ever find the oil cooled better?? neither my oil cooled or inverter have every stopped welding due to over heating. both keep welding as fast as you can change rods. both weld with 4mm rods with sufficient penetration
I find the inverter way easier to weld as its got 'hot start' to stop the rod sticking when you strike.
the inverter can weld on the end of an extension lead due to less power consumption.
cause less tripping of the trip switches
lighter about 5kg vs 100kg

the only good thing about the oil cooled is you could charge a battery with them. (never done it)
but as for an air cooled welder they are complete scrap

Zr105

st1979 wrote: »

when do you ever find the oil cooled better?? neither my oil cooled or inverter have every stopped welding due to over heating. both keep welding as fast as you can change rods. both weld with 4mm rods with sufficient penetration
I find the inverter way easier to weld as its got 'hot start' to stop the rod sticking when you strike.
the inverter can weld on the end of an extension lead due to less power consumption.
cause less tripping of the trip switches
lighter about 5kg vs 100kg

the only good thing about the oil cooled is you could charge a battery with them. (never done it)
but as for an air cooled welder they are complete scrap

i wouldnt agree to be honest, the "big welder" here is air cooled and never been able to fault it. it is an old welder tho, the newer cheap air cooled are no doubt crap alright, but i wouldnt right them all off

Dawggone

Large oil cooled arc welder in workshop that's rarely used.
Large mig is used in workshop exclusively.

Inverter used outside on farm and with a generator in mobile workshop.

Nekarsulm

If you come across an old "Red Triangle" air cooled welder at an auction, its well worth chancing a bid or two. Probably the best air cooled welder made. Newer cheapo air cooled models often come with aluminium windings are just junk.

Dawggone

Nekarsulm wrote: »

If you come across an old "Red Triangle" air cooled welder at an auction, its well worth chancing a bid or two. Probably the best air cooled welder made. Newer cheapo air cooled models often come with aluminium windings are just junk.

+1.

ford 5600

Nekarsulm wrote: »

If you come across an old "Red Triangle" air cooled welder at an auction, its well worth chancing a bid or two. Probably the best air cooled welder made. Newer cheapo air cooled models often come with aluminium windings are just junk.

+2.
I have a 250 amp SIP fan cooled, copper coiled welder , and there is no comparison between it and aluminium coiled cheapo versions made for the co-op, hardware store market at handyish money . Junk. Will cut out after a few inches welding . I have used mine until you couldn't hold the rod holder in your hand any longer due to it being so hot , and I have never seen it cut out once. In any thing welder tool washing machine or whatever, remember you don't always get what you pay for , but you usually need to pay for what you get. Pay peanuts, get monkeys.

SuperTortoise

mayota wrote: »

Noticed that earlier in week. Better head up to the home place now and take them out from within in the range!

It's been a couple of years since I used oerlikon rods but the last time I did I found them the best you could buy, murex are also nice to use.
Generally speaking the rods you get free with some machines are not worth burning good quality rods are a must IMO

blue5000

Nekarsulm wrote: »

If you come across an old "Red Triangle" air cooled welder at an auction, its well worth chancing a bid or two. Probably the best air cooled welder made. Newer cheapo air cooled models often come with aluminium windings are just junk.

Saw one at an auction last year, 2 lads must have been thinking twas worth a bid or two, they went to over €500 after commission:eek:

enricoh

Have an oil cooled n inverter ,had a mig but threw out more rolls of rusty wire than I used welding. Plus renting gas bottle is pricey.

If it was me kicking off I'd get an old Oxford oil cooled - bulletproof n then get a good heavy mig if it takes off. If u buy a cheap mig it'll end up as scrap anyway ,at least u,ll always have the Oxford as back up.
I blew my inverter recently from using it on heavy jobs that I should a used the Oxford on.