First adventure races in 2014. Training for running without sacrificing cycling?

MTBD

I'm looking to train for adventure racing in conjunction with my Mountain bike training. This year I did GFW with a friend for fun and ended up coming in the top 80 despite not taking it very seriously and doing no specific training for it. I probably could have knocked 10-15 mins off my time if i didnt run at my friends pace at the start and then dawdle around the place at tranisitions or even if i knew what to expect at a race that long. I then entered Killarney and took it a bit more seriously ie. did it entirely at my own pace and came in the top 25. Again I hadnt done any specific training in advance and had done no warm up before the start. Ignorance is bliss sometimes? I found the endurance aspect of it pretty easy as I got relatively stronger towards the end of both races.

Mountain biking is my primary sport and I want to continue pursuing that so that I can race Elite enduro/DH and maybe XC in the next 12-18 months. However I'm really beginning to enjoy the adventure racing. MTB and trail running feel like different versions of the same thing to me.

I took up running in March as a way of waking myself up before studying(running about 5k 3/4 days a week). I did a 5 mile in 31.49 a few weeks later so I think I have potential to go a lot faster as I have always been a fast sprinter and I'm strong on hills. I'm wondering is it possible to continue improving my cycling power and running speed at the same time?

Most of the running I do is on trails with a lot of elevation and I dont seem to have any problem running longer distances (15km+ with elevation) at tempo/endurance pace although I rarely go over 8.5km on my weekly runs. Improving threshold pace is the challenge. I'm currently running 3 days a week and mountain biking 3 days a week. So about 2 hours of running and 6 hours of cycling (foundation/base phase). That is still a lot more running than I was doing last summer but I dont know if it is enough to make any significant gains in speed? I like to get down to 5.30 a mile over 5m. At the moment I'm just running at endurance/tempo pace for most of my runs. Would running a slow 5k every morning be silly? I have the time as I work at home and I just enjoy doing it to feel good.

Peterx

You have massive potential for improvement if you have never ran before. I think you could start thinking about winning the races. It's more exciting. Your progress is good, keep going. Don't settle for top 25. If you race elite level MTB and can also run you are capable of winning adventure races.

In terms of the running the old staple was always a speed session on tuesday, a tempo session on Saturday morning and a long run on Sunday as the three key ingredients with other runs for recovery and base and keeping the weight down.

Being quicker than the bikers at the running and quicker than the runners at the biking will get you into the top 10. After that talk to the winner and ask him what he does. He's called Dessie

desertcircus

Did you get those results cycling an MTB on race day?

MTBD

Peterx wrote: »

You have massive potential for improvement if you have never ran before. I think you could start thinking about winning the races. It's more exciting. Your progress is good, keep going. Don't settle for top 25. If you race elite level MTB and can also run you are capable of winning adventure races.

In terms of the running the old staple was always a speed session on tuesday, a tempo session on Saturday morning and a long run on Sunday as the three key ingredients with other runs for recovery and base and keeping the weight down.

Being quicker than the bikers at the running and quicker than the runners at the biking will get you into the top 10. After that talk to the winner and ask him what he does. He's called Dessie

I laughed at that last line. Must be nice to be known as the winner before you even enter! But it's true, he did win both of them!

When I saw my result I straight away thought about the possibility of winning or doing well in one of these things, but I dont want to get carried away and set my targets too high, too soon. I'd still be looking at knocking a lot of time off GFW time before I could think about winning it or even coming in the top 15. I'm not gonna lie though it would definitely be on my mind over the next few years. I trained very inconsistently over the last year but I have an actual plan now which I can stick to. There was no structure at all or any specific sessions.

So if I am only doing 3 days running a week, you would say a speed session, a tempo session and a long run are the necessities? There is a club nearby which I could join for the speed sessions on Tuesdays.

desertcircus wrote: »

Did you get those results cycling an MTB on race day?

No I was on my road bike. Cramped at GFW during the bike ride which was very annoying after making good progress.

Peterx

You can't really expect to go hard all the time. with only three runs a week I would do any two of the three sessions and an easier run the other time.
Running is hard on the body. Recovery is important

MTBD

Peterx wrote: »

You can't really expect to go hard all the time. with only three runs a week I would do any two of the three sessions and an easier run the other time.
Running is hard on the body. Recovery is important

Thanks for the info. I see. It certainly feels different to cycling the day after. Soreness as opposed to fatigue. Ill never forget the DOMS after my first run of the year. Im trying to do running on Tuesdays, Thusdays and Fridays so I should have plenty of time for recovery. So maybe 2 of those sessions and a hill run at an easy pace as my other run?

Cycling seems to allow the legs recover fully from running anyway.

Enduro

I've observed over the years that mountain biking and hill running complement each other very well. Mountain bikers have excellent ascending ability in hill races in general. Clearly there's a big overlap in muscle groups being used there. My own hill running improved massively after I started MTBing more regularly.

You should look at doing real adventure races rather than the crappy little multi sport races (Anything you do solo, is optimal with a road bike, with a set course). In a proper adventure races (the likes of the Beast of Ballyhoura in Ireland, or any non-Irish adventure race) you'll have actual mountain biking! Some of the best mountain biking experiences I've had have been in proper adventure races over the years, including one or two in Ireland. I gave up on the multi-sport races as the boredom of slogging out road miles on the road bike was too mind numbing. You can't beat getting into the mountains on a bike, as opposed to cycling past them!

sconhome

Depending on where you are in Ireland there is the Causeway Coast AR series on at the moment, think there is one or two winter races left. These would give you a crack at proper racing, organised and run by adventure racers.

As Enduro says, there is a world of difference in races for the masses and proper AR. I'm only truely learning that myself in the past 2 years.

BTW dibs in for Team #TriHarder2

MTBD

Sorry I forgot to reply. I dont really know if id like the team element of the real adventure races as you call them, i like being independent although over 2-3 days I can see how you wouldnt. I agree about it being much better to do actual mountain biking though. I am very near the Ballyhouras so Id consider it though.

I am 28 so I would imagine that I have some pretty good endurance racing years ahead of me. I was thinking maybe this year I could build a base of running and not worry so much about speed. I still want to focus on the MTB racing to see how I can do in that this year and that requires a lot of time as it is more of a skill sport so I'm inclined to try to make the most of that while im at my peak years. Maybe I could keep the intensity low when it comes to running this year. I like going for a hilly run first thing in the morning and I could continue doing that in addition to my cycling training? Or would I be as well off just injecting some instensity and not doing it every day?

Peterx

MTBD wrote: »

Sorry I forgot to reply. I dont really know if id like the team element of the real adventure races as you call them, i like being independent although over 2-3 days I can see how you wouldnt. I agree about it being much better to do actual mountain biking though. I am very near the Ballyhouras so Id consider it though.

I am 28 so I would imagine that I have some pretty good endurance racing years ahead of me. I was thinking maybe this year I could build a base of running and not worry so much about speed. I still want to focus on the MTB racing to see how I can do in that this year and that requires a lot of time as it is more of a skill sport so I'm inclined to try to make the most of that while im at my peak years. Maybe I could keep the intensity low when it comes to running this year. I like going for a hilly run first thing in the morning and I could continue doing that in addition to my cycling training? Or would I be as well off just injecting some instensity and not doing it every day?

Don't mind Enduro.* If he was an Ironman saying all duathlons were shíte he would be asked to rephrase himself but he gets away with calling multisport races dogturd on here. Each to their own but talking up your own sport without denigrating others should be the norm.

Assuming you enjoy competition and racing - When you are racing to your best on the day and striving with all your might to beat someone who is your equal it doesn't really matter what the format is.

Keep giving the MTB your full attention and if you do manage to run 3 or 4 times a week you will be very competitive at one day Irish races. One day racing on pre known courses is a very easy activity to dip in and out of. If you find these are not enough of a challenge the multi day races are definitely more challenging.

*leave the getting annoyed at something I read on the internet to me