Cross on Carrauntoohil II

Gasherbraun

An update on this story -

http://www.walkingandhikingireland.com/macgillycuddy-reeks-mountain-access-forum-confirm-carrauntoohil-cross-will-be-re-erected/

Mods - this is intended as a genuine update (I do not think it has been covered on the forum yet) and not an attempt to re-ignite the previous closed thread. However if you think it will go that way feel free to remove it.

tphase

just heard on the news it has been re-erected

a148pro

I have to say I climbed Carrauntoohil once and the cross didn't bother me at all.

And when I read the last thread while I saw both sides of the argument but didn't feel too strongly about it either way.

But I saw the report on RTE news last night, gorgeous view of the summit just after dawn looking like a real mountain way above cloud covering the rest of the landscape, and the cross looked absolutely awful, a real eyesore.

And all the committed mountainy types were the people putting it back up (albeit those interviewed it was about the tradition and the heritage of things as much as anything).

I don't like it now. I don't think its anything to do with the mountain, and in fairness to the people who put it up there and support it going back up, I don't think its anything to do with the mountain for them either.

CardinalJ

I don't think the cross should be up there. The landscape belongs to everyone, not just one religious group.

In saying that, people can't just go ripping things down that they don't like, so I think it's right that it's back up. If people don't want to see crosses on private land, contact the land owner, contact the council.

BarryD

http://www.walkingandhikingireland.com/macgillycuddy-reeks-mountain-access-forum-confirm-carrauntoohil-cross-has-been-re-instated/

Old cross fixed back up, it seems. I wonder did they give it a coat of paint first

Edited to add, yes it seems

Thargor

I wonder if it'll be for the chop again?

mikka631

I think that it should be replaced with a sculpture of some symbol from our Celtic origins that predates Christianity, something historic or mythical rather than religious, something uniquely Irish.

fits

So apparently, thejournal.ie have got their hands on a video of it being chopped down
Done in protest at church control of the schools, and well they have a point.

fits

fits wrote: »

Done in protest at church control of the schools, and well they have a point.

Apparently they could not articulate the point themselves and felt damage to property was the best way to make it. Did they think that we should guess what it was all about?

Rubberchikken

maybe those who cut it down in protest at church control of schools have a point, but damaging property that is not there's isn't the way to win friends/influence people.

i personally, have no issue with either church control of schools/cross on mountain top.

people with a complaint should know there are proper channels to go through.

Tabnabs

Link to the Journal.ie story

http://www.thejournal.ie/carrauntoohil-cross-3-1810988-Dec2014/

laoch na mona

mikka631 wrote: »

I think that it should be replaced with a sculpture of some symbol from our Celtic origins that predates Christianity, something historic or mythical rather than religious, something uniquely Irish.

pick one you can't have both :P

fits

Rubberchikken wrote: »

i personally, have no issue with either church control of schools.../

You are entitled to your preference. You are not entitled to force it down every parent's throat which is essentially what the State/Churches are doing and have been reprimanded for by the UN Human rights committee.

“The Committee is concerned… about the slow progress in increasing access to secular education through the establishment of non-denominational schools, divestment of the patronage of schools and the phasing out of integrated religious curricula in schools accommodating minority faith or non-faith children.”

Not condoning the action at all. Its an ugly cross and I wouldn't lament its removal but I don't go around forcing my opinions on others.

fits

fits wrote: »

You are not entitled to force it down every parent's throat which is essentially what the State/Churches are doing and have been reprimanded for by the UN Human rights committee.

Let's not invoke the UN! I can't throw a brick through my Israeli neighbours window because the UN reprimanded Israel.

It's a cross on land which the owners seem happy with. It's back up now, in accordance with their wishes.

Thargor

Who owns the mountain anyway?

DeepSleeper

Thargor wrote: »

Who owns the mountain anyway?

It, like most Irish mountains, is commonage - that doesn't mean it isn't owned by anybody or that is it public land (as some people think) - it means it is owned in common by a number of people. These are usually farmers in the valleys below the mountain and in many cases a number of commonages will converge at a peak. Each person in a commonage owns a defined share of it, but one persons share isn't divided from another's.

Just because the land is owned in commonage doesn't mean it is private property - it is.

http://www.yourcommonage.ie/p/commonage_3.html

Volvoair

back in place again.

Mickeroo

Glorious day to be up there by the looks of it

Thargor

Mickeroo wrote: »

Glorious day to be up there by the looks of it

Im dying to climb it again now, never did it in Winter. Bet its busy these days after all the publicity though.

Volvoair

they are actually ABOVE the clouds....some view on a clear sunny day! approx 3500 feet height.
https://www.google.ie/search?q=carrauntoohil&client=firefox-a&hs=lfJ&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&channel=nts&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=Ck9-VJT3DPKP7Abj1IGgBw&ved=0CAgQ_AUoAQ&biw=1680&bih=897
some totally spectacular photos here.

Grudaire

Aaaand a video of it being cut down emerged..

Some disturbing anger behind this for someone to walk up the mountain and still feel bitter enough to cut it down..

http://jrnl.ie/1810988

MysticalRain

You don't advance the cause of secularism by launching a jihad against religious monuments. That might play well to one end of the political spectrum. But it turns off the rest of society.