Didn't realise "dissident" Republicans were so active.

DarkyHughes

I stumbled across a Y/T video the other about some booby trap bomb attack by ONH (one of the 3 main groups along with RIRA & CIRA)

Since 2007/2008 theier attacks have become increasingly more active with around 20 - 40/50 attacks a years by all the main groups.

Of course there was the RIRA Massarene barracks attack in 2009 in which 2 soldiers were killed & 4 others injured & a day or 2 later a CIRA sniper killed a PSNI officer. And then there was the killing of another PSNI officer by a bobby trap car bomb, I forget which group carried that murder out.

But just a few weeks ago at the start of November the RIRA hit a PSNI armored jeep with a mortar. Luckily nobody was badly hurt, but the intent was to kill everyone in the jeep.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aXRWGUMkA5A

See in the report he says there was 2 recent attempts to lure officers to their deaths.

luckily these groups lack the expertise that the Provo's or even INLA had. And don't have much support unlike the Provos who I supported myself (even if I didn't always agree with some tactics) because they were in engaged in a legitimate armed struggle.

These people are just killing for the sake of it.

DarkyHughes

Here's an even more recent attack that happened just last week which was aimed at killing as many PSNI officers as possible.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iwOH6Vp99sc

Great to see a war hero who blew up the Old Bailey like Gerry Kelly condemning such a wicked act.

junder

DarkyHughes wrote: »

Here's an even more recent attack that happened just last week which was aimed at killing as many PSNI officers as possible.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iwOH6Vp99sc

Great to see a war hero who blew up the Old Bailey like Gerry Kelly condemning such a wicked act.

War hero? The quality of boards is really slipping these days for such a comment to be allowed, of course the hypocrisy of pira members condemning actions that they themselves took part in, is lost on some people

DarkyHughes

junder wrote: »

War hero? The quality of boards is really slipping these days for such a comment to be allowed, of course the hypocrisy of pira members condemning actions that they themselves took part in, is lost on some people

The people who he represents in North Belfast seem think so. And so do most Republicans.
So I suppose you'd rather him praise these attacks then would you? Some people's bigotry just clouds their sense of reality.

And it's not hypocrisy at all, there is no brutal oppression of of the CNR community in today's Ireland like there was in the 60's & early 70's, so you can't compare the heroes of the PIRA to the dissidents who are just killing for the sake of it. The paratroopers who murdered 14 innocent people in Derry & being awarded medals is real hypocrisy.

junder

DarkyHughes wrote: »

The people who he represents in North Belfast seem think so. And so do most Republicans.
So I suppose you'd rather him praise these attacks then would you? Some people's bigotry just clouds their sense of reality.

And it's not hypocrisy at all, there is no brutal oppression of of the CNR community in today's Ireland like there was in the 60's & early 70's, so you can't compare the heroes of the PIRA to the dissidents who are just killing for the sake of it. The paratroopers who murdered 14 innocent people in Derry & being awarded medals is real hypocrisy.

Sure war heros, remember le mon

Godge

junder wrote: »

War hero? The quality of boards is really slipping these days for such a comment to be allowed, of course the hypocrisy of pira members condemning actions that they themselves took part in, is lost on some people

Criminal terrorist thug is probably a better description.

Berserker

DarkyHughes wrote: »

Great to see a war hero who blew up the Old Bailey like Gerry Kelly condemning such a wicked act.

Yet, if the attacks above happened 25 years ago, Kelly would classify them as acceptable.

DarkyHughes

junder wrote: »

Sure war heros, remember le mon

Kelly had nothing to do with that. it's like me saying remember Springhill. Not every that happens in a conflict is just. Just like Le Mon & Sprighill were not. Is the whole British Arny bad because of what it did in Derry & Ballymurphy? No. Is The US Army Bad for carrying out the Mi Lai Massacre in were US troops killed in one day than the IRA did in 30 years. This is just selective anger.
And sure just ignore all the other points I made.

DarkyHughes

Berserker wrote: »

Yet, if the attacks above happened 25 years ago, Kelly would classify them as acceptable.

There was a conflict going on then there's not now. You UVF guys sure no how to derail a thread.

DarkyHughes

Godge wrote: »

Criminal terrorist thug is probably a better description.

For dissidents & the former IPLO that would be true.

junder

DarkyHughes wrote: »

Kelly had nothing to do with that. it's like me saying remember Springhill. Not every that happens in a conflict is just. Just like Le Mon & Sprighill were not. Is the whole British Arny bad because of what it did in Derry & Ballymurphy? No. Is The US Army Bad for carrying out the Mi Lai Massacre in were US troops killed in one day than the IRA did in 30 years. This is just selective anger.
And sure just ignore all the other points I made.

Did Kelly plant bombs, did he shot a prison guard in the face?

DarkyHughes

junder wrote: »

Did Kelly plant bombs, did he shot a prison guard in the face?

Yeah he did plant bombs, the ones he planted didn't kill anyone or were designed to kill anyone unlike the UVF/MRF ones who designed bombs to kill innocent people. There's plenty of Brit forces who shot unarmed Volunteers.

I'm not saying everything the provos did was right far from it Le Mon being a good example of that, but their was a war going on & provos killed a lot innocents than the British Army & Loyalists but if their scum so are the enemies they faced, state & non-state forces. The UVF/UPV had planted bombs in Dublin before the Provos even exited & four years before Kelly planted bombs in London.

DarkyHughes

And don't forget it was the security forces who did first massacre of civilians during the Falls Curfew when shot they dead 5 civilians & wounded dozens more before the provos even turned their guns on the British.

Crooked Jack

I actually find dissident activity to be surprisingly sparse. If they really wanted to kill loads of cops they could. They are nothing more than criminal gangs who every so often take a pot shot at the peelers to try and maintain the farce that they are a republican guerilla army.

getzls

DarkyHughes wrote: »

I stumbled across a Y/T video the other about some booby trap bomb attack by ONH (one of the 3 main groups along with RIRA & CIRA)


These people are just killing for the sake of it.

Yeah, sure you did.
Killing for the sake of it?
That's what the ira did from about 1983.
They knew they would never get an A.I.

DarkyHughes

getzls wrote: »

Yeah, sure you did.
Killing for the sake of it?
That's what the ira did from about 1983.
They knew they would never get an A.I.

Know they actually taught they could push on to victory or to the table which is were they ended up when they got the huge arm shipments from Libya in 85 & 6. Plus thatcher didn't want to bring them to the table she just wanted a victory over the IRA & if you read General Glovers report from 1978 you'd see that wasn't going to happen.

And if they had just called a stop to the war with no gains what so ever another split would have occurred in 1983 that produced the provisionals in 69 so there would be no point to that, plus the INLA, UVF, & UDA were all active. So stop spouting crap that you know is impossible to happen.

Crooked Jack

tomwaterford wrote: »

what in all honesty is the difference in there armed struggle???
the GFA wasn't worth losing a nights sleep over no mind 3000+ lives

You seem to have your history backwards here. They didnt read the GFA and then go to war. They didnt do any for the GFA, that was the agreement that brought it to an end. You cant go back and change what has been done, all you can do is try and make a better future. The IRA recognised that armed struggle couldnt carry the cause of freedom any further at that point so they changed tactic. The IRA were committed to republicanism, not violence. I hate when people say it was all "for" the GFA, it betrays a shocking ignorance on their part.

*it was a half arsed political solution to a military stalemate

Yes, it was, but what was the alternative?

no critize disssedents for being small and lacking political direction etc is acceptable imo...but to say there fight is illegtimate and the provo/inla was legitimate....there is literally no difference....it is a hypocritical lie to say otherwise

Drivel. The IRA re-emerged in 1969 as a purely defensive force. At that time nationalists were treated as second class citizens across the north while in cities like Belfast and Derry they were effectively under siege, liable to have their home burned down at a moments notice. The stormont regime was utterly corrupt, the police force were merely the armed wing of that regime and many of the basic liberties we have today, such as universal sufferage, did not exist for nationalists.

Following on from this came the Falls Curfew, internment, Bloody Sunday, the Springhill and Ballymurphy massacres, collusion, the hunger strikes, half arsed efforts at peace from the British, complete rejection of peace from unionists and finally the GFA.

How then, does any of that compare to the various dissident campaigns that began after 1998? How is there "literally no difference"? Explain that to me.

Full Marx

The most significant thing to note about the "campaign" of so called dissident republicans is that they have no political strategy to back it up or compliment it. The provisionals realized this, hence they made an effort to build up Sinn Féin and to develop a coherent political analysis of things. With the absense of any coherent political analysis or strategy they are destined to gradually fade out.

The political analysis of the "dissidents" is essentially that the provisional republican movement betrayed them and/or gave up/abandoned the working class (arguments which are worth looking at) and that the war should go on. Their tactic in this regard to try to embarrass and shame republicans into abandoning SF and turning to them. However because they have no political sense of direction many class conscious socialist republicans have pretty much become disillusioned and faded away from politics altogether rather than jump in with other republican groups.

A sober look at events over the past 50 years clearly shows us that the British were well able to manage a low intensity war. Even if the dissidents were able to build a military campaign up to the heights of the provos (unlikely for many reasons) it has been demonstrated that that tactic has failed to dislodge the British, albeit did destroy the Orange state (an achievement not to be sniffed at). What would have really threatened British rule in Ireland would have been a mass movement, like with the civil rights campaign, complimented by military action. The British however very effectively ended the "mass movement" element of the struggle in NI by butchering people on Bloody Sunday and changed the struggle from a mass participatory one to solely one of low intensity revolt/military operations. This is something which they (the British) have more experience than anyone in managing all over the globe and are very comfortable with doing. The provos enabled the British to do this as they were content to concentrate on "the war". They made a similar mistake following the hunger strikes too.

It is clear that the dissidents are heavily infiltrated and the security forces are well on top of them. They aren't complaining about the danger money either.