Average handicap in ireland

shabalala

Hope somebody can help, how would i find out what the average mens handicap in Ireland is?

Rikand

aside from contacting the GUI, not a clue ?

At a guess, I'd say it's probably somewhere in the mid-high teens (15-18)

mike12

http://averagegolfer1.blogspot.ie/2008/06/average-golfer-statistics.html

Norfolk Enchants_

mike12 wrote: »

http://averagegolfer1.blogspot.ie/2008/06/average-golfer-statistics.html

That's a US article/blogger, from memory the average UK and Ireland HC is 19 point something, I remember been quite surprised to learn it was so high, I like others would have thought it was in the 14/16 range.

mike12

Norfolk Enchants_ wrote: »

That's a US article/blogger, from memory the average UK and Ireland HC is 19 point something.

Sorry saw the Blogspot.ie

slave1

Just did a quick average from HowdidIdo on where I play most and the average is 15.57 across 397 male golfers...highest being -28.0 and lowest being +2.3 (Moate)

neckedit

slave1 wrote:

Just did a quick average from HowdidIdo on where I play most and the average is 15.57 across 397 male golfers...highest being -28.0 and lowest being +2.3 (Moate)

I would say thats pretty spot on. There was a global survey a few years back and I'm fairly sure 16 was the average.

Sean_pop

I read somewhere last year that it was something like 14.3 for men and 26.5 for women.

That was a global average though.

PARlance

An interesting angle on this, if possible to get, would be to compare the average HC now with 10,15,20 years ago.

I would guess that the average has probably remained fairly constant over time.
This despite the mass availability of better shafts, DMD's, free online tuitorials, clubs that will go 30 yards further as well as make a cup of tea for you. All things that should see the average tumble?

On the other side, it could be argued the new longer courses with 100+ bunkers may be working against that. But the majority of golfers don't play on courses created in the last 20 years.

It would be interesting to see the reduction, if any, over the years.

neckedit

PARlance wrote:

An interesting angle on this, if possible to get, would be to compare the average HC now with 10,15,20 years ago.

The survey I was speaking of was originally carried out in 85' and again in 00'......I've broken Google trying to find a link to it......I believe it was carried out by Golf World Magazine.....but over the 15 year gap there was a .3 difference in handicap with The avg being around 16......I'll continue the search for the survey.

cgh

just checked my own club, The Heath,
there are 324 male members with the following,
Lowest is +1.2
highest is 28
average is 16.7

i'm 66th on the list with 12.7

mike12

The average handicap in the states hasn't change in the last 30 years 16.3. Think the reason is almost every course has either gotten harder and even older shorter courses will have trees that get bigger each year making them tighter and harder.
Plus you have a lot of people that are now playing golf compared to 30 years ago and most newbies have high handicaps to start.

mike12

Checked My club average exact is 15.25. Average Paying is 15.3

saintastic

Carton House average 14.2
Powerscourt average 16.85
Glen of the Downs average 18.35

the lawman

Anyone wanna work out the average from our own handicap table?

Rikand step forward.....

slave1

for the craic, Slievemahon, rakes of members with N/A beside their name but even still, 1,373 male members with a 17.12 average

benny79

How do you find out the average at your club?

mike12

benny79 wrote: »

How do you find out the average at your club?

If you are on how did i do or master scoreboard just take the handicap list dump it into excel and work out the average.

Is Glen of the Downs a distance/pay as you play course. So our 2 highest so far are distance membership type places?

It would be interesting if we did this and included SSS and Par for each course see if it does effect the average.

Badger2009

Would it be fair point to say that the reason the average handicap has not changed significantly over the years is that everyone is playing to be better standard and benefitting from equipment improvements?

Handicaps will always be relative to everyone else so perhaps an analysis of CSS would show improvements over the last 20-30 years.

I think a 15 handicap player now would be able to outscore a 15 handicap from 30 years ago. They will have better length, more forgiveness in the clubs etc. etc.

I could be going a bit off topic though!

Keano

the lawman wrote: »

Anyone wanna work out the average from our own handicap table?

Rikand step forward.....

15.54

saintastic

mike12 wrote: »

Is Glen of the Downs a distance/pay as you play course. So our 2 highest so far are distance membership type places?

No, full membership course. Even though the course is generally in fantastic condition throughout the summer, the membership has historically been expensive and wouldn't attract high calibre golfers. High calibre golfers tend to go to Powerscourt (not that much more expensive), Bray or Greystones which would have some excellent golfers.

Boskowski

Average will obviously differ from club to club depending on membership structure, course difficulty etc.

Tramore
639 members between +1 and 28. Avg 17.2.

Which makes me (just about) above average (16).

BraveDonut

Anyone know how an Irish handicap compares to an American? My experience is that when you compare, they are realistically a few shots higher than we are.

PARlance

Badger2009 wrote: »

Would it be fair point to say that the reason the average handicap has not changed significantly over the years is that everyone is playing to be better standard and benefitting from equipment improvements?

Handicaps will always be relative to everyone else so perhaps an analysis of CSS would show improvements over the last 20-30 years.

I think a 15 handicap player now would be able to outscore a 15 handicap from 30 years ago. They will have better length, more forgiveness in the clubs etc. etc.

I could be going a bit off topic though!

I don't think that's the case, I can see where you're going with the CSS angle but I don't think that holds true.
If there was genuine improvements, then the low HC players would be shooting lower scores and in turn they would be getting lower and lower and bringing everyone along with them too... So you would see a shift downwards.

The US handicap system is much different to our own, and CSS or competitive golf scoring makes up a very small part of theirs. The HC hasn't changed there and it is heavily based on what Joe Bloggs goes out and shoots in a casual round. So CSS hasn't really been there to keep the average constant.

I don't think a 15 HC'er would outscore someone at that level from 30 years ago. What we have gained in technology, we have probably lost in the fundamentals such as course management

Badger2009

PARlance wrote: »

I don't think that's the case, I can see where you're going with the CSS angle but I don't think that holds true.
If there was genuine improvements, then the low HC players would be shooting lower scores and in turn they would be getting lower and lower and bringing everyone along with them too... So you would see a shift downwards.

The US handicap system is much different to our own, and CSS or competitive golf scoring makes up a very small part of theirs. The HC hasn't changed there and it is heavily based on what Joe Bloggs goes out and shoots in a casual round. So CSS hasn't really been there to keep the average constant.

I don't think a 15 HC'er would outscore someone at that level from 30 years ago. What we have gained in technology, we have probably lost in the fundamentals such as course management

I think the improvements in technology make less of a difference to lower handicap players thus their scores will not have changed dramatically. Whereas mid-high handicaps will gain a lot with newer drivers and game improvement irons and see big improvements. I suppose that most of the game is still played in and around the greens and no amount of technology will help with that!

I agree that the improvements in technology have caused deficiencies in other parts of the game as the clubs will usually get you out of trouble!

PARlance

Badger2009 wrote: »

I agree that the improvements in technology have caused deficiencies in other parts of the game as the clubs will usually get you out of trouble!

Or the improvements will help get you into trouble too... 30 yards further into trouble

Re the lower guys not receiving as much help from technology... I don't agree with that at all, they are the guys that can actually use the improvements/advances.

I'm sure a lot of low guys would struggle a bit around the greens with the balls they were using 30 years ago compared to a ProV of today.

Badger2009

I used to love playing around with a tour balata around the greens. I think it was one of the easiest balls to control I ever used. A newer professional 90 was good too.

slave1

Badger2009 wrote: »

I used to love playing around with a tour balata around the greens. I think it was one of the easiest balls to control I ever used. A newer professional 90 was good too.

Found 18 brand new tour balatas in the attic the other day, still in box from a decade ago, intend on using them over Winter maybe

Rikand

the lawman wrote: »

Anyone wanna work out the average from our own handicap table?

Rikand step forward.....

I was going to wait till we had a final list of updates and then do a comparison between average at the start of the year and average at the finish!

saintastic

I reckon the reason there hasn't been much change to handicaps over the years is that the average time spent practicing hasn't changed.

I would imagine each handicap category spend on average the same time practicing as they did 5, 10, 15 and 20 years ago.

saintastic

PARlance wrote: »

The US handicap system is much different to our own, and CSS or competitive golf scoring makes up a very small part of theirs. The HC hasn't changed there and it is heavily based on what Joe Bloggs goes out and shoots in a casual round. So CSS hasn't really been there to keep the average constant.

US handicaps are based on your 10 best scores in the last 20. There is an adjustment for each score that you shoot for the tees that you are playing on the day called a course rating and also then for the difficulty of the course, the slope rating.

If you play with your buddies every week and you all give each other gimmees and kick balls out of the rough and all submit your scores that you think you shot, your handicap won't be accurate.

But on the other side of things, if you play in a regular society where you are playing for prizes, your opponents will obviously track your score and insist that you submit the right score. The scores that you shoot are submitted to the USGA and your handicap is based on this.

There is a view out there that the USGA handicap system is actually better as it makes more adjustments for the course difficulty, for example, is a 5 handicapper from Leopardstown Golf Club (no offence to any members) the same 5 handicap as a 5 handicap from Tralee. The USGA system makes adjustments for this.

PARlance

saintastic wrote: »

US handicaps are based on your 10 best scores in the last 20. There is an adjustment for each score that you shoot for the tees that you are playing on the day called a course rating and also then for the difficulty of the course, the slope rating.

If you play with your buddies every week and you all give each other gimmees and kick balls out of the rough and all submit your scores that you think you shot, your handicap won't be accurate.

But on the other side of things, if you play in a regular society where you are playing for prizes, your opponents will obviously track your score and insist that you submit the right score. The scores that you shoot are submitted to the USGA and your handicap is based on this.

There is a view out there that the USGA handicap system is actually better as it makes more adjustments for the course difficulty, for example, is a 5 handicapper from Leopardstown Golf Club (no offence to any members) the same 5 handicap as a 5 handicap from Tralee. The USGA system makes adjustments for this.

It wouldn't be my view that the US system is better.
I do like the course rating and slope element to it but in general it is way more open to abuse and would kill the game here. Your handicap can increase way too much in the space of 20 (casual or competitive) rounds. Wide open to abuse.

The US system is much more suited to casual golf, and that's what most of them play. I've seen guys off single figures that haven't played in a competitive round.
The vanity HC element also discredits the system imo.