Job Seekers Allowence query

sub3wannabe

Hi, I have a meeting tomorrow morning with a deciding officer on my application for JSA. I have a pretty unique set of circumstances and am just wondering do you think I will be entitled to it.

I live at home with my dad. Am 26 years of age. My father is quite wealthy, a property developer. For tax reasons I think some of his portfolio is in my name but I don't have access to these, rental income etc. I worked with him on a non contractual basis since I left college 3 years ago. I pay him 50 euro a week for bed and board. I have 100 euro of savings left in my account. He has no work for me at the moment and has basically told me to fend for myself.

Cheers.

Nomis21

Did your father pay PRSI for you when you worked for him?

Did he give you a P45 when you stopped working for him...?

Do you have any payslips for the time you worked for him...?

A contract of employment?

If the answer is "No" to all these then you might have to wait up to 9 weeks.

Batzoo

I'm no legal eagle, but I imagine if the property is in your name, its yours. You say it was done for tax reasons (Not judging), just be careful that you don't get lumbered with some outrageous tax bill and get left to "fend for yourself".

I have been in and out of the social welfare office a few times over the years and it is never easy to get a straight answer from the people who work there. They don't seem to want to volunteer information, so you have to ask specific questions.

Ultimately, your fathers wealth is his business and none of yours or the social welfare's. You have no income and no savings as such. You will be entitled to a welfare payment of some sort. If you have the paperwork and the "stamps" you should be entitled to Jobseekers benefit, otherwise you will have to apply for Jobseekers allowance.

As you say you have a meeting in the morning for JSA. Be careful what you say and don't get caught in a lie. Don't volunteer any information, only answer the questions that are asked. The truth seems to be that you have no income, have no savings and are seeking work. Stick to this and there will be no reason to refuse you.

DanDublin1982

Don't volunteer information? Seriously? That's terrible advice. The social welfare can only make a determination based on the facts, not a version of the facts. Not volunteering information can/will lead to future problems.

OP if the property is in your name then it is yours and most likely will be assessed against you. It may be different if the property was held in trust but what you've described is not that, the property is legally yours.

The questions around whether your dad was paying tax and prsi for you are important. An employer isn't exempt from such things because they are related to their employee. The case could very well be sent to a social welfare inspector to investigate that.

sub3wannabe

Hi guys, thanks for all your comments/suggestions. I met them today and am referred to an inspector who will either visit my home or ask me to come in again. The lady was very friendly and helpful and seemed to accept my unique set of circumstances. On the face of it, it may seem unfair for a son of a wealthy father to receive assistance but what am I supposed to do? He's cut me off and told me to fend for myself. I have 200 euro in savings and that's it. Have no access to any other source of income that I know of. Properties in my name obviously have rental income but they go somehwere I'm not aware of, possibly to service loans etc. I really want to make my own way in life, make up cv 's, go for job interviews, do courses etc but you need working capital for that and a steady, consistent supply of funds, even a 100 quid a week, that's all I ask!

Balagan

You are 26 years old so your father's wealth will not come into it. What will, most definitely, come into it if you are claiming the means tested Jobseekers Allowance, is the property you own and are not living in. You need to find out the entirety of your property portfolio and have documentation to hand for the meeting with the inspector.

How capital and property not personally used is assessed

Capital includes property (except for your own home), savings and investments.

If you (or your spouse, civil partner or cohabitant) own property that you are not personally using or if you have investments or any other form of capital, the value is assessed, using a standard formula. You may or may not be getting an income from the property or investment. (The only exception to this is where an Increase for a Qualified Adult is being assessed for a social insurance payment. In this case, if a property is let the rental income is assessed rather than the capital value.)

The property and investments that may be assessed under this heading include savings in a bank account (or anywhere else), a house that you have let and stocks and shares. If you or your spouse, civil partner or cohabitant saves a portion of your social welfare payment each week, these savings as well as savings from most other sources will be taken into account as part of your means.

The standard formula for assessing the value of capital for all social welfare payments (except Disability Allowance and Supplementary Welfare Allowance) is:

Capital
Weekly means assessed

First €20,000 Nil
Next €10,000 €1 per €1,000
Next €10,000 €2 per €1,000
Balance €4 per €1,000
For Disability Allowance the first €50,000 of capital is not taken into account. For Supplementary Welfare Allowance the first €5,000 of capital is not taken into account. Capital is not assessed in the means test for Family Income Supplement.

More information is available in our document, Capital and social welfare payments. http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/social_welfare/irish_social_welfare_system/means_test_for_social_welfare_payments/means_test.html

MouseTail

You are an adult, and you really need to sort out this mess. Having assets in your name affects your tax liability, your entitlement to social welfare, your ability to set up a business, your ability to borrow in the future etc.
As a young person starting out in life, such assets should never have been put in your name without you getting independent advice. It is unethical. You need to get your father to extradite you from this in a way that will have no future implications, and you need independent advice.

Batzoo

DanDublin1982 wrote: »

Don't volunteer information? Seriously? That's terrible advice.

That's the best advice I have ever been given and I would advise everybody to adhere to it in all future endeavors.

I understand where you are coming from and clarity in dealing with these state institutions is very important. You should always cross the T's and dot the I's I agree. But give no more information than asked for on the numerous forms that you have to fill in, it will only muddy the process and delay inevitable payment. Also by volunteering too much information the OP will most likely drag his father into a tax/revenue situation which I do not think is their intention.

But in the OP's situation, I would not have volunteered information about the fathers wealth because it is none of his or their business and cannot be assessed or used against him . And on the properties owned, I would only have provided information if specifically asked.

Ultimately, the property in the OP's name is his regardless of how he spins it and this is where his claim will stall. He should not have volunteered this information IMHO.☺

Batzoo

MouseTail wrote: »

You are an adult, and you really need to sort out this mess. Having assets in your name affects your tax liability, your entitlement to social welfare, your ability to set up a business, your ability to borrow in the future etc.
As a young person starting out in life, such assets should never have been put in your name without you getting independent advice. It is unethical. You need to get your father to extradite you from this in a way that will have no future implications, and you need independent advice.

The elephant in the room...
I don't believe the OP is a naive as his post makes out regarding the property in his name or its uses. Read between the lines.

DanDublin1982

That's fraud though. I agree with you that his fathers money is his own business but for him not to declare property that he knows is in his name would be fraud. There is indeed questions around whether or not you have property on the forms in question.

cee_jay

batzoo infracted for advocating SW fraud, do not post on this thread again