Sold Irish Reg car in UK

Sclosages

What does one do with the registration book? Do you send it to Shannon, to get them to change it over? Will you incur UK duty or some other such shenanigans for selling it still with an Irish reg?

CiniO

Sclosages wrote: »

What does one do with the registration book? Do you send it to Shannon, to get them to change it over? Will you incur UK duty or some other such shenanigans for selling it still with an Irish reg?

If you want to sell Irish car to person non-resident in Ireland, you need to hand him down your VRC (logbook).

There is some risk associated with it though, as there is no system in Ireland of notifying registartion authority (shannon) that you sold the car for export.
So your car will indefinitely be hanging on their system as your, and you will be registered owner, even if car is long time ago re-registered in new country (f.e. UK).
Obviously risk is very low in that case, but if person who bought it decides to take car to Ireland with your old reg and commit some traffic offences, you will be assumed to be liable.

Bigus

Sclosages wrote: »

What does one do with the registration book? Do you send it to Shannon, to get them to change it over? Will you incur UK duty or some other such shenanigans for selling it still with an Irish reg?

Take a copy of the vlc, give original to exporter, and send letter to Shannon with copy of vlc and address of new foreign owner.

CiniO

Bigus wrote: »

Take a copy of the vlc, give original to exporter, and send letter to Shannon with copy of vlc and address of new foreign owner.

As far as I heard, Shannon won't be interested.

Sclosages

Sorry, I didn't make things clear.
I brought my car over to London when I moved a couple of weeks ago.
There was no way I could afford to run it here, so I sold it 3 days after having moved here.
The buyers (Iraqi's or Iranians perhaps) filled in the form, as you would do when selling a car in Ireland - so I have the reg thing filled in.
I have this form, ready to send off.
Do I send it to Shannon or to somewhere in England?

CiniO

Sclosages wrote: »

Sorry, I didn't make things clear.
I brought my car over to London when I moved a couple of weeks ago.
There was no way I could afford to run it here, so I sold it 3 days after having moved here.
The buyers (Iraqi's or Iranians perhaps) filled in the form, as you would do when selling a car in Ireland - so I have the reg thing filled in.
I have this form, ready to send off.
Do I send it to Shannon or to somewhere in England?

I suppose you can just keep it now, no difference.

Whoever bought this car, will have a huge trouble trying to register it anywhere, including UK.

Most likely he will be back to you to pick this document up from you in a while, assuming he still has any contact to you.


No point in sending it anywhere. As Shannon will refuse it, as new buyers address in not in Ireland, and DVLA in England will refuse it as well, as Irish VRC is none of their business.

Mech1

You have exported your car. depending on the make / model / year there maybe a little windfall for you as in reclaimed VRT.

https://www.ros.ie/evrt-enquiry/vrtenquiry.html?execution=e1s2

Sclosages

CiniO wrote: »

I suppose you can just keep it now, no difference.

Whoever bought this car, will have a huge trouble trying to register it anywhere, including UK.

Most likely he will be back to you to pick this document up from you in a while, assuming he still has any contact to you.

I think he was intending to bring it to Romania or Iran or Iraq or somewhere.

CiniO

Sclosages wrote: »

I think he was intending to bring it to Romania or Iran or Iraq or somewhere.

He would still need your logbook to do that.

Sclosages

Mech1 wrote: »

You have exported your car. depending on the make / model / year there maybe a little windfall for you as in reclaimed VRT.

https://www.ros.ie/evrt-enquiry/vrtenquiry.html?execution=e1s2

Sits up!

How do I go about getting money lol.

CiniO

Mech1 wrote: »

You have exported your car. depending on the make / model / year there maybe a little windfall for you as in reclaimed VRT.

https://www.ros.ie/evrt-enquiry/vrtenquiry.html?execution=e1s2

Too late now.
OP should have done VRT export inspection before he left Ireland if he wanted to get VRT refund.

Sclosages

CiniO wrote: »

He would still need your logbook to do that.

Yes, well, I still have it here to post to Shannon, but I can't find an effin post office here while I have the envelope. So it's been about 10 days now.

Should I send the log book with his details to Shannon or what do I do?

Sclosages

CiniO wrote: »

Too late now.
OP should have done VRT export inspection before he left Ireland if he wanted to get VRT refund.

I didn't export it. I drove over in it lol.

Bigus

CiniO wrote: »

As far as I heard, Shannon won't be interested.

Yes they are , and if the shït hits the fan it's recorded as exported on the file.

Sclosages

Bigus wrote: »

Yes they are , and if the shït hits the fan it's recorded as exported on the file.

Is this a bad thing?

Bigus

Sclosages wrote: »

Yes, well, I still have it here to post to Shannon, but I can't find an effin post office here while I have the envelope. So it's been about 10 days now.

Should I send the log book with his details to Shannon or what do I do?

Yes

CiniO

Sclosages wrote: »

Yes, well, I still have it here to post to Shannon, but I can't find an effin post office here while I have the envelope. So it's been about 10 days now.

Should I send the log book with his details to Shannon or what do I do?

I told you already.

Absolutely no point in sending the logbook to Shannon, unless he (the buyer) is Irish resident with Irish address and that's the address you filled in the logbook - which I doubt as what you said above suggests opposite.

Keep the logbook and wait for him to contact you to get it off you.
If you want to be nice, you might contact him, and post logbook to him.

Nothing else you can do really.

Sclosages

Bigus wrote: »

Yes

Grand. Will I have to pay money?

CiniO

Bigus wrote: »

Yes they are , and if the shït hits the fan it's recorded as exported on the file.

Any proof or link to confirm this?

CiniO

Sclosages wrote: »

I didn't export it. I drove over in it lol.

Well, so you exported it.

Sclosages

CiniO wrote: »

I told you already.

Absolutely no point in sending the logbook to Shannon, unless he (the buyer) is Irish resident with Irish address and that's the address you filled in the logbook - which I doubt as what you said above suggests opposite.

Keep the logbook and wait for him to contact you to get it off you.
If you want to be nice, you might contact him, and post logbook to him.

Nothing else you can do really.

We actually had discussions about this when selling. He had an interpreter guy with him. He wanted to know all about the tax/registration. I hadn't a clue. He wanted to take the log book, but anytime I've bought a car in Ireland, the seller sends the log-book away.
Anyway - I guess I'll just send the log-book off to Shannon? It has his UK address on it?

Sclosages

CiniO wrote: »

Well, so you exported it.

Right. So what does that mean?

CiniO

Sclosages wrote: »

We actually had discussions about this when selling. He had an interpreter guy with him. He wanted to know all about the tax/registration. I hadn't a clue. He wanted to take the log book

And rightly so. He was entitled to it.
Now he is probably waiting for new logbook in his name, which will never arrive. Without it his car he bought of you is useless. Poor fella didn't really know what he was doing.

, but anytime I've bought a car in Ireland, the seller sends the log-book away.

That's true. It's the procedure when buying (selling) car between people living in Ireland.
However what you described is not the case.

Anyway - I guess I'll just send the log-book off to Shannon? It has his UK address on it?

Well you can send it. But as I told you. They won't be interested. They won't do anything about it. Probably just bin it.
Fella that bought the car off you, will end up with piece of metal which he will only be able to scrap.
If you have some decency, just keep to logbook, and wait for him to come to pick it up.

Sclosages

CiniO wrote: »

And rightly so. He was entitled to it.
Now he is probably waiting for new logbook in his name, which will never arrive. Without it his car he bought of you is useless. Poor fella didn't really know what he was doing.


That's true. It's the procedure when buying (selling) car between people living in Ireland.
However what you described is not the case.



Well you can send it. But as I told you. They won't be interested. They won't do anything about it. Probably just bin it.
Fella that bought the car off you, will end up with piece of metal which he will only be able to scrap.
If you have some decency, just keep to logbook, and wait for him to come to pick it up.

Jaysis - I didn't mean to scam the fecker! I have his address on the log-book. Should I post log-book to him?

CiniO

Sclosages wrote: »

Right. So what does that mean?

Taking car abroad is exporting.
How much was your car worth? VRT refund it only applicable when VRT on a car is worth more than 500 euro (so generally for cars of value over 2000 euro approx depending on CO2 emissions).

However in that particular case, even if you didn VRT export inspection, chances of you getting refund would be very small, as you would need to get document, that car was either registered abroad or exported outside EU. Considering you didn't even give VRC to new owner, I doubt he will give you any of above mentioned documents.

Sclosages

CiniO wrote: »

Taking car abroad is exporting.
How much was your car worth? VRT refund it only applicable when VRT on a car is worth more than 500 euro (so generally for cars of value over 2000 euro approx depending on CO2 emissions).

However in that particular case, even if you didn VRT export inspection, chances of you getting refund would be very small, as you would need to get document, that car was either registered abroad or exported outside EU. Considering you didn't even give VRC to new owner, I doubt he will give you any of above mentioned documents.

I sold him the car for £500.
Would the correct thing to do be to post him the form and let him sort it out?
I assumed I should just post to Shannon as usual.

CiniO

Sclosages wrote: »

Jaysis - I didn't mean to scam the fecker! I have his address on the log-book. Should I post log-book to him?

I would.

As Bigos advised as well take a copy of it (or two) and you can send one copy to Shannon. Keep other for your own reference.
I'm of the opinion that Shannon won't do anything about it, but Bigus says they will mark it as exported, once you send them a copy with letter stating car was sold to foreigner.
In either option, they won't send new logbook to the buyer, so sending it to Shannon won't help the buyer in anyway. Only person who can help him now is you.

Sclosages

CiniO wrote: »

I would.

As Bigos advised as well take a copy of it (or two) and you can send one copy to Shannon. Keep other for your own reference.
I'm of the opinion that Shannon won't do anything about it, but Bigus says they will mark it as exported, once you send them a copy with letter stating car was sold to foreigner.
In either option, they won't send new logbook to the buyer, so sending it to Shannon won't help the buyer in anyway. Only person who can help him now is you.

Grand, I'll take a couple of copies, post him the original and do nothing else? I'll send a copy then to Shannon.
Gosh, we had a discussion for about 10 minutes as to who should have the log book and I was going on Irish criteria, so wasn't letting him off with it lol.
I'll post the log book to himself after copying it and sending a copy to Shannon.
Will the poor bastard be able to use the car?

Sclosages

Have to print off something else tomorrow, so can do photocoyping at same time. Would feel desperate if the poor ****er was screwed. That said, he got a bargain!

CiniO

Sclosages wrote: »

Grand, I'll take a couple of copies, post him the original and do nothing else? I'll send a copy then to Shannon.
Gosh, we had a discussion for about 10 minutes as to who should have the log book and I was going on Irish criteria, so wasn't letting him off with it lol.
I'll post the log book to himself after copying it and sending a copy to Shannon.
Will the poor bastard be able to use the car?

Well with the logbook, he will be able to register it in country of destination (whatever that will be UK, or Romania, or Irak, Iran, etc..)
Without it, all he would be able to do with the car is scrap it.

CiniO

Sclosages wrote: »

Have to print off something else tomorrow, so can do photocoyping at same time. Would feel desperate if the poor ****er was screwed. That said, he got a bargain!

What was the car out of curiosity?

Sclosages

CiniO wrote: »

Well with the logbook, he will be able to register it in country of destination (whatever that will be UK, or Romania, or Irak, Iran, etc..)
Without it, all he would be able to do with the car is scrap it.

Sound.
He was asking me all about reg in UK and I told him to leave it with Irish plates lol.
Anyway, I'll post it off to him tomorrow.
Thanks for advice. Not used to selling cars in UK! Had fully intended to keep it over here until I discovered parking and congestion charges.

Sclosages

CiniO wrote: »

What was the car out of curiosity?

02 Santa Fe.

kay 9

Call Shannon and find out the correct procedure lad. Saves all this hassle

corktina

Just post it off to Shannon and take no notice of advice from strangers.

You could include a note saying it has been exported....the important thing is to get it away from you so that there would be no comeback one day. If the guy doesn't have paperwork, more fool him, he'd have been back for it if he cared, probably using it to strip railway signal wires or something in which case you want it out of your name.

CiniO

corktina wrote: »

Just post it off to Shannon and take no notice of advice from strangers.

You could include a note saying it has been exported....the important thing is to get it away from you so that there would be no comeback one day. If the guy doesn't have paperwork, more fool him, he'd have been back for it if he cared, probably using it to strip railway signal wires or something in which case you want it out of your name.

Well posting it to Shannon won't take it off OPs name, so thats not any good.
Shannon won't take car off registered owner name unless they register car under new owner. And in that case it's clearly impossible as buyer doesn't live in Ireland.

And buyer didn't take paperwork not because he didn't want to, but because OP convinced him that correct procedure is to send it Shannon, which it isn't. Buyer might be waiting now for logbook from Shannon which he'll never receive.

You are telling OP not to take advice fro strangers (me), but you are also a stranger giving advice to OP, which unfortunately is incorrect advice.

bear1

Something doesn't add up here.
You brought your car to the UK, sold it for sweet shag all, advised the buyer to keep it on Irish plates (why?) didn't bother giving the logbook to the new owner, now you have said logbook with the new owners name and you don't know where to send it.
I don't mean to sound harsh but you really should have done your homework regarding this before actually selling the car.
You have 2 options the way I see it. Either you send the logbook off to Shannon with a note saying the car now belongs to a UK resident or you contact the owner and explain the situation. You'd be nearly better off refunding the 500 and bringing it back to Ireland and selling it yourself.
I mean the fact that the person needed a translator to buy the car would have me a bit suspicious and then saying that the car would be exported again to a country either in Europe or the Middle East would be another warning.

corktina

CiniO wrote: »

Well posting it to Shannon won't take it off OPs name, so thats not any good.
Shannon won't take car off registered owner name unless they register car under new owner. And in that case it's clearly impossible as buyer doesn't live in Ireland.

And buyer didn't take paperwork not because he didn't want to, but because OP convinced him that correct procedure is to send it Shannon, which it isn't. Buyer might be waiting now for logbook from Shannon which he'll never receive.

You are telling OP not to take advice fro strangers (me), but you are also a stranger giving advice to OP, which unfortunately is incorrect advice.

Not the OPs concern. It isn't his concern that the buyer had a foriegn address, He will be following the procedure laid down by sending it off. The only offbeat thing is that he was in the UK at the time but Shannon don't ask that and don't need to know.

Bigus

Bigus wrote: »

Take a copy of the vlc, give original to exporter, and send letter to Shannon with copy of vlc and address of new foreign owner.

I'll repeat myself.

And Cinio I have this from the horses mouth in Shannon ,so no link, everything isn't on the Internet yet .

This process Being done multiple times previously, so it works.

CiniO

Bigus wrote: »

I'll repeat myself.

And Cinio I have this from the horses mouth in Shannon ,so no link, everything isn't on the Internet yet .

This process Being done multiple times previously, so it works.

Well I found some old thread in relation to this:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=69628809&postcount=14

Poster claims he got response from Shannon in relation to this:

When selling a car registered in the Republic of Ireland - outside the state, the Vehicle Registration Certificate should be given to the new owner. They will need this document to register the car in their own country. When the car is re registered, the authorities in that country will inform the Department of Transport in Ireland and the vehicle will be recorded as 'exported' on the National Computer database.

So according to this, they don't advice to send a copy and data of new owner personally.

But surely it sending them a copy will do no harm. If there's even a slightest chance it will save some problem, then why not. Post stamp is only 60c AFAIR.

CiniO

corktina wrote: »

Not the OPs concern. It isn't his concern that the buyer had a foriegn address, He will be following the procedure laid down by sending it off.

Well of course it should be his concern.
Procedure of filling in new owner details in VRC and sending it to Shannon, applies when two people living in Ireland proceed the transaction.
If you sell car to person resident outside Ireland, you don't follow that procedure, instead you need to hand VRC to new owner. There's no other way of doing it. Without VRC car is useless for new owner.

The only offbeat thing is that he was in the UK at the time but Shannon don't ask that and don't need to know.

Well I don't really understand what are you trying to say here.
OP sold a car to person living outside Ireland, and didn't follow the right procedure of giving him logbook. Buyer wanted the logbook, but OP convinced him (incorrectly) that correct prodecedure is to send it off to shannon.

Indeed - there's big fault on buyer side, as he shouldn't accept it, and shouldn't pay for a car where seller doesn't want to give logbook. But most likely through his stupidity, he believed OP and took the car without necessery document (VRC).

Now OP can help to correct this mistake, by sending logbook to buyer.
But, you are advising him, not to do it - why?

Would you be happy if someone shifted you like that like you are advising OP to shift that poor buyer? Without VRC car is useless for him.

GSBellew

We took a trade in a while back which ended up being exported to the UK.

I spoke the Shannon as the original owners were concerned about the motortax implications of the car being exported and so on.

Advice from Shannon was for me to send them a covering letter with a copy of the Irish registration certificate stating that the car has been permanently exported and that they would mark it as exported for us.

So my advice would be to send a letter and keep copies of all that you do send.
Even if they were to file it in the shredder the fact that you can show you notified them of an export would be of benefit if any thing ever did come back to the op about the car.

Marcusm

GSBellew wrote: »

We took a trade in a while back which ended up being exported to the UK.

I spoke the Shannon as the original owners were concerned about the motortax implications of the car being exported and so on.

Advice from Shannon was for me to send them a covering letter with a copy of the Irish registration certificate stating that the car has been permanently exported and that they would mark it as exported for us.

So my advice would be to send a letter and keep copies of all that you do send.
Even if they were to file it in the shredder the fact that you can show you notified them of an export would be of benefit if any thing ever did come back to the op about the car.

And this is the sensible advice which costs little but would be great f value in the event of comeback.

derry

The processes in the EU countries is simple enough .When the new owner in some EU country wants to import the car to their country they go their own registration office who contact the other office such as Ireland . With successful import to new country the Irish office for example would then take the number out of the registry as registered as exported . if this guy goes to the UK office he can easily get the car registered to Uk plates with the Irish log book as proof of ownership and pay some fees that the UK charges .The UK fees are often much less than the Irish fees where in ROI we charge VRT and VAT and the rest . Some countries in the EU can charge a lot like Denmark with similar high type VRT. Some countries in the EU will accept a contract sales form with a Lawyers as witness to sale (notarized) and dont need the log books then .

As the EU harmonizes the car ownership registration legal system it is possible Irish cars sold to non Irish in EU Europe could in the near future leave you open to traffic and parking fines from far off countries and risk you having to pay those fines due to their laws exceeding Irish laws.
Thats the theory but so far many UK in Spain who sold their UK cars to many peoples like Moroccans non EU people who sometimes run up many problems like parking fines .Then previous registered British owners when they get those Spanish parking fines back in the UK use them for toilet paper . Hard to know when the EU will make all systems work together .

Japanese imports in the ROI are nearly impossible to import into most EU countries without serious modifications to make them conform to EU standards .The French Spanish as major car makers dont want Japanese car imports there so make it very difficult to import them compared to ROI where we dont make cars .They will look for full car details which involves the full specs a car has . A big importing company with many staff would have this solution to deal with importing in thousands of one type of a non EU car . Joe soaps often cant meet this bureaucratic hurdle easily so like me give up and abandon the Japanese Irish reg car in some part of the EU as too expensive to bring home and impossible to import to the rest of the EU

Outside of ROI export is totally different in each individual country so no point to discuss all ~160 other countries importing systems .

My guess is the Iraq guy brought the car to Romania and sold it for profit.
.In Romania papers for cars are often bank notes given to police who ask questions and the police stop to ask questions when they see enough money.
However the Irish reg car might go on tour of Europe with lots of Romanian gypsies stuffed inside it and may even go to Ireland :eek:

It looks like it is easy money to bring more junk Irish cars like that one to London and do roaring trade in ROI cars with no papers . When people want to buy cars in the ROI they can easy fill in forms with name like Paddy Murpy at some address road or similar non existent .address.The car wont show as stolen for the EU cops but ownership will be in the air so to speak . Then drink the easy not illegal money to be had with no legal risk to you . Looks like you exposed and opened a legal can of worms for the EU to scratch their heads with as Irish junkers flood into the EU with non existant owners like Paddy Murphy pike hill crossroads Killkenny Co Carlow Ireland . I can see it now in my minds eye paddy Murpy will incurr the most speeding fines the most parking fines in all the EU and god help you if you are real paddy Murphy on holiday in the EU in Irish reg car



Derry

Fred Swanson

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