Medicare Levy Exemption

Sundy

Got an interesting letter in the post today from the Tax office asking for a copy of my Medicare levy exemption letter for my 2013 Tax return. I assume this means the 2012 - 2013 year?

Anybody else receive one of these letters?

mandrake04

Hardly a surprise, its that time of the year.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=91296247

I'm sure there will be plenty receiving letters for years '14, '13, 12 etc

Sundy

mandrake04 wrote: »

Hardly a surprise, its that time of the year.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=91296247

I'm sure there will be plenty receiving letters for years '14, '13, 12 etc

Yeah I have my Certs just wasn't expecting to provide a cope of the very. I thought they would be able to do a cross reference easily enough!

jackbhoy

Sundy wrote: »

Yeah I have my Certs just wasn't expecting to provide a cope of the very. I thought they would be able to do a cross reference easily enough!

Yep, got one too.

I was overseas when it arrived so had to call to get an extension as 28 days were nearly up.

I asked the ATO person is it really required given ROI citizens are not entitled to Medicare anyway. She went off and ask her boss who said they are auditing a lot of Irish citizens as they got conflicting info from Medicare about eligibility.

Maybe they could sit down with Medicare and sort this out rather than auditing thousands of people, I suggested. Silence descended

mandrake04

jackbhoy wrote: »

I asked the ATO person is it really required given ROI citizens are not entitled to Medicare anyway. She went off and ask her boss who said they are auditing a lot of Irish citizens as they got conflicting info from Medicare about eligibility.

Not all cases are that straight forward.

If you are from ROI but lived in NI, UK, Finland etc directly before moving to Australia then you are entitled medicare as it goes by your residence rather than nationality.

The onus is on the person claiming an exemption to

a) apply for an exemption certificate.
b) present certificate when asked.

The default is you get taxed for medicare unless you can pony up with a cert, if you want the exemption then you do the donkey work yourself.

Just to add: the Boss is likely correct, if you are from the 6 counties and only lived there (have never lived in 26 counties) but only have an Irish passport then you are never going to be exempt. For Aussies the ROI/NI and the access to Irish passports is confusing that's why there is conflicting info from Medicare.

I think people need to look at the big picture rather than look at the usual beermat over pub talk.

catbear

What I don't get is why need for every year? Once the exemption has been established that should be it as it's not like your preexisting status will suddenly change.
I guess it keeps a few staffers occupied in Tasmania.

mandrake04

catbear wrote: »

What I don't get is why need for every year? Once the exemption has been established that should be it as it's not like your preexisting status will suddenly change.
I guess it keeps a few staffers occupied in Tasmania.

Not necessarily

Status definitely can suddenly change, if like the OP and you had lodged a PR visa application then you are not exempt (partly) as lodging a PR application entitles you to medicare wether you enrolled or not.

Dept human services is unable to know this due to immigration privacy etc, immigration and ATO have powers to cross check with each other but not DHS unless if suspected of doing something wrong.

As above the default is tax for medicare, it's up to you to prove an exemption.

catbear

Ah right. I was looking at it as a non PR applicant.

Sundy

I don't mind applying each year at all, its more the attitude of the letter from the tax office.
Basically says that 'We have been unable to confirm your eligibility for the medicare levy exemption so if we hear nothing from you in 28 days we will adjust your tax return.'

Lots of my mates work away for more than 28 days so how would that pan out?

mandrake04

Sundy wrote: »

I don't mind applying each year at all, its more the attitude of the letter from the tax office.
Basically says that 'We have been unable to confirm your eligibility for the medicare levy exemption so if we hear nothing from you in 28 days we will adjust your tax return.'

Lots of my mates work away for more than 28 days so how would that pan out?

Yeah what about the clown in the other thread advising people not to bother, looks like a right muppet now.

mandrake04

catbear wrote: »

Ah right. I was looking at it as a non PR applicant.

Yeah how would they know your circumstances? You can only offer your information by supplying a certificate of exemption.

The certificate accounts for all time wether exempt or not over that year 1 Jul-30th June.

That's why you have to supply one for each year.

Really is this stuff so difficult to understand?

Sundy

mandrake04 wrote: »

Yeah what about the clown in the other thread advising people not to bother, looks like a right muppet now.

He really does, its similar to the pub talk you hear about visas.

Thankfully I'm done with it now that I have my PR & medicare.

irishmover

Done mine each year. Pretty sure I scanned them and dumped them in a folder on my laptop. Haven't gotten any letter yet. Hopefully won't incase I can't find the god damn letters from the last 3 years!

catbear

mandrake04 wrote: »

Yeah how would they know your circumstances? You can only offer your information by supplying a certificate of exemption.

Well my original thought was once established as exempt from Medicare levy the tax office could retain this information for temp visa holders. Their preexisting status (their nations healthcare agreements with Australia) is not going to change unless as you pointed out (correct me if I'm wrong) they apply for PR.
It just doesn't seem like a very fluid system.

mandrake04

catbear wrote: »

Well my original thought was once established as exempt from Medicare levy the tax office could retain this information for temp visa holders. Their preexisting status (their nations healthcare agreements with Australia) is not going to change unless as you pointed out (correct me if I'm wrong) they apply for PR.
It just doesn't seem like a very fluid system.

Well I'd say that's a very dumb thought, like I said above look at the big picture the onus is on you to prove an exemption by filling in the form and obtaining a certificate to prove your exemption it's that simple it's very fluid.

The problem is your mindset of everyone running round solving your responsibilities.

It's threads like this that make us Irish at times look stupid.

catbear

Perhaps some streamlining like Jackbhoy suggested is what's required.

I think they're trying to that with the mygov approach with pulling all your information together.

I know a lot of Aussies who either don't do a tax return because it's too complicated or hire someone to do it.

mandrake04

catbear wrote: »

Perhaps some streamlining like Jackbhoy suggested is what's required.

What Jackbhoy suggested wouldn't work, a blind label of simply being an Irish Citizen or having an Irish passport is itself no valid reason to be exempt Medicare. You are entitled or exempt to Medicare based on you're residency directly previous to coming to Australia or depending on wether you applied for PR or not.

They could turn the application to an online one with maybe a a unique code that the ATO would be satisfied, but you are still going to have to enter the information yourself. How would Human services know where you were a resident overseas?... you would have to tell them of course.

catbear wrote: »

I think they're trying to that with the mygov approach with pulling all your information together.

Yep but as above you do it online but you still have to sit and enter the information yourself. ie you still tap keys.

Filling out the Medicare exemption form you still tap keys and print out the page and post it off. ( or you could use a pen)

So apart from postage stamp what's the difference?

catbear wrote: »

I know a lot of Aussies who either don't do a tax return because it's too complicated or hire someone to do it.

Either it suits them not to do it or they are just lazy.

massdebater

mandrake04 wrote: »

Yeah what about the clown in the other thread advising people not to bother, looks like a right muppet now.

I don't know who the person is in the other thread but no need for the personal insults, is there?

mandrake04 wrote: »

Well I'd say that's a very dumb thought

Same again, catbear posted their opinion on something - no need for the attitude. You seem to take this whole topic very personally for some reason

Anyway, it's not a big deal if you don't apply for the exemption cert every year. Some people apply for it every year anyway (if they're eligible) in case they're asked for it. I don't bother applying for it every year. I've been asked to provide it once before and I just applied for it then and there were no problems. If they request it, I simply apply at the time. If you're going to be out of the country or something like that, maybe apply for it just in case but it's not something to get your knickers in a twist about.

catbear

mandrake04 wrote: »

Either it suits them not to do it or they are just lazy.

Taxation consulting is an industry in itself. The first time I picked a manual tax return form I was chatting with the guy at the help desk and he just explained what I needed to fill in for medicare exemption. I asked him could I borrow a pen to write a note and he said officially he can't as he'd be seen to be materially aiding as a tax advisor. I just used my phone instead.

It all seems like job worths stuff.
Like when I went to change my driving license. There was a list of identity checks they needed. I had the basics, passport, visa stamp from IMMI, proof of residence but they required one more for their list.
He told to get a "proof of age card". I asked him where do I get them. "we can sell them to you'.
So basically they say I have insufficient proof of who I am yet they can sell me the final proof they require!

Do things have to be this complicated?

mandrake04

massdebater wrote: »

I don't know who the person is in the other thread but no need for the personal insults, is there?

Well I didn't refer to anyone directly, I could have been referring to several different people in several different threads. I'll let those readers with common sense make up their own minds.

massdebater wrote: »

Same again, catbear posted their opinion on something - no need for the attitude.

Well I didn't insult him personally, he posted his opinion which I thought was a bit stupid ( my opinion) I technically attacked his post because I honestly thought it was stupid.

Is my opinion not worth the same 2 cents as his?

massdebater wrote: »

You seem to take this whole topic very personally for some reason

I'm not taking it personal, there is often Hypocrisy, misinformation and good old fashion Idiot ism on here.

Is it so wrong to point out the truth?

mandrake04

catbear wrote: »

It all seems like job worths stuff.
Like when I went to change my driving license. There was a list of identity checks they needed. I had the basics, passport, visa stamp from IMMI, proof of residence but they required one more for their list.
He told to get a "proof of age card". I asked him where do I get them. "we can sell them to you'.
So basically they say I have insufficient proof of who I am yet they can sell me the final proof they require!

Do things have to be this complicated?

Maybe you just got an idiot, when changed my drivers license I just showed them drivers license, passport and utility bill. No problems.

Sometimes I phone call centres and I get someone with a heavy Indian accent which I can't understand so I hang up and phone back until I get someone I can understand. You just do what you have to do no point wasting anymore time complaining about it.... I just deal with it.

jackbhoy

mandrake04 wrote: »

Not all cases are that straight forward.

If you are from ROI but lived in NI, UK, Finland etc directly before moving to Australia then you are entitled medicare as it goes by your residence rather than nationality.

The onus is on the person claiming an exemption to

a) apply for an exemption certificate.
b) present certificate when asked.

The default is you get taxed for medicare unless you can pony up with a cert, if you want the exemption then you do the donkey work yourself.

Just to add: the Boss is likely correct, if you are from the 6 counties and only lived there (have never lived in 26 counties) but only have an Irish passport then you are never going to be exempt. For Aussies the ROI/NI and the access to Irish passports is confusing that's why there is conflicting info from Medicare.

I think people need to look at the big picture rather than look at the usual beermat over pub talk.

We just send a copy of passport and visa to Medicare. My point is why can't ATO clarify rules with Medicare and determine eligibility directly on tax return, as opposed to adding an extra layer of complexity and involving another agency? You can provide documentary proof directly to ATO for pretty much every other rebate/allowance/exemption so it would save a lot of time and effort of both submitter of return and ATO staff if this audit was avoided. Is Medicare that insanely different or complicated in comparison?

To me that seems reasonably straightforward. Don't know why the condescending tone in this and subsequent posts mate, its a bit ott.

mandrake04

jackbhoy wrote: »

We just send a copy of passport and visa to Medicare. My point is why can't ATO clarify rules with Medicare and determine eligibility directly on tax return, as opposed to adding an extra layer of complexity and involving another agency? You can provide documentary proof directly to ATO for pretty much every other rebate/allowance/exemption so it would save a lot of time and effort of both submitter of return and ATO staff if this audit was avoided. Is Medicare that insanely different or complicated in comparison?

To me that seems reasonably straightforward. Don't know why the condescending tone in this and subsequent posts mate, its a bit ott.

You have a good point except its more or less six of one half dozen of the other, my point through out the thread is that's it's a resonably simple procedure... it's not rocket science and that being an Irish citizen or passport holder has nothing to do with medicare exemption.

I'm sorry if I came across as condescending on your posts, I did not find any stupidness in any of your posts and I do apologise if I have offended you.

irishmover

mandrake04 wrote: »

You have a good point except its more or less six of one half dozen of the other, my point through out the thread is that's it's a resonably simple procedure... it's not rocket science and that being an Irish citizen or passport holder has nothing to do with medicare exemption.

I'm sorry if I came across as condescending on your posts, I did not find any stupidness in any of your posts and I do apologise if I have offended you.

You're one of the better posters in the Australian forum, however most of us have to get past the uniqueness of getting your point across to see that!

mandrake04

irishmover wrote: »

You're one of the better posters in the Australian forum, however most of us have to get past the uniqueness of getting your point across to see that!

Cheers,

To be honest I call it as I see it, I don't really hold back.

At times I see outright hypocrisy, total misinformation and muppetry. I'm not afraid pull someone up on it.

Have I posted any false information on here? I think not, if anything I post the facts and the truth wether people like the truth or not I don't care it just gets dished out regardless.

Anyway it great craic laughing at the odd fool.

irishmover

mandrake04 wrote: »

Cheers,

To be honest I call it as I see it, I don't really hold back.

At times I see outright hypocrisy, total misinformation and muppetry. I'm not afraid pull someone up on it.

Have I posted any false information on here? I think not, if anything I post the facts and the truth wether people like the truth or not I don't care it just gets dished out regardless.

Anyway it great craic laughing at the odd fool.

Yeh thats what I was referring to with uniqueness.

People offer knowledge differently, but personally I wouldn't go guns blazing at anyone no matter how hard I want to.

mandrake04

irishmover wrote: »

Yeh thats what I was referring to with uniqueness.

People offer knowledge differently, but personally I wouldn't go guns blazing at anyone no matter how hard I want to.

I just do what I want, there's no rule against laughing at clowns.

Legend100

got the letter too a few weeks ago, have been home and just got sight of it this week

I like many didnt apply for it and have to go about doing it now, rang ATO and they are fine with giving me a six week extension.

It is a pain in the arse alright but something that has to be done, I applied for both years just in case they come looking for 2014 aswel.

I do agree that it is an antiquated system that could be easily improved.....then again the fact we have to do a tax return is ridiculous (in my opinion). Surely a country as large and sophisticated as this could implement a self assessment system for self employed only like at home removing millions from the requirement to do a return and simply open up a claim for specific items like PAYE online. I digress.....

And before I get slated, Im a tax accountant so I think i have a right to moan about it

6ix

I just found out an annoying little quirk of the system. If your spouse (incl defacto) is eligible for Medicare, then you actually have to pay the levy, regardless of whether you get the exemption from Medicare or not. I applied for (and received) a refund of the Medicare levy for the past 3 tax years. I have the letters from the exemption people to prove my eligibility.

However, the ATO called me to inform me that because my spouse had Medicare during this period and is considered a 'dependant' (even though she works full time), I am not eligible for the refund and have to pay it back to them. Ridiculous considering I had no access to the services and she is in no way dependent on me. She didn't even enrol in Medicare for ages because she's Irish but qualifies due to living in the UK prior to coming to Australia.

I actually enrolled in Medicare in the last few weeks (PR) but this is a horrible little sting in the tail from the ATO.

Mellor

jackbhoy wrote: »

I asked the ATO person is it really required given ROI citizens are not entitled to Medicare anyway.

The problem is the bolded bit isn't actually true. ROI citizens aren’t automatically entitled to it, but many of us are.

For example, my girlfriend is an irish citizen, Irish passport, but she’s had medicare ever since she came out on a WHV.
I didn’t get medicare on my WHV or my 457. Full exemption cert every year. Until last year, I was eligible for medicare for 1 day. Visa was the same 457.

You are lucky that they accepted the passport and visa because strictly speaking that doesn't prove anything.

6ix wrote: »

I just found out an annoying little quirk of the system. If your spouse (incl defacto) is eligible for Medicare, then you actually have to pay the levy, regardless of whether you get the exemption from Medicare or not. I applied for (and received) a refund of the Medicare levy for the past 3 tax years. I have the letters from the exemption people to prove my eligibility.

However, the ATO called me to inform me that because my spouse had Medicare during this period and is considered a 'dependant' (even though she works full time), I am not eligible for the refund and have to pay it back to them. Ridiculous considering I had no access to the services and she is in no way dependent on me. She didn't even enrol in Medicare for ages because she's Irish but qualifies due to living in the UK prior to coming to Australia.

I actually enrolled in Medicare in the last few weeks (PR) but this is a horrible little sting in the tail from the ATO.

Did you guys file a joint return?
As above, my girlfriend was always entitled to medicare, didn’t get the levy. And I always got the exemption.

niva*sis

hi all sorry to add on here but if I applied for my PR in December and it was granted in April does that mean that I was only exempt from medicare from july - dec or july -march?

Thanks