Stupidity takes the good out of work

lefthooker

Bit of an incident here today. Long story so bare with me.

I have a fella in taking down trees around the farm, shed and house. A few came down in the Feb storm and I wasn't taking anymore chances. We had only one enormous fir left to tackle this morning. Trouble was his limbs were hanging across the road and there was no way to avoid him falling onto the road. There was four of us, myself and another man mnanging traffic, the saw man and a lad lifting him with a teleporter. The plan was to stop traffic and drop a limb, the two lads would cut him up and cos my section of road was straight with no obstruction of view I'd lift bows and clear the road with the loader and put them in the field by the lane. So if you can imagine the lane, the tree 30yds below it and me and my hi vis 10yds above it. Simplicity and was working really well too.

We were on the third limb and the lads were sawing. I had no traffic so took one of the BIG RED CONES and planted it dead centre in the road, then got up on the BIG YELLOW MASSEY. Had the timber cleared and only had some bows and heavy tops to move. Drove back onto the road, no traffic still. I was lifting the bows and easing backwards to pull them off the ditch all while jiggling the loader so to get them to balance and not fall off. That's when I spotted the other points man waving. I stopped up but too late. CRUNCH. I hadn't gone back 5yds and there was a vans bonnet under the rear bucket. Ah ****. We disentangled and there was a dent and scratch on the wing and bonnet. Could've been worse. The passenger got out and started snarling, I hope your covered, I'll take your details, you're in the wrong blah blah blah.

Did ya not see that cone back there or the digger in the middle of the road? I asked him.
That's just there to slow ya down, not to stop ya mister and we were parked watching ya he says.
Basically they drove on the wrong side and up on my neighbours bank to go around the cone and literally parked up my arse.
The driver finally got out and was a lot calmer. Will we call the guards he says. Call away says I we've got lots of work to do and won't be running off anytime soon. Guards weren't called anyway. We had a calm civilised discussion and thrashed things out. The passenger was hyper writing regs. and other stuff and we both had to tell him to butt out and we'll handle it. I didn't know the man but he knew me and the family, turns out he originally lived nearby and I went to school with his children. There was no details exchanged or taken other than he have me his number and then drove on. His passenger still had a kink.

There's probably going to be a few who'll tell me I was in the wrong but it just seems that motorists are either ignorant or stupid and fail to perceive hazard or simply ignore signs and obstructions. It was bloody hard to miss the cone, digger or massive tree missing limbs and bows or all the little bits and bows on the road.

rangler1

lefthooker wrote: »

Bit of an incident here today. Long story so bare with me.

I have a fella in taking down trees around the farm, shed and house. A few came down in the Feb storm and I wasn't taking anymore chances. We had only one enormous fir left to tackle this morning. Trouble was his limbs were hanging across the road and there was no way to avoid him falling onto the road. There was four of us, myself and another man mnanging traffic, the saw man and a lad lifting him with a teleporter. The plan was to stop traffic and drop a limb, the two lads would cut him up and cos my section of road was straight with no obstruction of view I'd lift bows and clear the road with the loader and put them in the field by the lane. So if you can imagine the lane, the tree 30yds below it and me and my hi vis 10yds above it. Simplicity and was working really well too.

We were on the third limb and the lads were sawing. I had no traffic so took one of the BIG RED CONES and planted it dead centre in the road, then got up on the BIG YELLOW MASSEY. Had the timber cleared and only had some bows and heavy tops to move. Drove back onto the road, no traffic still. I was lifting the bows and easing backwards to pull them off the ditch all while jiggling the loader so to get them to balance and not fall off. That's when I spotted the other points man waving. I stopped up but too late. CRUNCH. I hadn't gone back 5yds and there was a vans bonnet under the rear bucket. Ah ****. We disentangled and there was a dent and scratch on the wing and bonnet. Could've been worse. The passenger got out and started snarling, I hope your covered, I'll take your details, you're in the wrong blah blah blah.

Did ya not see that cone back there or the digger in the middle of the road? I asked him.
That's just there to slow ya down, not to stop ya mister and we were parked watching ya he says.
Basically they drove on the wrong side and up on my neighbours bank to go around the cone and literally parked up my arse.
The driver finally got out and was a lot calmer. Will we call the guards he says. Call away says I we've got lots of work to do and won't be running off anytime soon. Guards weren't called anyway. We had a calm civilised discussion and thrashed things out. The passenger was hyper writing regs. and other stuff and we both had to tell him to butt out and we'll handle it. I didn't know the man but he knew me and the family, turns out he originally lived nearby and I went to school with his children. There was no details exchanged or taken other than he have me his number and then drove on. His passenger still had a kink.

There's probably going to be a few who'll tell me I was in the wrong but it just seems that motorists are either ignorant or stupid and fail to perceive hazard or simply ignore signs and obstructions. It was bloody hard to miss the cone, digger or massive tree missing limbs and bows or all the little bits and bows on the road.

Let your insurance look after it, that's what you pay it for,

AP2014

lefthooker wrote: »

Bit of an incident here today. Long story so bare with me.

I have a fella in taking down trees around the farm, shed and house. A few came down in the Feb storm and I wasn't taking anymore chances. We had only one enormous fir left to tackle this morning. Trouble was his limbs were hanging across the road and there was no way to avoid him falling onto the road. There was four of us, myself and another man mnanging traffic, the saw man and a lad lifting him with a teleporter. The plan was to stop traffic and drop a limb, the two lads would cut him up and cos my section of road was straight with no obstruction of view I'd lift bows and clear the road with the loader and put them in the field by the lane. So if you can imagine the lane, the tree 30yds below it and me and my hi vis 10yds above it. Simplicity and was working really well too.

We were on the third limb and the lads were sawing. I had no traffic so took one of the BIG RED CONES and planted it dead centre in the road, then got up on the BIG YELLOW MASSEY. Had the timber cleared and only had some bows and heavy tops to move. Drove back onto the road, no traffic still. I was lifting the bows and easing backwards to pull them off the ditch all while jiggling the loader so to get them to balance and not fall off. That's when I spotted the other points man waving. I stopped up but too late. CRUNCH. I hadn't gone back 5yds and there was a vans bonnet under the rear bucket. Ah ****. We disentangled and there was a dent and scratch on the wing and bonnet. Could've been worse. The passenger got out and started snarling, I hope your covered, I'll take your details, you're in the wrong blah blah blah.

Did ya not see that cone back there or the digger in the middle of the road? I asked him.
That's just there to slow ya down, not to stop ya mister and we were parked watching ya he says.
Basically they drove on the wrong side and up on my neighbours bank to go around the cone and literally parked up my arse.
The driver finally got out and was a lot calmer. Will we call the guards he says. Call away says I we've got lots of work to do and won't be running off anytime soon. Guards weren't called anyway. We had a calm civilised discussion and thrashed things out. The passenger was hyper writing regs. and other stuff and we both had to tell him to butt out and we'll handle it. I didn't know the man but he knew me and the family, turns out he originally lived nearby and I went to school with his children. There was no details exchanged or taken other than he have me his number and then drove on. His passenger still had a kink.

There's probably going to be a few who'll tell me I was in the wrong but it just seems that motorists are either ignorant or stupid and fail to perceive hazard or simply ignore signs and obstructions. It was bloody hard to miss the cone, digger or massive tree missing limbs and bows or all the little bits and bows on the road.

Very unfortunate but you did reverse on him. Lucky no one hurt so that's the main thing. He sounded reasonable as well so could have been worse.

Muckit

......just when I was thinking l'd a sh*t day!!

Put it through insurance and put it all down to experience. And thank God it's only metal.

J.O. Farmer

You quite possibly were in the wrong but if the other guy was parked looking at you he should have parked further away. It's not much good to him to be right and have his van damaged or worse. If he was walking would he have stood as close. When you're driving down the road and you see a hazard such as someone cutting down trees you should err on the side of caution and make sure it's safe to proceed.

Reggie.

J.O. Farmer wrote: »

You quite possibly were in the wrong but if the other guy was parked looking at you he should have parked further away. It's not much good to him to be right and have his van damaged or worse. If he was walking would he have stood as close. When you're driving down the road and you see a hazard such as someone cutting down trees you should err on the side of caution and make sure it's safe to proceed.

+1

Bodacious

rangler is right.. let insurance bang it out.. I locked horns with a young lad over an accident.. I was in wrong but was agreeing to pay cash but he began to take the piss/make silly demands.. my parents asked me not to make an issue of it or bully him and just put it through insurance.. they paid him.. I wasn't bothered policy didn't go up damn all.. don't take it personal.. that's their job! only metal

milkprofit

lefthooker wrote: »

Bit of an incident here today. Long story so bare with me.

I have a fella in taking down trees around the farm, shed and house. A few came down in the Feb storm and I wasn't taking anymore chances. We had only one enormous fir left to tackle this morning. Trouble was his limbs were hanging across the road and there was no way to avoid him falling onto the road. There was four of us, myself and another man mnanging traffic, the saw man and a lad lifting him with a teleporter. The plan was to stop traffic and drop a limb, the two lads would cut him up and cos my section of road was straight with no obstruction of view I'd lift bows and clear the road with the loader and put them in the field by the lane. So if you can imagine the lane, the tree 30yds below it and me and my hi vis 10yds above it. Simplicity and was working really well too.

We were on the third limb and the lads were sawing. I had no traffic so took one of the BIG RED CONES and planted it dead centre in the road, then got up on the BIG YELLOW MASSEY. Had the timber cleared and only had some bows and heavy tops to move. Drove back onto the road, no traffic still. I was lifting the bows and easing backwards to pull them off the ditch all while jiggling the loader so to get them to balance and not fall off. That's when I spotted the other points man waving. I stopped up but too late. CRUNCH. I hadn't gone back 5yds and there was a vans bonnet under the rear bucket. Ah ****. We disentangled and there was a dent and scratch on the wing and bonnet. Could've been worse. The passenger got out and started snarling, I hope your covered, I'll take your details, you're in the wrong blah blah blah.

Did ya not see that cone back there or the digger in the middle of the road? I asked him.
That's just there to slow ya down, not to stop ya mister and we were parked watching ya he says.
Basically they drove on the wrong side and up on my neighbours bank to go around the cone and literally parked up my arse.
The driver finally got out and was a lot calmer. Will we call the guards he says. Call away says I we've got lots of work to do and won't be running off anytime soon. Guards weren't called anyway. We had a calm civilised discussion and thrashed things out. The passenger was hyper writing regs. and other stuff and we both had to tell him to butt out and we'll handle it. I didn't know the man but he knew me and the family, turns out he originally lived nearby and I went to school with his children. There was no details exchanged or taken other than he have me his number and then drove on. His passenger still had a kink.

There's probably going to be a few who'll tell me I was in the wrong but it just seems that motorists are either ignorant or stupid and fail to perceive hazard or simply ignore signs and obstructions. It was bloody hard to miss the cone, digger or massive tree missing limbs and bows or all the little bits and bows on the road.

Cover u ass report to guards immediately
Pass anger sowns like his neck will be bad when he talks to solicitor

Farmer

Correct me if I'm wrong but I think there's little or no 'No claims bonus' on tractor. Cover your ass and report to insurance - it won't go anywhere if there's no claim

Only you can sus out the other man. Should be a help if he knows you.

Farmer

P.S put yourself in his shoes also. We all drive up too close to things. Sleep on it for a night. The fact that he didn't insist on guards in the end and ye had a civil conversation, I think ye might sort it. All depends on the character, the value he puts on the car etc. He may have bigger worries.

I did similar to someone a few months ago. Things looked bad at first, guards, insurance ec. Turned out to be a gentleman. He got garage man to open a few bolts, moved a few things around, no money exchanged. Lucky? Yes, we've all seen it going the other way, but you can be lucky as well

frazzledhome

You are oblidged to report to ins. That's the last act you'll need to do unless you've got damage that you need to claim for.

Report and forget.

lefthooker

Thanks for the replies lads. I'll call the guards and insurance tomoro. The man seemed courteous enough and hopefully it won't go too far.

So as to learn my lesson I placed two cones on the road, one either side if I had no traffic to stop and would you believe it we found 2 or 3 vehicles trying to squeeze between the cones or had managed to while we were clearing the road. I maintain a lot of motorists are ignorant or stupid.

Farmer

Cones are everywhere. Councils leave them in place long after jobs are over. Same for oil spillage and 30kph loose chippings signs. NRA left 50kph signs on a national primary near me fir 2-3 months after job was over. Everybody sailed through at 100 kph. It's gone si bad now that they need huge flashing signs on the back of a lorry so that people take heed

We are people

lefthooker

Yeah but how often do you find cones blocking both lanes so to say. Surely warnings bells should start going off. Added to the hulking great yellow excavator only 40yds down the road that's not moving and it's parked in the middle of the road.

Farmer

Agreed, I'm more condemning the abuse of such warning signage by those who should know better.
Hope things work out for you as I know this kind of hassle wrecks one's head. At the end of the day, once there isn't blood spilled it will work out

grizzlyadams

Try cutting a hedge on a narrow road and you'll soon see how impatient people are , I wouldn't mind but it's actually for their benefit :-(

lalababa

A. Most people drive too fast.
B. Most people expect a clear road ahead of them 'coz they're used to it.
C. Most people do not have patience when driving.
D. Most people think they are in a hurry.
E. Most people do not appreciate the dangers of hazards.
F. Most people are cocooned in their vehicle and treat it like an armchair.
This seems to be the case more and more in modern times, where people have specialised in jobs and they can't understand other people's jobs e.g. roadworkers , farmers etc..
I see it when I'm moving cattle on the road, with people trying to get past and making the cattle jump in a dike. Also nowerdays we always have people on the road infront and behind. Modern drivers do not pick up on the cues of danger around them properly, they expect just to 'Drive on'.

ganmo

Ended up behind a big newholland at a set of traffic lights on a hill there yesterday, was way too close to him and all i could think of was ' i hope this lad doesn't roll back'
but i agree with everything thats been said, cocos leaving signs after them lead ppl to ignoring the signs ya want them to see, yer man could of seen the fact you were working and liable to reverse.

the_syco

Cones are something you drive around.

As for the calm driver, consider he could be calm as he's seeing a new van.

Bit of advice; take photos of the damage to their vehicle next time. Also, when you're talking to your insurance, ensure you mention that the van drove away, and if there wasn't any smoke coming from it, mention that as well. Otherwise the van could hit a brick wall making it undriveable and claim the damage was caused by you.

Finally, you say he lived around your area? Find out what type of bloke he is, and you may find out his game.

lefthooker

Rang the insurance today and they said they'd log the incident.
Rang the district gardai but they didn't pick up, the number of times I've been waiting at that window knowing there's a guard or two inside and they ignore me or a ringing phone is beyond belief:mad:

Also contacted the driver today to sound him out again. Said he'd been to two panel beaters and a garage and the best price he could get was twice what the van is worth so he's not looking to claim. He's going to look for a van of similar value to replace it. Might be the best outcome. He agreed his passenger got a bit excited down to the shock and not knowing me or the area feared the worst. Spent a good bit in the phone to him and have no reason to suspect he's not genuine.
Only thing that might be in my favour was he admitted he pulled up behind me and turned off the engine and then wasn't able to start it again to reverse

valtra2

Not meaning to be rude but you backed into him. Have you mirrors on tractor. Did you not check behind you before you reversed

lefthooker

valtra2 wrote: »

Not meaning to be rude but you backed into him. Have you mirrors on tractor. Did you not check behind you before you reversed

Stupidity might be mine also for thinking motorists would process what was happening I already said I'm expecting to hear it's my fault.

Yes I have mirrors on my digger and I had checked but it was a horrible day and they weren't much use in that weather. I'd swing around and look behind when reversing like everyone else does but in my mind I was easing backward and raising and steadying my load rather than In full reverse mode if ya follow. Throw into the mix that he had stopped the engine too

milkprofit

lefthooker wrote: »

Stupidity might be mine also for thinking motorists would process what was happening I already said I'm expecting to hear it's my fault.

Yes I have mirrors on my digger and I had checked but it was a horrible day and they weren't much use in that weather. I'd swing around and look behind when reversing like everyone else does but in my mind I was easing backward and raising and steadying my load rather than In full reverse mode if ya follow. Throw into the mix that he had stopped the engine too

He was parked and u backed into him that's what judge will say
The passenger is u main concern

9935452

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milkprofit wrote: »

He was parked and u backed into him that's what judge will say
The passenger is u main concern

I think it goes in his favour that he stopped the engine. You hit a stationary vehicle. A judge could get really sticky if it went to court, not having enough manpower to close a road properly, not getting the right permissions/insurance etc to close a road.
Make sure it is reported to the guards is my advice

O.A.P

I can understand from experience exactly what happened you and I hope it works out well, with the driver been a reasonable man as it seems .



Had you permission from either the council or guards to close the road though ?. If not this will bite you if you go through the courts .

frazzledhome

He's not going to court, he has informed his ins company. Let then deal with it and make no further contact with driver save passing on your ins details in return for his.

Walk away is my advice. We cross roads with cows and have had tips with tractors, livestock etc and I've always reported to ins and let them look after

FirstinLastout

In regards to the use of cones just note that they mean absolutely nothing in effect when used in such a manner, rather what was required was clear signage which is what was missing.
We can all say that common sense should suggest that a motorist should stop but a cone placed in the middle of the road by a private citizen is no more legit than a hi-viz vest draped over a milk churn, and as we all know common sense is unfortunately not so common.
40yds or so away the motorist probably wondered would he have been seen and allowed to proceed in a timely manner and as you said yourself you hadn’t seen him so he proceeded…. until it was unfortunately too late.

Report incident to guards, don’t discuss it further with the driver and allow the insurance company to earn their keep.
I’ve the same job to do next week if the weather lets up so I’ll be bearing this in mind.

lefthooker

FirstinLastout wrote: »

Report incident to guards, don’t discuss it further with the driver and allow the insurance company to earn their keep.[/COLOR]
I’ve the same job to do next week if the weather lets up so I’ll be bearing this in mind.

Matter is now in the hands of the insurance and gardai. What I've learned from this episode is to notify the gardai immediately even if the other party drives away cos there's not much they can do after the event.

Good luck when you go at the job, as much as I think trees are beautiful they can be dangerous feckers

freedominacup

lefthooker wrote: »

Good luck when you go at the job, as much as I think trees are beautiful they can be dangerous feckers

Not much luck involved really. The gear needed to control a road on a job like this would cost you around €150 plus vat to hire for a week. You'd need a couple of guys for the stop/go but they'd be extra hands when you didn't need the road closed. Probably would have been cheap at the price for the op as things turned out.

lefthooker

freedominacup wrote: »

Not much luck involved really. The gear needed to control a road on a job like this would cost you around €150 plus vat to hire for a week. You'd need a couple of guys for the stop/go but they'd be extra hands when you didn't need the road closed. Probably would have been cheap at the price for the op as things turned out.

Good luck as in I hope you get in well with the job.
But you always need luck freedom. We were lucky in that we took down several trees around sheds and the house without incident. We only had this one tree that was going to affect the road and had brought in extra help. We were lucky too that most of the traffic was patient and waited or turned around and took a different route. Regardless of being in the right or wrong this particular driver did several things to contribute to the incident.

As a sidenote, even with roadworks who use traffic lights and stop signs, the number of occasions I've met traffic hurtling at me when I've had the green lights is innumerous.