Course Records

convert

Does anyone know where I could find a list of all the course records in Ireland, including more 'historic' ones, such as tracks which have closed down?

Thud

it's not that important a stat on non oval race tracks so might be hard to find.
That said, they probably keep track of it for specific Graded races rather than courses.

nuckeythompson

They are important and mainly for the track itself to gauge the difference in ground etc. Equine historians also find them important to compare recent horses to those in history. Thats the main reason the records started. I remember getting some stats a few years ago from some of the courses press offices, not sure if this is now centralized in HRI. The records are kept that I know for sure for most of the course but some started recording this a different years.
You might find it hard to get some for the closed tracks as some did not record these. Pheonix park did for sure though

I think irishracing.com would be a good place to start - contact them as they would be able to search their own records by race time but users cannot search using that field.

I said

Not sure about accurate records Nick Mordin is always giving out about the rails positions at tracks around the country not been standard settings for each meeting.

convert

Thanks for the replies, guys. I suppose what really got me thinking about it is that after every race result (and distances) are announced, the time of the race is also stated. The time of the previous year's race, if there was an equivalent) is also listed in the card, so you can compare the race times. Likewise, on irishracing.com the time of the race is listed, and it's also possible to see how much quicker/slower it is than the average time for that distance. Also, the fact that I've also heard people talk of specific horses, commenting that they 'held the course record' for that distance, etc. until X date, or until the course closed, so I suppose I wanted to be able to have a look at those stats for curiosity's sake.

nuckeythompson

convert wrote: »

Thanks for the replies, guys. I suppose what really got me thinking about it is that after every race result (and distances) are announced, the time of the race is also stated. The time of the previous year's race, if there was an equivalent) is also listed in the card, so you can compare the race times. Likewise, on irishracing.com the time of the race is listed, and it's also possible to see how much quicker/slower it is than the average time for that distance. Also, the fact that I've also heard people talk of specific horses, commenting that they 'held the course record' for that distance, etc. until X date, or until the course closed, so I suppose I wanted to be able to have a look at those stats for curiosity's sake.

let us know if you find anything

diomed

There was a world record set for a sprint race in Fairyhouse a few years back.
The record stood until they found out workers had moved the markers when doing a bit of maintenance.
My guess is records at Irish courses are not worth much.

convert

Wasn't there issue with regard to the timing of races which came up relatively recently, something to do with a variance in how they timed the race (whether the race 'began' when the tape dropped or when the first horse passed the official marker, I think, but could be wrong).

nuckeythompson wrote: »

let us know if you find anything

Will do.

nuckeythompson

there was an article written regarding this, it starts when the tape drops. Also mentioned the issue of moving the rails which happens alot, more the distance rather than timing has been the issue on this

convert

The times of the point-to-points are quite interesting, varying between 5m.00s and nearly 7m15s for a 3 mile race in similar conditions.

Thud

convert wrote: »

The times of the point-to-points are quite interesting, varying between 5m.00s and nearly 7m15s for a 3 mile race in similar conditions.

Fence position (repositioned), fence build and omitted fences can make jumps times unreliable. Different types of hurdles in use too. Going on turf tracks can be different on different parts of the track ("heavy down the back" etc) on different days that have the same going description, you don't get as much variability on oval flat dirt tracks so times become much more relevant.

convert

Thud wrote: »

Fence position (repositioned), fence build and omitted fences can make jumps times unreliable. Different types of hurdles in use too. Going on turf tracks can be different on different parts of the track ("heavy down the back" etc) on different days that have the same going description, you don't get as much variability on oval flat dirt tracks so times become much more relevant.

Most of the fences are pretty standard now as the one guy provides most of the fences - there are a few courses with slightly bigger/stiffer fences, but it doesn't make 90 seconds of a difference. Obviously going will make a difference, as can the undulation, but even taking that into account the variations can be large at times.

Thud

Race times suggest the distance of the Charlie Hall Chase run at Wetherby the previous weekend may have been shorter than advertised:


at end of article
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/racing/article-2829264/The-Young-Master-set-lose-Wincanton-win-ineligible-race.html