Main Sequence

FIVE2_THREE

Chapman and Weaver are really talking this horse up as if he's a world beater. after Camelot put him in his place he couldn't find the winning line. He goes over to the States gets the needle in his neck and now is a 3 time group 1 winner.Clearly what were seeing is drugs and not true talent.

tryfix

His opponents have the same opportunities to take the same drugs as he does. The simple fact is that his 3 GP1 winning spree is of about the same quality as 3 Gp3 European races. The horse has been gelded which helps him settle his mind and has beaten the same two immediate close up finishers in all three of his "Gp1" wins. Those horses Imagining RPR 115 and Twilight Eclipse RPR 117 and Main Sequence RPR 116 are at the same level as horses like the pacemaker and Gp3 winner Leitir Mor RPR 116 and the pacemaker and Gp3 winner Kingfisher RPR 113, Recent Gp3 winner Hillstar has an RPR of 119.

Main Sequence is winning GP1s only in name.

unitedrover

FIVE2_THREE wrote: »

Chapman and Weaver are really talking this horse up as if he's a world beater. after Camelot put him in his place he couldn't find the winning line. He goes over to the States gets the needle in his neck and now is a 3 time group 1 winner.Clearly what were seeing is drugs and not true talent.

He even ran a bit drunk too, bumping the runner-up at the end too. He didn't have much to beat there tonight and I certainly wouldn't be in a rush to back him for the Breeders Cup turf especially if the fancied runners at the head of the market take their chance.

FIVE2_THREE

tryfix wrote: »

His opponents have the same opportunities to take the same drugs as he does. The simple fact is that his 3 GP1 winning spree is of about the same quality as 3 Gp3 European races. The horse has been gelded which helps him settle his mind and has beaten the same two immediate close up finishers in all three of his "Gp1" wins. Those horses Imagining RPR 115 and Twilight Eclipse RPR 117 and Main Sequence RPR 116 are at the same level as horses like the pacemaker and Gp3 winner Leitir Mor RPR 116 and the pacemaker and Gp3 winner Kingfisher RPR 113, Recent Gp3 winner Hillstar has an RPR of 119.

Main Sequence is winning GP1s only in name.

I disagree, Having spent 20 years in the American racing industry I'd be the first to tell you it's more about who has access to the best drugs and less about who has the best horses. the top to leading trainers Bob Baffert and Todd Pletcher are annually ranked in the top 5 among drug offenders.

FIVE2_THREE

unitedrover wrote: »

He even ran a bit drunk too, bumping the runner-up at the end too. He didn't have much to beat there tonight and I certainly wouldn't be in a rush to back him for the Breeders Cup turf especially if the fancied runners at the head of the market take their chance.

True but the problem with the Breeders cup turf races is that they are to European dependent. Main Sequence is the best turf horse in the states and that's not saying much.

unitedrover

FIVE2_THREE wrote: »

True but the problem with the Breeders cup turf races is that they are to European dependent. Main Sequence is the best turf horse in the states and that's not saying much.

The yanks have actually only won it twice outright since 1998 so it is definitely a race for the Europeans. Magician won it last year but whether he can reproduce that I don't know. If Telescope runs in it, he's my idea of the winner.

tryfix

FIVE2_THREE wrote: »

I disagree, Having spent 20 years in the American racing industry I'd be the first to tell you it's more about who has access to the best drugs and less about who has the best horses. the top to leading trainers Bob Baffert and Todd Pletcher are annually ranked in the top 5 among drug offenders.

There's a reason why vets make good trainers.;)

diomed

Coincidentally, I'm reading Doped by Jamie Reid, at the moment.
Some horses were running fast, some slow, some were scratched because they weren't fit to be put in the horsebox. Some were in hurdle races but never got off the ground.

Peintre Celebre

What percent of US runners are on Lasix is there a report?

FIVE2_THREE

Peintre Celebre wrote: »

What percent of US runners are on Lasix is there a report?

After receiving the diuretic, the horse urinates, and yes, he or she “pisses like a racehorse.” The loss of body fluid typically causes the horse to shed 10 to 20 lb. (4.5 to 9 kg); the lighter the horse, the faster it can run. In 1991, just 45% of American horses got Lasix injections before their starts, according to the Jockey Club, the breed registry for all North American thoroughbred horses. Last year, 95% of all horses were on race-day Lasix.
http://keepingscore.blogs.time.com/2011/05/06/the-kentucky-derby-must-kick-its-drug-problem/

This video will make people think twice about American racing
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/06/03/sports/amid-triple-crown-chase-a-battle-rages-for-the-soul-of-horse-racing.html

paddyisreal

Irish and English racing is 100 percent clean also....lol . Really, glass houses and all that. Maybe just maybe main sequence improved the older he got or maybe its a bit of both. It aint as black and white as some people portray here. European racing clean and great ... the rest of the world rubbish and drug fuelled .

FIVE2_THREE

paddyisreal wrote: »

Irish and English racing is 100 percent clean also....lol . Really, glass houses and all that. Maybe just maybe main sequence improved the older he got or maybe its a bit of both. It aint as black and white as some people portray here. European racing clean and great ... the rest of the world rubbish and drug fuelled .

Leave it to you to rush to the defense of American racing. despite the proof of 95% the horses running chemically enabled you still defend. if English and Irish racing are as dirty as you claim I dare you to name the names. I can provide a grocers list of dirty trainers in America can you do the same in regards to English and Irish racing ?

paddyisreal

trainers who have used lasix in the states include stoute, o brien, gosden, cecil , fabre, head .... the list goes on. all top european trainers have used lasix when it is there best interest and thats a fact. If they were so morally superior they would not have used it but at the end of the day its about winning thats why aidan o brien changed his use of lasix between 2010 and later years.

FIVE2_THREE

paddyisreal wrote: »

trainers who have used lasix in the states include stoute, o brien, gosden, cecil , fabre, head .... the list goes on. all top european trainers have used lasix when it is there best interest and thats a fact. If they were so morally superior they would not have used it but at the end of the day its about winning thats why aidan o brien changed his use of lasix between 2010 and later years.

So you place people who use lasix maybe once or twice a year on the same level as those who use it EVERYDAY FOR EVERY HORSE? I sure hope not. that's like saying people who drink but a few times a year are alcoholics. besides lasix there are dozens of other drugs permissible on race day in the United States that are not allowed in England, Ireland, France, Japan, Turkey, Russia, Italy, Spain, S.Korea, S.Africa,Australia,NZ,OR China.

The Mig

Winner alright

Andalucia

the drugs don't work, they just make you better

tryfix

Ridiculous, farcical, the OP was right.

FIVE2_THREE

Those American drugs are hard to beat.

Harry Angstrom

FIVE2_THREE wrote: »

Chapman and Weaver are really talking this horse up as if he's a world beater. after Camelot put him in his place he couldn't find the winning line. He goes over to the States gets the needle in his neck and now is a 3 time group 1 winner.Clearly what were seeing is drugs and not true talent.

Clearly this song doesn't apply to him......

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ToQ0n3itoII

FIVE2_THREE

In a drug free racing environment he looks like trash but he goes to the U.S. where he has the needle ready and waiting and he's unbeatable ? YEA RIGHT

Gringo180

This horse without a doubt is juiced up to the eyeballs.

nightpark

Bit late with this but farcial result. Way too much improvement when hes juiced up.