ATH first round match 1 : WinnieThePoo vs Garseys

beakerjoe

The first match up is here and it sets habitual curtain jerker Garseys versus as far as I'm aware a ATH newcomer in Winniethepoo , will the bar be set high in the opening match? Lets find out ........ The winner heads on to the Quarter Finals



Simplified version of the rules:

I will post a topic and you have to post your response including why you made that choice within a given time limit (before the next match is scheduled to begin), take care while making your responses however as the other contestant can counter your argument i.e pointing out possible flaws in what you've said.

*you can only counter an argument two times so make sure your point is worth making. If someone's defense of their argument isn't good it will count against them.

*You can use the same answer as your opponent if you wish i.e you agree with their choice however its hard to win a debate when your making the same points someone has already made

see the OP of the main thread for further details or if any examples are needed check out previous years competitions.

Question 1: Hulk Hogan has some how, through nothing short of a medical miracle or malpractice, been cleared to wrestle one last match at WrestleMania 31and Vince wants you to book the angle and match. Who do you book him with on the current roster and how would the angle go down, including the result of the match?


after your first post: why would your choice be better than your opponents?

---

Lets get it on!

a poll will be added after both competitors have replied the first time but seing as this is match one and they may not know they are up already don't expect them to post too quickly

Garseys

I can only think of one match that Hogan could have with a member of the current Roster. Icon vs Icon, 2 of the most dominant men in their time respectfully.

HOGAN vs CENA

How I'd book it
The Build Up
WWE have been pushing that Hulk Hogan has a big announcement with regards to Wrestlemania 31 Brother. The Monday night Raw after Elimination Chamber right at the start of the show. Out comes Hogan looking as good as he ever has. Hulk is announcing that he is gonna lace the boots up one more time at Wrestlemania and that he wants it to be a man who he has plenty of history with. The Icon....

*Cenas Music hits*
Out comes Cena. He's grinning at Hulk. "Hulk, I looked up to you as a kid, I idolised you, you're my hero! but Hulk I gotta be honest with you. I can't let you do this. I can't let you ruin my memory of you, these peoples memory of you. You were the best, I would love to see you at Wrestlemania but you don't got it anymore."
Hulk looks livid at this.
"Well Brother, you interupt me as I'm about to tell all these Hulkamaniacs my Wrestlemania opponent to tell me I don't got it anymore? Well John Cena if you don't think I got it how about you *pointing the finger at Cena* see If I still got it or not. The biggest superstar in WWE against Hulkamania brother"

John Cena smiles. "You know me Hulk, I never turn down a fight, How about Wrestlemania? The Grand daddy of them all? Hulk Hogan vs John Cena?"
Hulk: You got it, brother!

So it's announced Icon vs Legend, Cena vs Hogan for Wrestlemania 31. The key to booking this is not to allow them to confront each other in ring until the last RAW before 'Mania.
In the weeks between, Hogan is shown working out, preparing for John Cena. Both are kept off TV. Michael Cole does sit down interviews with both. Cena tells Cole that he's honoured that he is Hulk Hogans last match and as much as it pains him, He's going to make it his last match. He can't lose to Hogan.

Hogan is saying he's more prepared for this than any match he's ever had before. He respects Cena but he feels that Cena will face his biggest test when he comes against a real Icon, a man who's had the same legacy that he did and he's never faced Hulkamania.

The last RAW before 'Mania. Both men face off in the ring. They haven't seen each other in 4 weeks. The talk is over and Cena and Hogan come to blows with Cena knocking down Hogan before he hulks up and Cena is in shock. Hogan hits him with the big boot and the leg drop and we go off air with Hogan over Cena's body posing. Commentators hit the point "Has Cena finally met his match?"

Wrestlemania

Cena's out first, standing in the ring while Hogan makes his way down to the ring. Cena starts off with the advantage against Hulk and looks dominant against him. Hogan isn't getting a lot of offence in and it looks like Hogan is out of the match early on. Cena gets 2 near falls on Hulk during the match.
Cena dominates Hogan again with Hulk actually selling for him (that's the miracle!). Cena finally hits an AA. 1...2...Hogan kicks out. Cena looks frustrated he can't put him away. He goes for another AA anf the pin. 1...2...and Hogan kicks out again. Cena looks irate and locks in the STF. The crowd are hugely behind Hogan at this stage and Hogan manages the rope.

Hogan then stages his comeback. Typical Hulk Hogan comeback here. Cena can't believe what he's seeing. Hogan gets the big boot and the leg drop and goes for the pin. 1...2.. Cena kicks out. Hogan is nearly gassed at this stage and goes for the leg drop again. He hits it and attempts the pin 1..2..Cena kicks out. Hogan is now in disbelief. He lifts up Cena to go for the big boot again but Cena counters into the AA and falls back on Hulk. 1...2...3... Cena goes over Hogan.

Both men are laid out in the ring. Cena gets up first and picks up Hogan. He extends his hand for a handshake. Hogan accepts and we get a feel good Wrestlemania moment with Hogan holding up Cena's arm before walking off up the ramp while Cena celebrates in the ring.


I know it's Cheesy as it gets but I think it's fitting for a match between these two!

WinnyThePoo

Hulk Hogan v Randy Orton

Hey guys. Sorry to Garsey for the late response. I was working two jobs yesterday, so had very little time.

Build Up/ Booking

Smackdown 31st Of October, five days after Hell In A Cell and the day 2k15 is released.

The Authority(Triple H, Stephanie McMahon, Randy Orton, Corporate Kane and Curtis Axel) are in the ring with a huge 2k15 poster above them.
Stephanie dressed as a witch starts off wishing the crowd a happy Halloween and to go out and buy the new WWE game 2k15. Triple H talks about last Sunday's paperview and the injuries caused to John Cena and Seth Rollins caused by Dean Ambrose in there brutal Hell In a Cell Match. He then tells the crowd Ambrose has been fired and won't appear on WWE television or paperviews ever again.

The crowd boo and the heat has ratched up. 'Real American' theme pumps out and Hogan comes out to a huge pop. He gets in the ring and shakes the all of the authorities hands.

" The hulkster can't miss out on a party for 2k15! Brother. I can't wait to get my hands on 2k15 and beat the hell out of The Miz Brother! Fandango brother! and even Triple H! Brother"
The Crowd pops. H and the authority all smile.

Triple H gets on the microphone " Yes Hulk, you can do that, you could ha...but so could I. I could beat down Sting.....The Rock...eh even Dolph Ziggler" Crowd boo.

Hogan " That's also true brother, but all the hulkamanics out there will be experience the passion, the pain, the joy on 2k15 whether playing as the hulkamaniac!!!!The Real American or Triple H!".

Randy Orton looks pretty agitated by the whole scene, decides he's going to leave the ring. Triple H calls him back. Orton takes the mic off Hunter.

" My name is Randy Orton and I don't give a hoot about a video game, I don't give a crap about Halloween and I certainly don't give a crap about an ageing, useless and worthless Hulk Hogan standing near me speaking.

I could go home and play 2k15 and RKO you again and again, but I'd rather RKO you right now"

Orton drops the mic and steps up to Hogan. Triple H, Kane and Curtis Axel hold Orton back. Hogan laughs it off.


The following week commentary teams and presenters on WWE mention the Orton/Hogan moment.

Orton win's a fatal four way between Ambrose-Cena-Rusv and himself to set up a WWEWHC match at Survivor Series.
Hogans on Survivor Series Pre-Show Panel and is asked by Renee Young his thoughts on whether Orton can beat Lesnar in the main event.

" No Renee, I don't believe Orton has it in him to beat Lesner. I don't believe anyone at the moment has it to beat lesner. Not someone without the support of the crazy hulkamaniacs in the crowd."

Orton loses a brutal match against Lesnar that night.

Orton tweets about Hogans comments the following week calling Hogan ' a bag of ****'. Hogan tweets back 'Calm down brother, lets be friends'.
Which Orton responds ' Don't call me brother'.
Hogan tweets back 'Ok brother'

Royal Rumble rolls around. Orton expresses his desire to win the rumble match.
During the Rumble match Orton is eliminated by Damien Sandow dressed as Hulk Hogan.
The next night Orton faces Sandow again. Sandow dressed as Hogan again. Orton gets himself disqualified with RKOing Hulk Sandow through a table.

Elimination Chamber rolls around. Orton is in the chamber match. Hogan is on commentary. Orton is eventually eliminated.
He starts to walk up in the ramp but stops. Turns around and goes around the cage and attacks Hogan. They brawl around the cage until they are separated by guards.


Raw begins with pictures of last night’s Elimination Chamber match and a picture of the winner of the elimination chamber match for the WWE World Heavyweight Championship Brock Lesnar. Michael Cole and Jerry Lawlor though talk about Randy Ortons vicious attack on Hulk Hogan who was on commentary during the match after he was eliminated from the chamber.
Triple H would be out later to address Orton’s attack.

Triple H comes out and says Orton’s attack was unwarranted and he must be punished for attacking a non-wrestler member of staff. Orton’s music hits. He tells Hunter he wants Hogan at WrestleMania. He wants to make a show of him. Orton exclaims he’s the best and will be the best there ever was.
“Hogans an old cockroach who talks too much. Give me Hogan! Hunter! Give me Hogan”.
“ You Know I can’t do that Randy. Your Suspended for 90 days for an attack on non-wrestler member of staff….You Know The Rules!!!.

Orton goes for the RKO but Triple H counters and throws him out of the ring and Orton makes his escape through the crowd.
Hogan returns to Raw the next week and call out Hunter. He says he’s been thinking about this for a while and wants one more WrestleMania moment.

“I need it brother!”
“No Hogan, that’s not going to happen. As COO I cannot allow you get in the ring in your condition and age. That’s the end of that!”
Triple H leaves the ring and Hogan looks bitterly disappointed.
Two days later on Michael Coles internet interviews with Triple H. H has a change of heart.

“The last 48 hours, only one thing has been on the my mind. That thing has been Hulk Hogan, even Hollywood Hogans request to have a match with the self-proclaimed legend killer Randy Orton at the biggest show the year WrestleMania. Orton wants to fight Hogan…Hogan wants to fight Orton.
Hogan...Orton...WrestleMania. Yes……If Hogan passes a medical he can fight Randy Orton at WrestleMania”

Hogan comes out on the raw three weeks out from WrestleMania. He tells the crowd how excited he is for the match against Orton and he’s in the best shape he’s been for a while. He tells the crowd we will have proper Hulkamania at this years Wrestlemania.
Curtis Axel's music goes off Axel comes down the ramp, Orton comes out from the crowd behind and while Hogan is distracted hits the RKO. Orton then lines up for the punt, but stops and laughs.

A week before Wrestlemania on Raw 'Miz TV' have Brooke and Hulk Hogan. Brooke tell us she is scared for her father and doesn't want him to get hurt. Hogan reassures her he will be alright.
Ortons music rings out and he comes down with his henchman Curtis Axel they clear Hogan and the miz out of the ring. Orton RKO's Brooke. We leave the segment with Hogan holding brooke in his arms as Orton smiles from the top of the ramp.

WrestleMania

M.Cole- “ This could be the last time we see Hogan in WWE”
J.Lawler- “ Guys, I’’m really afraid of what Randy Orton will do to Hulk Hogan. He could really hurt him, we saw what he did to his daughter Brooke. We know from the past what a sadistic man Orton can be. I’m really afraid guys.
JBL- “ I say let the man fight. He wants to fight Orton. Orton wants to fight Hogan. This has all the makings of a classic WrestleMania fight”
Hogans music hits and crowd pops. Hogan does his usual ring entrance and gets the crowd pumped. Next comes Orton. He comes out smiling.
The bell rings and Hogan quickly gets the upperhand pushing Orton into the turnbuckle. Shots to the body and face. Orton counters with shots to the face and both men are back in the middle of ring. They lock hands and Hogan once again he gets the upper hand. He puts Orton into a bearhug.
M.Cole” HOGAN! Proving the doubters so far, Orton struggling to get out of the bearhug”
Orton twists and turns and eventually gets out of the submission manoeuvre. Orton rushes back to the turnbuckle to get a moments rest, but Hogan’s at him again. Body shots again. Orton gets a few back and then out of the blue RKO’s Hogan. The crowd are shocked. Orton walks around the ring manically smiling.
Hogan takes a while but eventually gets up of the ground only to take another RKO, his body flops on the ground.
J.Lawlor-“Come Randy, he’s had enough, pin him”
A minute goes by and Hogan eventually stumbles up holding the ropes for balance. Orton manically smiles. Hogan puts up his fists and gestures he’s ready to fight again.
JBL-“ Looks as if Orton wants Hogan to hit him, giving him a free pass”

Hogan hits Orton with ones and twos. He then whips orton against the ropes but as Orton comes back he misses with big boot and Orton hits with a power slam. Orton manically bangs the mat.
M.Cole- “ Oh no Ortons hearing voices again”
Hogan slowly makes his way back to his feet. Hogan looks dazed and confused, but eventually starts pumping his chest. The crowd liven up. Hogan goes for a punch but misses and orton puts in a choke hold. Hogan eventually fights out the chokehold, and puts Orton back into the bearhug but Orton gets and retreats to the turnbuckle.
Hogan goes for a big boot while Orton at the turnbuckle. Orton gets out of the way and then puts Hogan into a inverted headlock backbreaker. Orton then starts to pound on Hogan’s arms and legs with his feet. Hogan rolls out of the ring, clearly dazed and gassed. Orton poses in front of the crowd. They jeer him. Hogan gets back into the ring and goes for the big boot once again and misses and Orton counters with a third RKO. Orton doesn’t pin Hogan and goes back to the corner.
M.Cole-“ this does not look good fellas”
J.Lawlor- “ I think he’s gonna punt him Michael! Somebody stop him!”
JBL-“ Hogan did this to himself, he has no one else to blame if he’s punted in the head!”
Hogan starts to rise but quick as a flash is met by a punt by Orton. The crowd gasp and boo. Orton goes for the pin 1,2,3!. Orton music hits as Hogan is put on a stretcher and taken away.

Randy Orton Legend Killer.

My thoughts-

Personally I think WWE biggest heel full time member on the roster is Orton. The reasoning for the bleak finish is to make Orton hated. I think his characters been stale for a while. I used to hate him a lot more when he was in legacy. Punting Hogan in the head and ending his career will give Orton heat for a while to come.

Garseys

Right so the reason's why Cena is a better match than Orton for Hulk Hogan.

The Money draw of Cena/Hogan over Orton/Hogan.
Let's face it, Cena and Hogan on the Wrestlemania 31 card over Orton/Hogan is gonna generate more buys and more interest.
Cena is one of those performers like Hulk, that has transcended the industry and is very noticeable in mainstream media.

Hogan and Cena is going to drum up Mainstream media and press (much like Rock vs Cena) and more eyes on the product. The interviews that Michael Cole does could be network exclusive so enticing people to buy it. Hogan's name still has some draw with casual fans. Billing it as his last match in the ring could bring in those sweet $$$ that Vince looks for, and as much as some fans complain Cena still brings in a sizeable portion of WWE's audience. Think of the merchandise alone between these two.

Orton could ride on Hulk to drum up interest in the mainstream media and as compelling a contest and build that it is, it's just not gonna bring in the money that Cena/Hogan will. Ultimately Vince will go for the best drawing card.

That Pinch Yourself moment
Hogan vs Cena staring off before the start of the match, the crowd going crazy. The generation vs generation feeling. You're not gonna get that with Orton as hard as you build him up.You might get it at the finale with the punt but honestly, Wrestlemania is generally the feel good moments not seeing an Icon being stretchered out.

Hogan, Brother
Hogans last match, I highly doubt you're gonna convince him to lose like that. He'll want his loss to go out strong. Cena I think is the only guy that will deliver that to him. I know it's a case of LOLCENAWINS but I honestly think it's the only guy Hulk will agree to go out to (also my first point about the $$$).

While I feel Orton could probably carry Hulk to a better match (as you've detailed) with putting someone over. I think Vince will go with Hogan/Cena.

WinnyThePoo

Garseys wrote: »

Right so the reason's why Cena is a better match than Orton for Hulk Hogan.

The Money draw of Cena/Hogan over Orton/Hogan.
Let's face it, Cena and Hogan on the Wrestlemania 31 card over Orton/Hogan is gonna generate more buys and more interest.
Cena is one of those performers like Hulk, that has transcended the industry and is very noticeable in mainstream media.

Hogan and Cena is going to drum up Mainstream media and press (much like Rock vs Cena) and more eyes on the product. The interviews that Michael Cole does could be network exclusive so enticing people to buy it. Hogan's name still has some draw with casual fans. Billing it as his last match in the ring could bring in those sweet $$$ that Vince looks for, and as much as some fans complain Cena still brings in a sizeable portion of WWE's audience. Think of the merchandise alone between these two.

Orton could ride on Hulk to drum up interest in the mainstream media and as compelling a contest and build that it is, it's just not gonna bring in the money that Cena/Hogan will. Ultimately Vince will go for the best drawing card.

Pinch yourself moment
Hogan vs Cena staring off before the start of the match, the crowd going crazy. The generation vs generation feeling. You're not gonna get that with Orton as hard as you build him up.You might get it at the finale with the punt but honestly, Wrestlemania is generally the feel good moments not seeing an Icon being stretchered out.

Hogan, Brother
Hogans last match, I highly doubt you're gonna convince him to lose like that. He'll want his loss to go out strong. Cena I think is the only guy that will deliver that to him. I know it's a case of LOLCENAWINS but I honestly think it's the only guy Hulk will agree to go out to (also my first point about the $$$).

While I feel Orton could probably carry Hulk to a better match (as you've detailed) with putting someone over. I think Vince will go with Hogan/Cena.

The Money draw of Cena/Hogan over Orton/Hogan

I won't deny this. Of course Cena and Hogan is the money. The only other two superstars that could raise $(but no where near Cena/Hogan) are Lesnar and The Undertaker.
I can't agree this point. To be honest it didn't cross my mind about the money pull. I was more thinking about the future and getting Orton bigger and more interesting.

Pinch yourself moment

We've had pinch yourself moments before such as Rock/Hogan, Cena/Rock and Cena/Rock 2 recently. I just don't see how an ageing Hogan having a stare off with a man in the best shape off his life Cena pinchable. Maybe ten years ago. Hogan's an old man, putting against a ruthless heel and Hogan playing the underdog(yet still confident) is more believable when it comes to them staring off in the ring before the fight.
The real pinch yourself moment will be Orton posing over Hogan as the crowd Boo Orton. He's hated he moves on. I understand however that sort of thing happened with lesnar/undertaker, but no one could believe Undertaker would
lose. Could anyone expect Hogan to beat Orton though.
This is the reality era where living in:D

Hogan, Brother

Hogan will do what I tell vince to tell him what do, you hear;)

One this be to us older fans to see some one Hogan let Orton go over in such fashion. Sure he'd get a huge paycheck for it anyway. Yes it wouldn''t be the way any wrestler wants to bow out.
I think it would buy Hogan back a lot of respect. End putting over someone in such a fashion. I'd applaud Hogan.

I suppose I wrote from a fan point of view and ignored the corporate part, such as $$$ and Hogans personality.
I just think it would infinitely more interesting seeing an old man go against the viper and the viper winning, making kids cry and adults throw a hissy fit and coming out of Wrestlemania in possibly more heat than he'll ever have.

beakerjoe

Poll added guys, 1 more reply each is also allowed so keep debating if you wish. Time to counter those arguments!

Garseys

I agree with you that we've had those moments before, as I said it's the two poster boys of 2 separate generations. There's still gonna be something special there.

I know Hogan is not conceivably gonna beat Orton but I wouldn't want him completely butchered. (Although in Reality it would, but c'mon it's WWE they just had a bunny beat Slator Gator).

Also Orton gaining heat from it? but is it the right kind of heat? He's currently getting go away heat. Why would the destruction of Hogan change that? If anything I think it could harm him in the long run.

Also I don't like the idea of someone killing Hulkamania, I prefer it that torch being passed scenario with Cena where it's the feel good factor.

WinnyThePoo

Garseys wrote: »

I agree with you that we've had those moments before, as I said it's the two poster boys of 2 separate generations. There's still gonna be something special there.

I know Hogan is not conceivably gonna beat Orton but I wouldn't want him completely butchered. (Although in Reality it would, but c'mon it's WWE they just had a bunny beat Slator Gator).

Also Orton gaining heat from it? but is it the right kind of heat? He's currently getting go away heat. Why would the destruction of Hogan change that? If anything I think it could harm him in the long run.

Also I don't like the idea of someone killing Hulkamania, I prefer it that torch being passed scenario with Cena where it's the feel good factor.

I know Hogan is not conceivably gonna beat Orton but I wouldn't want him completely butchered. (Although in Reality it would, but c'mon it's WWE they just had a bunny beat Slator Gator).

Come on. Slater and the bunny are lower midcarders. We saw what WWE did with Lesnar v Cena at summerslam. Why not do it again?.

Also Orton gaining heat from it? but is it the right kind of heat? He's currently getting go away heat. Why would the destruction of Hogan change that? If anything I think it could harm him in the long run.


I hate the term go away heat. A heel is supposed to make you dislike him. Whether you like his gimmick or really wish him off screen. He's doing his job, hes making you hate him.
" He's ****, stale, and i hate the way hes getting over bo dallas(or anybody).

Heels aren't supposed to be liked. They are not supposed to be cheered on. They are supposed to be hated, and in the wrestling world if he is making you consider changing channel. he's doing his job, because a wrestling fan won't change channel(I'm not talking midcard heel..I'm talking Main eventer Randy Orton).

Also I don't like the idea of someone killing Hulkamania, I prefer it that torch being passed scenario with Cena where it's the feel good factor.

The streak has ended. You can't end Hulkamaina with a punt. Hogan gets a great build up to Wrestlemania match. He puts over the biggest full time wrestler heel in the company. Do it. Orton wants to be booed to oblivion..that's his job.

Hogan can come back. Orton needs this. He needs to hurt somebody on the biggest stage.


Great stuff Garsey. Great posts and debates!.

beakerjoe

Poll will remain open to roughly midday tomorrow guys. Good first round battle by both lads

beakerjoe

Bump as poll closing in a few hours