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Are we going to far down the easy calving route??

  • 22-09-2014 9:42pm
    #1
    Mad4simmental
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,580 ✭✭✭


    As above. Often wondered as we all try to breed with easy calving bulls ect over the years.

    We are breeding calves with narrow hips & sholders ect to aid us at calving time.

    In years to cum will this have a knock on affect with allot of bad breeding stock?

    Just thinking out loud.


Comments

  • #2
    Kovu
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,241 ✭✭✭✭Kovu


    Only easy calving on a heifer here, other than that it's weigh up her back and and choose a bull to suit no matter of calving difficulty.

    It means watching them like hawks at calving but I don't mind that when the stock is alive & correct.


  • #3
    Mad4simmental
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,580 ✭✭✭Mad4simmental


    .Kovu. wrote: »
    Only easy calving on a heifer here, other than that it's weigh up her back and and choose a bull to suit no matter of calving difficulty.

    It means watching them like hawks at calving but I don't mind that when the stock is alive & correct.


    Same here but allot don't think like that. I'm on the look out for more heifers. Allot of breeding heifers out there for sale but I wouldn't touch most of them.

    Lads are breeding them to look nice but wrong in every other way for breeding IMO.


  • #4
    greysides
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 9,041 Mod ✭✭✭✭greysides


    Mad4simmental wrote: »
    In years to cum will this have a knock on affect with allot of bad breeding stock?

    Yes. No such thing as a free lunch.

    The aim of argument, or of discussion, should not be victory, but progress. Joseph Joubert

    The ultimate purpose of debate is not to produce consensus. It's to promote critical thinking.

    Adam Grant



  • #5
    stretch film
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,057 ✭✭✭stretch film


    sucklers i dont know .dairy ai bulls have a type predicition and from it you can pick an easy calving bull with positive scores for chest and rump ... its the end animal that matters no?.... i think gestation lenght can aid calving ease as much as any factor...


  • #6
    yellow50HX
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,828 ✭✭✭yellow50HX


    I think it comes down to the combination of cow and bull. All sucklers here and the bull we have at present is a godsend when it comes to calving. We had fierce problems with the last bull (lim) when he was crossed with our BBX cows but had fewe issues with the AAX and LMX ones. Lad we have now has given no calving problems for the last few years. Make big help when your part time.

    As for the quality of the calves they are excellant. They may start off a little small but they have the shape and muscle tone and fill out very quickly. We have people ask us about calving issues as they are fine and broad.

    Reckon if you want big calves you need big cows like Sim's. Ours are AA/LM crossed from dairy cows so not the biggest animals around but have plenty of milk and that does let the calf trive.


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  • #7
    _Brian
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,721 ✭✭✭✭_Brian


    It's a fair point.
    Lot of lads who work off farm go for easy calving all the way, covers them for the calving a they might miss.


  • #8
    onyerbikepat
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,921 ✭✭✭onyerbikepat


    I know with AI , where reliability figures are high, you can choose bulls with good maternal calving figures. These bulls will breed heifers with large pelvic openings and yet be fine for calving themselves (direct calving figures). The limousin bull Nino (NIN) is a very good example of this. His direct calving is 5% @99% Rel. This is 49% percentile for the breed.
    His Maternal Calving figures are 3.4% which is a 96% percentile or top 4% for the breed. If you keep using bulls like this over a few generations, you will breed good calving cows.


  • #9
    blue5000
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 12,756 Mod ✭✭✭✭blue5000


    Try find a 'curve ball' bull:cool:

    If the seat's wet, sit on yer hat, a cool head is better than a wet ar5e.



  • #10
    Kovu
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,241 ✭✭✭✭Kovu


    blue5000 wrote: »
    Try find a 'curve ball' bull:cool:

    Heh heh heh heh heh. How do you check if it has a curve or not?:D


  • #11
    blue5000
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 12,756 Mod ✭✭✭✭blue5000


    .Kovu. wrote: »
    Heh heh heh heh heh. How do you check if it has a curve or not?:D
    I knew you'd ask!:D

    If the seat's wet, sit on yer hat, a cool head is better than a wet ar5e.



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  • #12
    Genghis Cant
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,980 ✭✭✭Genghis Cant


    greysides wrote: »
    Yes. No such thing as a free lunch.

    Except in a mousetrap :-)


  • #13
    bogman_bass
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,083 ✭✭✭bogman_bass


    To be honest, those hard calving bulls are only for those arsing about with 10 cows. They have no place in a modern efficient suckler set up. We're to concerned about the show ring and that's how we've ended up with monstrosities like TVR ERE and AGZ

    You wouldn't see the yanks or Argentinians messing about with bulls like that.

    I want a small calf that's going to grow.

    I think some lads are just too fond of hardship


  • #14
    Mad4simmental
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,580 ✭✭✭Mad4simmental


    bogman_bass wrote: »

    Completely agree with you that way.

    I think I worded it wrong. What I mean is in years to cum will we suffer with allot of heifers unsuitable for breeding?

    A few generations of easy calving bulls is going to leave us with very narrow cattle no matter what way ya look at it.

    I'm not saying use the biggest Hure of a bull is the right thing to do either.

    On the yanks or Argentinians, your right. I worked on a cattle station in oz for a while & if they saw a huge bull that they say issues with, as in having to big sholders ect for breeding they pulled out the gun and dropped him there and then.


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