Sure why has Ireland no real naval tradition?

KingOfFairview

It's odd that even before the Brits got here, and after they left, we never had any real seafaring tradition. As an island nation with abundant forests, one would expect it.

So this is my question; why?

Jawgap

The Brits developed a naval tradition out of necessity - to protect the sealanes that stitched the Empire together.

We had no need of a fleet.

KingOfFairview

Jawgap wrote: »

The Brits developed a naval tradition out of necessity - to protect the sealanes that stitched the Empire together.

We had no need of a fleet.

Lots of countries without far flung possessions have had a naval tradition

kneemos

Didn't Brendan whatshisname discover something or other?

bodice ripper

All the trees were nicked

Ted_YNWA

Can't get much higher in Navy than Commodore of US Navy

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Barry_(naval_officer)

Jawgap

KingOfFairview wrote: »

Lots of countries without far flung possessions have had a naval tradition

That's true, but really only as traders or as merchant mariners - the countries who developed strong seapower traditions did so to protect their trade routes, or interfere with the trading of other competitor countries.

suicide_circus

The fact that ireland does not have an incredibly rich seafood tradition a la mediterranen countries is baffling. We have SO much Km2 in terms of territorial waters and a huge amount of irish people wont eat fish unless it's battered. Sad.

scudzilla

When your navy consists of a Rubber Dinghy and an Inflatable Banana it's pretty hard to get any tradition

KingOfFairview

suicide_circus wrote: »

The fact that ireland does not have an incredibly rich seafood tradition a la mediterranen countries is baffling. We have SO much Km2 in terms of territorial waters and a huge amount of irish people wont eat fish unless it's battered. Sad.

Indeed, its often said we have a bohemian attitude to fish, bohemia being the former name of Czechia, a landlocked country

mister gullible

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=II5tqdp-JUk

Jawgap

Ted_YNWA wrote: »

Can't get much higher in Navy than Commodore of US Navy

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Barry_(naval_officer)

It's interesting - a lot of people mention Barry or Browne when they talk about great Irish fighting sailors - and with good reason.

But if you want to find a truly great Irish fighting sailor I'd point towards "ABC" -

Admiral of the Fleet - Andrew Browne Cunningham, 1st Viscount Cunningham of Hyndhope

In the Second World War, he was C-in-C of RN's Mediterranean Fleet. He masterminded the attack on Taranto in 1940, the first completely all-aircraft naval attack in history, - and the template for the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbour. The Japanese military attache in Rome visited Taranto to inspect the aftermath of the attack and report back to Tokyo.

He oversaw the evacuation of Crete - famously saying, when it was suggested he withdraw to protect his ships, "It takes the Navy three years to build a ship. It will take three hundred years to build a new tradition. The evacuation will continue." They went on to save about 75% of the garrison.

He directed naval support for the various major allied landings in the Western Med and in 1943 he was promoted to First Sea Lord, a position he held for the rest of the War.

.......not bad for a lad born and brought up in Rathmines!

Jawgap

suicide_circus wrote: »

The fact that ireland does not have an incredibly rich seafood tradition a la mediterranen countries is baffling. We have SO much Km2 in terms of territorial waters and a huge amount of irish people wont eat fish unless it's battered. Sad.

It's cultural - we associate fish with abstinence and poverty.

wow sierra

KingOfFairview wrote: »

It's odd that even before the Brits got here, and after they left, we never had any real seafaring tradition. As an island nation with abundant forests, one would expect it.

So this is my question; why?

Simple answer is Yes we did FFS.

Example:

Grace O Malley

FROM WIKIPEDIA (Because I couldn't be bothered to type it myself)

Grace O'Malley (c. 1530 – c. 1603; also Gráinne O'Malley,[1] Irish: Gráinne Ní Mháille) was Queen of Umaill, chieftain of the Ó Máille clan following in the footsteps of her father Eoghan Dubhdara Ó Máille. Upon his death, she inherited his large shipping and trading business (sometimes accused of being a piracy trade). The income from this business, the land inherited from her mother, and the property and holdings from her first husband, Dónal an Chogaidh Ó Flaithbheartaigh, allowed her to become very wealthy (reportedly owning as much as 1000 head of cattle and horses). In 1593, when her sons, Tibbot Burke and Murrough O'Flaherty, and her half-brother, Donal-na-Piopa, were taken captive by the English governor of Connacht, Sir Richard Bingham, O'Malley sailed to England to petition Elizabeth I for their release. She formally presented her request to Elizabeth at her court in Greenwich Palace.

Harry Palmr

Irish Catholic + Fish = poverty of thought
Spanish Catholic + Fish = a good meal.

KingOfFairview

wow sierra wrote: »

Simple answer is Yes we did FFS.

Example:

Grace O Malley

FROM WIKIPEDIA (Because I couldn't be bothered to type it myself)

Grace O'Malley (c. 1530 – c. 1603; also Gráinne O'Malley,[1] Irish: Gráinne Ní Mháille) was Queen of Umaill, chieftain of the Ó Máille clan following in the footsteps of her father Eoghan Dubhdara Ó Máille. Upon his death, she inherited his large shipping and trading business (sometimes accused of being a piracy trade). The income from this business, the land inherited from her mother, and the property and holdings from her first husband, Dónal an Chogaidh Ó Flaithbheartaigh, allowed her to become very wealthy (reportedly owning as much as 1000 head of cattle and horses). In 1593, when her sons, Tibbot Burke and Murrough O'Flaherty, and her half-brother, Donal-na-Piopa, were taken captive by the English governor of Connacht, Sir Richard Bingham, O'Malley sailed to England to petition Elizabeth I for their release. She formally presented her request to Elizabeth at her court in Greenwich Palace.

One swallow does not a summer make

The_Valeyard

Didn't we create Argentinan Navy?

Banjo String

Fabulous darling.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PLgX-VRwKWE

CrabRevolution

suicide_circus wrote: »

The fact that ireland does not have an incredibly rich seafood tradition a la mediterranen countries is baffling. We have SO much Km2 in terms of territorial waters and a huge amount of irish people wont eat fish unless it's battered. Sad.

Well, I like to think of it this way: our lives are no worse off without the fish and it allows the fish to live longer lives. Everybody wins.

Ireland: Fish conservationists since the beginning of time.

gugleguy

Irish Shipping went bankrupt OP about 1985. Fine Gael coalition was in power then, like now.
It's the Irish psyche OP only in Ireland as documented in AH nowehere else on boards.

BlibBlab

CrabRevolution wrote: »

Well, I like to think of it this way: our lives are no worse off without the fish and it allows the fish to live longer lives. Everybody wins.

Ireland: Fish conservationists since the beginning of time.

Debatable. We'd probably be healthier if our diet consisted of more fish

kingchess

kneemos wrote: »

Didn't Brendan whatshisname discover something or other?

yeah I think he discovered whatdoyoucallit,you know,I think it is over there somewhere;)