Legality of laser pointers?

I bought a green laser pointer online and recently got a letter to say it had been seized by customs, detailing how I could go about the process to claim it.

First port of call was to email customs so I did that on friday, asking why it was seized. I got an email back today to say that it is classed as a firearm, but I can send a letter to officially claim it.

My question is, is there any point in claiming it? Is there any chance I'll get it at all?

Gatling

Green lasers are bad ,
Actually they can do serious damage to eyesight

Paulw

Why did you buy it? What is the proposed use of it by you?

Those will determine if it might be released to you or not.

Hootanany

How is it classed as a Firearm?

Gatling

Hootanany wrote: »

How is it classed as a Firearm?

See the airsoft forum for more on the subject

http://touch.boards.ie/thread/2056528914


Because green lasers can do physical damage and are strictly controlled

NomadicGray

I know I got one no problem before in the post. Works well for star gazing, pointing things out to people.

conorh91

It is possible locate a number of offences relating to the use of laser pointers, perhaps most obviously, the Non-Fatal Offences Against The Person Act 1997, as amended.

2. Assault
(1) A person shall be guilty of the offence of assault who, without lawful excuse, intentionally or recklessly—

(a) directly or indirectly applies force to or causes an impact on the body of another, or
(b) causes another to believe on reasonable grounds that he or she is likely immediately to be subjected to any such force or impact,
without the consent of the other.

(2) In subsection (1)(a), “force” includes—

(a) application of heat, light, electric current, noise or any other form of energy,and
(b) application of matter in solid liquid or gaseous form.

(3) No such offence is committed if the force or impact, not being intended or likely to cause injury, is in the circumstances such as is generally acceptable in the ordinary conduct of daily life and the defendant does not know or believe that it is in fact unacceptable to the other person.

(4) A person guilty of an offence under this section shall be liable on summary conviction to a fine not exceeding [€2,500] or to imprisonment for a term not exceeding 6 months or to both.

More specifically, some total idiots think it is funny to try to dazzle aircraft pilots with laser pointers, and so the Oireachtas is in the process of passing legislation to create a specific criminal offence of pointing a laser at an aircraft.

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/news/more-than-170-aircraft-struck-by-laser-beams-30430002.html

Oink

The FBI announced in June that there's a $10000 bounty for info on scumbags who target planes. 1000's of incidents reported in the last few years. So yeah, you might be asked questions when you buy one.

Personally I'm curious as to what good reasons people give to explain why they need one SO BADLY that they're willing to have a conversation with the guards/customs. Must be one hell of a Powerpoint presentation.

cormie

This is interesting as I've an infrared thermometer which uses a red laser to gauge the temp of whatever it's pointed at. I got it no problem when I ordered it.

Gatling

cormie wrote: »

This is interesting as I've an infrared thermometer which uses a red laser to gauge the temp of whatever it's pointed at. I got it no problem when I ordered it.

Its primarily green lasers that are the issue and the wave lenght it uses

Hootanany

Whats the difference between red & green?

Bepolite

Hootanany wrote: »

Whats the difference between red & green?

One is red...

Have a google and expand your horizons a bit.

Hootanany

Bepolite wrote: »

One is red...

Have a google and expand your horizons a bit.

Cheers

Victor

Hootanany wrote: »

Whats the difference between red & green?

For a given power output, the human* eye perceives the green laser to be several hundred times brighter than the red laser, causing temporary or even permanent blindness.


* Other animals may perceive it differently, e.g. dogs are colour blind, but may still be affected. Some birds of prey have an additional focal point that humans don't.

Little CuChulainn

Unless you have a valid reason for one, they are very likely to fall foul of Section 9(5) of the Firearms and Offensive Weapons Act as an article intended to cause injury.

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/1990/en/act/pub/0012/sec0009.html#sec9

This is a very open section which can encompass many types of articles. The onus is on the owner to prove it is not for the purpose of causing injury.

FreudianSlippers

I wonder if cat ownership qualifies as a good excuse. :P

Hootanany

Victor wrote: »

For a given power output, the human* eye perceives the green laser to be several hundred times brighter than the red laser, causing temporary or even permanent blindness.


* Other animals may perceive it differently, e.g. dogs are colour blind, but may still be affected. Some birds of prey have an additional focal point that humans don't.

Thank you

Kintarō Hattori

Poor OP- he/she asked a straight forward question and has been jumped upon by several posters. They've bought something which a small element of people have used in a less than legal way but that by no means implies that the OP has any ill intention for the laser pointer.

I bought an incredibly bright green one about 2 years ago. I don't remember what the specification is but it was a very high output device. What reason did I want it....... none. I just wanted a laser pointer and thought I'd buy the 'best' one I could.
What do I use it for? Absolutely nothing. Like many impulse purchases it simply sits in a drawer in my desk.

Not everyone has a nefarious intent for the items they buy.

SteM

Kintarō Hattori wrote: »

Poor OP- he/she asked a straight forward question and has been jumped upon by several posters. They've bought something which a small element of people have used in a less than legal way but that by no means implies that the OP has any ill intention for the laser pointer.

I bought an incredibly bright green one about 2 years ago. I don't remember what the specification is but it was a very high output device. What reason did I want it....... none. I just wanted a laser pointer and thought I'd buy the 'best' one I could.
What do I use it for? Absolutely nothing. Like many impulse purchases it simply sits in a drawer in my desk.

Not everyone has a nefarious intent for the items they buy.

Who jumped on the OP?

hullaballoo

"I just wanted a Katana for no reason other than to sit on my desk" doesn't mean it is not a harmful weapon that is subject to regulation.

It's not really jumping down the OP's throat about it because the main deciding criteria for customs/AGS will be what the thing is going to be used for. There are plenty of legitimate reasons to want/need a high output laser but a flippant impulse isn't really considered to be one.

Kintarō Hattori

hullaballoo wrote: »

"I just wanted a Katana for no reason other than to sit on my desk" doesn't mean it is not a harmful weapon that is subject to regulation.

It's not really jumping down the OP's throat about it because the main deciding criteria for customs/AGS will be what the thing is going to be used for. There are plenty of legitimate reasons to want/need a high output laser but a flippant impulse isn't really considered to be one.

No of course I agree but I took it as one or two posters that he/she couldn't possibly have had any reason, other than something bad, in wanting one.

hullaballoo

Well, for many of us who have no use for a high output green laser, the reasons one might be required could be alien. It's interesting that the debate on the airsoft forum is mixed in terms of whether they have any use within the allowed parameters at all.

From my own point of view, the only reason I can think of for ordering a high output laser that isn't legally opaque at best would be for some scientific/reasearch/development reason. Then again, I know nothing about green lasers.

Hootanany

I have 2 I use them in my work to identify defects on Buildings.

salamanca22

I have many laser diodes including 100mw pot green lasers and 200mw pot red lasers. This are considered very powerful (powerful enough to melt plastic and to light matches)

I use them not for blinding pilots but in electronic circuitry. You can so some fantastic things with lasers.

Five Lamps

There is somebody living adjacent to the East Link Bridge who was shining a green laser onto traffic the other night. Know this as I happened to walking across the bridge at the time.

Bepolite

Hootanany wrote: »

I have 2 I use them in my work to identify defects on Buildings.

salamanca22 wrote: »

I have many laser diodes including 100mw pot green lasers and 200mw pot red lasers. This are considered very powerful (powerful enough to melt plastic and to light matches)

I use them not for blinding pilots but in electronic circuitry. You can so some fantastic things with lasers.

Five Lamps wrote: »

There is somebody living adjacent to the East Link Bridge who was shining a green laser onto traffic the other night. Know this as I happened to walking across the bridge at the time.

Unfortunately as with everything a small minority misusing something ruin it for the people who have a legitimate purpose. I hope you called the guards. A few high profile cases and a couple of people made an example of should hopefully get people to cop-on. I don't normally advocate custodial sentences unless absolutely necessary, but the level of rank stupidity it takes to shine these at aircraft or into traffic, seems to leave no alternative.

ProfessorPlum

Five Lamps wrote: »

There is somebody living adjacent to the East Link Bridge who was shining a green laser onto traffic the other night. Know this as I happened to walking across the bridge at the time.

Please do report this to AGS. They take laser attacks very seriously. Also the location is close to the approach path for Runway 34 at Dublin. It's not beyond the realms of possibility that a fool who is attacking motor vehicles will also try to attack aircraft at a very vulnerable stage in flight.

the_syco

Victor wrote: »

Other animals may perceive it differently, e.g. dogs are colour blind, but may still be affected.

I was planning to get one for my mates dogs; they will chase the green light more than the red light, but didn't as it can cause blindness, and the risk is not worth it. Some dogs go after the red laser beam, but a lot will ignore it. Domestic cats will chase the red laser light, however. Wild cats (and the domestic ones that hunt) will usually ignore it however, as the "hunt the red dot" urge won't be strong in them.

Five Lamps wrote: »

There is somebody living adjacent to the East Link Bridge who was shining a green laser onto traffic the other night. Know this as I happened to walking across the bridge at the time.

Report this. Giving someone prison time

From https://www.iaa.ie/library_download.jsp?libraryID=910

3.4.2 Class I and 2
These include the type of pointers used for presentations and lectures and by surveyors on building sites. They tended to emit a red light, are of around 1mW power and are relatively harmless.

3.4.3 Class 3a and 3b
These are the type of lasers which tend to be used maliciously. They generally emit a green light and can be anything from 5mW to 500mW. Their only professional application seems to be for use by astronomers.The sale of such devices has been restricted in the UK since 1997 however, in Ireland no such restriction is in place.

3.4.4 Unfortunately they are very easy to buy online and can cost anything from €20 to €500. One such device is the "Laserglow Hercules" which is advertised as being the ‘the most powerful constant-duty handheld green laser in the world ’. It can push out between 250 - 800mW of
power and is available for $889 on the company’s website with free shipping.

3.4.5 Class 4
These are lasers used in industry, in research and by the military. They are not designed as hand held devices and need a mains power supply. They are not easy to obtain legally or illegally.

3.4.6 Although lasers can be any colour in the visible spectrum, green lasers pose particular hazards to pilots because the human eye is much more sensitive to green light. The light emitted by a green laser is 35 times brighter to the human eye than that of a red laser of equivalently power.

If the Gardai find you messing with a green laser around the airport, they will arrest and charge you. This is because when green laser hits the glass, the beam splits, and will often blind the pilot and everyone else in the cockpit.

Kintarō Hattori

Kintarō Hattori wrote: »

Poor OP- he/she asked a straight forward question and has been jumped upon by several posters. They've bought something which a small element of people have used in a less than legal way but that by no means implies that the OP has any ill intention for the laser pointer.

I bought an incredibly bright green one about 2 years ago. I don't remember what the specification is but it was a very high output device. What reason did I want it....... none. I just wanted a laser pointer and thought I'd buy the 'best' one I could.
What do I use it for? Absolutely nothing. Like many impulse purchases it simply sits in a drawer in my desk.

Not everyone has a nefarious intent for the items they buy.

FWIW, I don't think I was jumped on at all. I just wanted a decent one, wasn't aware they could be classified as a weapon/firearm. Don't think theres much hope of me lodging a successful claim, though.

EmilyHoward

I think they should be illegal, there's too many idiots who think it's a great laugh shining them into the cockpit of an airplane.

K.Flyer

These first two short videos pretty much display the dangers and reason for the restrictions.
The third video is a bit longer and more detailed.