Irish Rail route speeds

n97 mini

After reading comments about trains speeding by I decided to look at a few IR routes and work out their speeds, sort of in search of the slowest route I could find. I haven't finished looking, but here are a few average speeds. They were calculated using RUI's fare calculator which shows distances and IR's own timetables.

Waterford-Limerick Junction: 89km in 1hr40 = 53 km/h or 33 mph
Mallow-Tralee: 100km in 1hr37 = 62 km/h or 38 mph

^ I would imagine these two are excruciating, so I decided to look at some commuter services as I know my own averages about 20 mph.

Malahide-Connolly (direct): 14.5km in 15 min = 58 km/h or 36mph
Malahide-Connolly (stopping): 14.5km in 24 min = 36 km/h or 22.5 mph

Maynooth-Connolly (direct): 26km in 27 min = 58 km/h or 36 mph
Maynooth-Connolly (stopping): 26km in 40 min = 40 km/h or 25 mph

I'm surprised the stopping service from Malahide is actually slower than the one from Maynooth, although the Maynooth service is set to get even slower with the new station in planning.

Dravokivich

I think a lot of that issue with maynooth could be between connolly and drumcondra. Its regularly held there to wait or just trundles a long slowly.

n97 mini

Dravokivich wrote: »

I think a lot of that issue with maynooth could be between connolly and drumcondra. Its regularly held there to wait or just trundles a long slowly.

I think you missed the point. These are scheduled times. Whether the train is held up or not, the tardiness is built into the timetable.

devnull

Dravokivich wrote: »

I think a lot of that issue with maynooth could be between connolly and drumcondra. Its regularly held there to wait or just trundles a long slowly.

Similar thing happens between Clontarf Road and Connolly quite often as well, either waiting for an IC/Enterprise train to go past in th eother direction or for a driver change to happen just outside Clontarf to save the oul souls a few steps.

Vic_08

n97 mini wrote: »

After reading comments about trains speeding by I decided to look at a few IR routes and work out their speeds, sort of in search of the slowest route I could find. I haven't finished looking, but here are a few average speeds. They were calculated using RUI's fare calculator which shows distances and IR's own timetables.

Are you trying to accurately portray speeds across the network or highlight the slowest you can find? The thread title suggests the former while the content points to the latter.

n97 mini wrote: »

Waterford-Limerick Junction: 89km in 1hr40 = 53 km/h or 33 mph

Bus takes 1h50 serving all the town centres along the route with a much more frequent service.

n97 mini wrote: »

Mallow-Tralee: 100km in 1hr37 = 62 km/h or 38 mph

AA journey planner gives 1h23 journey time over a 98km route so not much difference.

The double reverse at Killarney adds delay and can't be removed without moving the station further out of the town centre, allowances have to be made for crossing trains at loops as well.

n97 mini wrote: »

^ I would imagine these two are excruciating, so I decided to look at some commuter services as I know my own averages about 20 mph.

Mallow - Tralee may have a relatively slow average speed but from using it there is no apparent feeling of undue slowness. AFAIR the line speed is 60mph and that is what it does most of the journey.

n97 mini wrote: »

Malahide-Connolly (direct): 14.5km in 15 min = 58 km/h or 36mph
Malahide-Connolly (stopping): 14.5km in 24 min = 36 km/h or 22.5 mph

Maynooth-Connolly (direct): 26km in 27 min = 58 km/h or 36 mph
Maynooth-Connolly (stopping): 26km in 40 min = 40 km/h or 25 mph

I'm surprised the stopping service from Malahide is actually slower than the one from Maynooth, although the Maynooth service is set to get even slower with the new station in planning.

Considering how much people on here love to compare DART to LUAS I'm surprised that none of the usuals have posted up LUAS speeds in this thread. Or is it because they know full well that the comparison doesn't paint their favoured system in such a good light that they are staying silent?

I have calculated the following based on the line distances in Wiki and the journey times estimates on luas.ie.

Green line, Brides Glen - Stephen's Green - 17.5 km - 40 mns - 26kph - 16mph

Red line, Point - Tallaght - 20.7 km - 52mns - 24kph - 15mph

n97 mini

Vic_08 wrote: »

Considering how much people on here love to compare DART to LUAS

Luas beats the DART in terms of frequency, late running, convenience, cost (lower Leap cap than even DB), probably wins on comfort too, but it doesn't win on speed. Luas is bit of a misnomer as it implies speed; it should have been called Mall (Irish for slow).

foggy_lad

n97 mini wrote: »

Luas beats the DART in terms of frequency, late running, convenience, cost (lower Leap cap than even DB), probably wins on comfort too, but it doesn't win on speed. Luas is bit of a misnomer as it implies speed; it should have been called Mall (Irish for slow).

When you take the fact that Luas is an on street system into account with minimal walking distance to board the vehicles compared to dart which requires a station and entrance and ticket office all which involves a walk of about 700-1000metres to the train The Luas is probably the faster option

n97 mini

I don't think you can really use that as an arguement. Supposing I'm on Abbey Street and I want to go to Dundrum, right now I'd have a pretty long walk to the platform.

The only station that has platforms an off-putting distance away is Connolly.

Emme

n97 mini wrote: »

I don't think you can really use that as an arguement. Supposing I'm on Abbey Street and I want to go to Dundrum, right now I'd have a pretty long walk to the platform.

The only station that has platforms an off-putting distance away is Connolly.

Platforms 6, 7 and 8 in Heuston Station are a good distance from the entrance, particularly if there's an out of service train in front of the one that is due to depart.

foggy_lad

Emme wrote: »

Platforms 6, 7 and 8 in Heuston Station are a good distance from the entrance, particularly if there's an out of service train in front of the one that is due to depart.

Don't forget Platform 1 which is also a good distance from the entrance.

n97 mini

Heuston doesn't enter the Dart vs Luas debate though!

Banjoxed

n97 mini wrote: »

I'm surprised the stopping service from Malahide is actually slower than the one from Maynooth, although the Maynooth service is set to get even slower with the new station in planning.

So, what do you propose should be done?

n97 mini

Banjoxed wrote: »

So, what do you propose should be done?

No new stations till the line is electrified.

end of the road

n97 mini wrote: »

No new stations till the line is electrified.

and why should potential customers have to wait for their station until the line is electrified when that could be years off? surely getting more people to potentially use the line first is a better idea?

L1011

end of the road wrote: »

and why should potential customers have to wait for their station until the line is electrified when that could be years off? surely getting more people to potentially use the line first is a better idea?

Considering where the proposed stations are, it could easily be quicker to use the existing buses while it remains a diesel service.

end of the road

MYOB wrote: »

Considering where the proposed stations are, it could easily be quicker to use the existing buses while it remains a diesel service.

the service being diesel or electric isn't going to make much difference unless line speeds are improved with some 3/4 tracking where possible along with priority over, or the same priority as dart. can't see those happening myself

cython

end of the road wrote: »

the service being diesel or electric isn't going to make much difference unless line speeds are improved with some 3/4 tracking where possible along with priority over, or the same priority as dart. can't see those happening myself

Not sure how 3/4 tracking would help much on most of the Maynooth line, certainly compared to both previously mooted upgrades of electrifying the line and closing the level crossings. 3/4 tracking would increase capacity on direct services in that they could leapfrog commuter trains, but it's not going to speed up most of them unless the scheduling is very wrong. Agree though that priority vs the DART is shocking, and I deliberately get an earlier train in the mornings which doesn't have to stand outside Connolly for 5 mins yielding to what must be every other service to pass through, as it's positively claustrophobic on those services.

n97 mini

The line doesn't need 3/4 tracking as it's not busy unlike the KRP.

As well as the issues already mentioned, the timetable is very unambitious, especially off peak. Trains sitting in stations with the doors open for 30-60 seconds to let in some cases no-one on or off.

I do remember when one of the new timetables was introduced back in the mid 2000's, my morning train to work took 20 minutes from Leixlip to Connolly, which shows what can be done.

L1011

end of the road wrote: »

the service being diesel or electric isn't going to make much difference unless line speeds are improved with some 3/4 tracking where possible along with priority over, or the same priority as dart. can't see those happening myself

Electrification makes a huge difference to acceleration and hence speeds with multiple closely spaced stops. It's the main reason to electrify an overground railway

loyatemu

n97 mini wrote: »

As well as the issues already mentioned, the timetable is very unambitious, especially off peak. Trains sitting in stations with the doors open for 30-60 seconds to let in some cases no-one on or off.

thats a serious fault on the Dart as well - ridiculous long dwell times. The Luas barely opens it's doors by comparison.