NCT whats going on

mikehn

Did NCT yesterday, Passed OK, car is a Peugeot 1.4 hdi 2003 with 190k on the clock. I did a comparision on the emissions to previous year's figure's and found the following, the smoke figure has gone from 3.00/m to 2.50/m.
this is serious for the owners of older vehicles.:mad:

Nono Toure

mikehn wrote: »

Did NCT yesterday, Passed OK, car is a Peugeot 1.4 hdi 2003 with 190k on the clock. I did a comparision on the emissions to previous year's figure's and found the following, the smoke figure has gone from 3.00/m to 2.50/m.
this is serious for the owners of older vehicles.:mad:

My mate has a 2000 Mazda, he failed on emissions. Brought car to 3 different mechanics who said emissions were a bit off, then none of them could find out what the problem was, in the end they said a coolant temp sensor. They then did a final emissions test on the morning of the NCT re-test, emissions were sound according to them! He went to nct centre, and you guessed it, he failed on emissions again, all at a cost of €500!!!!!

So he has now spent 500euro to get the problem fixed, and they still failed him even though the mechanic said car was sound. NCT guy said tough luck, go back to your mechanic! Such a shyte system.

dr.fuzzenstein

For petrol cars, a bit of ethanol added to the fuel will see you through the test and for diesels a bit of kerosene will do the trick.
No need for spending hundreds.

Tail Docker

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

For petrol cars, a bit of ethanol added to the fuel will see you through the test and for diesels a bit of kerosene will do the trick.
No need for spending hundreds.

My '00 520 had it's test on thursday, failed on emissions, despite the engine being tip-top, full service just done, all sensors A1 and full fresh standard exhaust/cat. First time any of our yokes ever failed on emissions too. PITA. It'll get some ethy and an italian tune-up before the retest. Still a pita though. My take on it is it's a back-door way of driving people into new cars.

Nono Toure

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

For petrol cars, a bit of ethanol added to the fuel will see you through the test and for diesels a bit of kerosene will do the trick.
No need for spending hundreds.

Where can ethanol be bought? Also, do you add much to the tank? How long before the nct should it be added? Thanks

Cleveland Hot Pocket

Nono Toure wrote: »

Where can ethanol be bought? Also, do you add much to the tank? How long before the nct should it be added? Thanks

Not sure I'd add neat ethanol to any petrol car. The additives that you can buy (redex/dipetane etc) are usually either ethanol/kero based for petrol/diesel respectively.

Throw in some, go for a spirited drive, then head to the NCT center. Be grand. Worked on a few older cars I put through the NCT.

mikehn

My problem is the level for a pass has been reduced, if you just passed the emissions last year, did no miles and went back this year you would fail because the've lowered the limit. They are hitting the people with low income who are forced to drive older vehicles, I think it's outrageous.

Cleveland Hot Pocket

I still contend that if you throw in a bit of kero additive (for a diesel anyway) and remove the air filter, there's no way you could fail an NCT for emissions in a car that was functioning any way at all correctly.

I took a e60 bmw through an NCT and it passed even though the amount of emissions behind the car was chokingly eye wateringly bad. It seems for diesels to be easy to put a car through. Remove the air filter and put in a different fuel additive so it burns cleaner. I also used to put a 5% mix of petrol in, that's only for older diesel cars though - the CR diesels won't like that :P

slimjimmc

mikehn wrote: »

My problem is the level for a pass has been reduced, if you just passed the emissions last year, did no miles and went back this year you would fail because the've lowered the limit. They are hitting the people with low income who are forced to drive older vehicles, I think it's outrageous.

The limits in 2011 were

(1) the result of the test on exhaust smoke emission is not in accordance with the standard for exhaust smoke emission as specified by the manufacturer of the vehicle.
(2) in the case of vehicles in respect of which the manufacturer’s specified standard for exhaust smoke emissions is not available, and were:

(a) first registered between 1 January 1980 and 1 July 2008 (inclusive of both dates), the average smoke meter reading is higher than 2.5m-1 in the case of naturally aspirated compression ignition engines, or the average smoke meter reading is higher than 3.0m-1 in the case of turbo charged compression ignition engines,

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/2011/en/si/0623.html

In 2014 they currently are

(3) the result of the test on exhaust smoke emission is not in accordance with the standard for exhaust smoke emission as specified by the manufacturer of the vehicle.
(4) in the case of vehicles in respect of which the manufacturer’s specified standard for exhaust smoke emissions is not available, and were:

(a) first registered between 1 January 1980 and 1 July 2008 (inclusive of both dates), the average smoke meter reading is higher than 2.5m-1 in the case of naturally aspirated compression ignition engines, or the average smoke meter reading is higher than 3.0m-1 in the case of turbo charged compression ignition engines,

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/2014/en/si/0322.html

As you can see there has been no reduction legislated for in the regulations.
It seems to me that, in your case, the wrong limit was applied either on this test or on previous tests. Certainly something you should query with them since they should be applying the manufacturer's spec and only apply the 2.5/3.0 limit where this data is unavailable for the relevant engine.

mphalo1

look into getting terraclean done on your cars as seen on wheelerdealers by Ed China it basically rids the motor of all carbon and gives it a spring clean lowering emissions and boosting mpg ( google it)

Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime

Never mind the fact a 1.6 hdi with a limit of 3.0 can pass at 0.03 !

So why worry ?

mikehn

slimjimmc wrote: »

The limits in 2011 were
http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/2011/en/si/0623.html

In 2014 they currently are
http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/2014/en/si/0322.html

As you can see there has been no reduction legislated for in the regulations.
It seems to me that, in your case, the wrong limit was applied either on this test or on previous tests. Certainly something you should query with them since they should be applying the manufacturer's spec and only apply the 2.5/3.0 limit where this data is unavailable for the relevant engine.

Interesting, thanks for that, I thought that another stealth missile had been launched at the motoring community.

ardle1

They will also fail you for 'forced' slight movement/wear in bushings and ball joints... That they think will fail in 100ml's or last for maybe another 5,000ml's!?
I would like to replace my ball-joints/bushings when they actually have worn and are giving to much leverage, and when I get my money's worth out of them!

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.

mgbgt1978

Just to clarify Fred's post. That would usually be €5 petrol to €50 or so of diesel (in other words around 10% of petrol).
This causes the engine to run slightly hotter and helps to burn off carbon deposits which would affect the smoke test.

Some say it's not recommended for the very modern diesels but a lot of experienced mechanics would disagree....

mphalo1

the old way was adding petrol on the hardier straight diesel's not anymore tho it can occasionally feck injectors up n stuff and sure you can buy additives now for cheap enough and are safe to use to help remove carbon but terraclean is far superior to that ( no I'm not a rep) cleans it all the way injectors to exhaust tip

Tail Docker

Ye have gone diesel - mines a peteril. So adding €5 of petrol to the petrol might not cut it..lol.

mphalo1

well dont go putting a fiver diesel in your petrol whatever you do

mossy50

a good lash dipetane is your only man

ardle1

mossy50 wrote: »

a good lash dipetane is your only man

This story is 100% true.
A friend of mine who was having sluggish, low power etc with his car was advised to this and he did and it worked..
He basically had to drive the car until it was nearly empty, probably about 60ml's of diesel remaining, toss a 'whole' bottle of the long neck dipetane in his tank and drive the B-Jaysus out of her(low gear HIGH SPEED stuff)on the motorway, he remembers a huge puff of exhaust in his rear view mirror........
And that's it really, no more problems.

porsche boy

dont know about that Ardle1. Running a car on pure diptene might overheat cylinders, injectors etc and ruin your engine.

OP I'd avoid these 'my da says, my mate done this' stories as while there may be an element of truth but, second hand stories and all that.

if you want, buy a bottle of diptene from the motor factors and add it as per instructions on the bottle.

dr.fuzzenstein

Nono Toure wrote: »

Where can ethanol be bought? Also, do you add much to the tank? How long before the nct should it be added? Thanks

That is the problem alright. Because of the Irish fcuked up attitude to alcohol and 19th century legislation it is near impossible to buy ethanol. I have been looking this up for weeks now and the only possible sources would be from anywhere else in Europe, where ethanol is recognised as a good, clean fuel, or in stores where you can buy bio ethanol stoves. And even then it is difficult, this being Ireland, you can buy the stoves, but you can't buy the fuel, again due to fcuked up attitude and antiquated laws.
So far the government has strangled every alternative to fossil fuel at birth, it is safe to say they're in the pockets of big oil.

Of course kerosene is easily available and will pass a test with .03 smoke. So owning a diesel is easier in this respect.

Old diesel

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

That is the problem alright. Because of the Irish fcuked up attitude to alcohol and 19th century legislation it is near impossible to buy ethanol. I have been looking this up for weeks now and the only possible sources would be from anywhere else in Europe, where ethanol is recognised as a good, clean fuel, or in stores where you can buy bio ethanol stoves. And even then it is difficult, this being Ireland, you can buy the stoves, but you can't buy the fuel, again due to fcuked up attitude and antiquated laws.
So far the government has strangled every alternative to fossil fuel at birth, it is safe to say they're in the pockets of big oil.

Of course kerosene is easily available and will pass a test with .03 smoke. So owning a diesel is easier in this respect.

They probably want us all to go down the road of electric cars - powered by wind energy

hi5

If you got dipped at the roadside with kerosene in the tank, could you be fined the same as marked diesel?

slimjimmc

hi5 wrote: »

If you got dipped at the roadside with kerosene in the tank, could you be fined the same as marked diesel?

Of course. You can be fined for using any oil as a motor fuel without paying the proper excise.

CiniO

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

That is the problem alright. Because of the Irish fcuked up attitude to alcohol and 19th century legislation it is near impossible to buy ethanol. I have been looking this up for weeks now and the only possible sources would be from anywhere else in Europe, where ethanol is recognised as a good, clean fuel, or in stores where you can buy bio ethanol stoves. And even then it is difficult, this being Ireland, you can buy the stoves, but you can't buy the fuel, again due to fcuked up attitude and antiquated laws.
So far the government has strangled every alternative to fossil fuel at birth, it is safe to say they're in the pockets of big oil.

Of course kerosene is easily available and will pass a test with .03 smoke. So owning a diesel is easier in this respect.

Good point.
I'll bring few of those from Poland next time I'll be there, just in case I need it to push my car through emissions test
That's widely available in any off-licence there 24/7.

Chimaera

It's worth bearing in mind that any diesel car struggling to pass the NCT smoke test has some serious issues with fuelling. There's no reason to think a well-maintained car that's running well will ever fail that test.

Adding some petrol to a diesel car made any time in the last 20 years is going to do damage: the fuel system depends on the fuel for lubrication and adding petrol damages the lubricity of the fuel.

The best thing for a diesel car is to give it an Italian tuneup once a week to prevent soot lodging in the exhaust and make sure any carbon deposits in the engine are burned off. Dipetane has had mixed reviews over the years - you're probably better off with a diesel specific additive if you're worried about fuel quality; something that can enhance cetane and lubricity.

Ethanol is restricted here because people are dumb enough to try and drink it neat. Restrictions vary depending on quality: denatured ethanol is cheaper and easier to get because it contains small percentages of methanol and possibly isopropanol rendering it toxic. The EU biofuels directive has mandated the addition of ethanol to petrol here up to 5% anyway, so there's a good chance any fuel you buy already contains ethanol.

djimi

Nono Toure wrote: »

So he has now spent 500euro to get the problem fixed, and they still failed him even though the mechanic said car was sound. NCT guy said tough luck, go back to your mechanic! Such a shyte system.

Perhaps the car wasnt as "sound" as the mechanic said it was...

ardle1

porsche boy wrote: »

dont know about that Ardle1. Running a car on pure diptene might overheat cylinders, injectors etc and ruin your engine.

OP I'd avoid these 'my da says, my mate done this' stories as while there may be an element of truth but, second hand stories and all that.

if you want, buy a bottle of diptene from the motor factors and add it as per instructions on the bottle.

But it's true I tell ya true...
now he might have had a little more diesel in it! But he definitely put the whole bottle in.. Seriously:)