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PPS Number for recently arrived British national - refused.

  • 28-08-2014 10:51am
    #1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,088 ✭✭✭


    I'm just wondering what the situation with this is.

    A friend of mine is married to a UK national and they've just recently decided to move back to an Irish city.

    He's working she isn't and she went into the Dept of Social Protection Office to get PPS because she needed it for the bank, for rental agreements etc etc.

    The guy on the desk told her she can't get one unless she has a job in the state and that they no longer issue them.

    Is that fact or is the guy just making up new rules?

    She's furious as she knows that the UK counterparts don't treat Irish nationals like that.


Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,862 ✭✭✭Cushie Butterfield


    They should have been told to go to one of the PPS registration centres. The list is here by location: http://www.welfare.ie/en/Pages/Personal-Public-Service-Number-Registration-Centres-by-Count.aspx#dublin

    The only problem they should run into is proof of address. Documents required are here: http://www.welfare.ie/en/Pages/Personal-Public-Service-Number-How-to-Apply.aspx

    They might want to contact Client Identity Services in advance of a visit by ringing 1890 927 999 or +353 71 967 2616 or use this online contact form: https://www.welfare.ie/en/Pages/secure/GENENQ.aspx?subject=Client%20Identity%20Services


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,088 ✭✭✭SpaceTime


    They should have been told to go to one of the PPS registration centres. The list is here by location: http://www.welfare.ie/en/Pages/Personal-Public-Service-Number-Registration-Centres-by-Count.aspx#dublin

    The only problem they should run into is proof of address. Documents required are here: http://www.welfare.ie/en/Pages/Personal-Public-Service-Number-How-to-Apply.aspx

    They might want to contact Client Identity Services in advance of a visit by ringing 1890 927 999 or +353 71 967 2616 or use this online contact form: https://www.welfare.ie/en/Pages/secure/GENENQ.aspx?subject=Client%20Identity%20Services

    They did go to one of the PPS registration centres.
    They were basically told that issuing a PPS wasn't possible unless they were working in the state and told to go away!
    They brought: UK Passport, UK driving licence, proof of Irish address (several documents), marriage certificate and also joint Irish bank account which the bank has opened but still wants PPS.

    She was told that there were new rules in force and that the only way she could get a PPS was by first getting a job in Ireland and that her employer would then issue a letter and she could get one. Otherwise she wasn't entitled to any Irish ID numbers.

    She's actually wondering if it's because she's not ethnically British and they've just taken a turn against her for some kind of racist reason or something.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,228 ✭✭✭mrsbyrne


    http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/social_welfare/irish_social_welfare_system/personal_public_service_number.html
    There's been dome kind of misunderstanding. Can you go back to the office with her? Print off the above and highlight the part applicable and brin g it with you.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,862 ✭✭✭Cushie Butterfield


    SpaceTime wrote: »
    They did go to one of the PPS registration centres.
    They were basically told that issuing a PPS wasn't possible unless they were working in the state and told to go away!
    They brought: UK Passport, UK driving licence, proof of Irish address (several documents), marriage certificate and also joint Irish bank account which the bank has opened but still wants PPS.

    She was told that there were new rules in force and that the only way she could get a PPS was by first getting a job in Ireland and that her employer would then issue a letter and she could get one. Otherwise she wasn't entitled to any Irish ID numbers.

    She's actually wondering if it's because she's not ethnically British and they've just taken a turn against her for some kind of racist reason or something.
    There must have been some confusion - perhaps whoever she spoke to didn't notice she had an EU passport. The only changes that I am aware of is the format of numbers. Ring Client Identity Services to make sure, but she should go back & try again. If she isn't accomodated tell her to insist on speaking to an inspector as this shouldn't have happened.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,088 ✭✭✭SpaceTime


    There must have been some confusion - perhaps whoever she spoke to didn't notice she had an EU passport. The only changes that I am aware of is the format of numbers. Ring Client Identity Services to make sure, but she should go back & try again. If she isn't accomodated tell her to insist on speaking to an inspector as this shouldn't have happened.

    Thanks for the update, I can only assume they just jumped to a conclusion that she was a non-EU national. She's British by naturalisation quite a long time ago but still has an accent and doesn't look British.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,228 ✭✭✭mrsbyrne


    SpaceTime wrote: »
    Thanks for the update, I can only assume they just jumped to a conclusion that she was a non-EU national. She's British by naturalisation quite a long time ago but still has an accent and doesn't look British.

    It wouldn't matter where she was from. See here
    https://www.welfare.ie/en/Pages/Personal-Public-Service-Number-How-to-Apply.aspx
    Also see the link in my last post.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,088 ✭✭✭SpaceTime


    There line was that if you weren't working here you don't need one and they have a new rule about not issuing them.

    Quite bizarre tbh.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,409 ✭✭✭Nomis21


    Your girlfriend was not shown any prejudice.

    I took an Italian girl into my local centre (Tullamore) and she was told that new rules stated that a letter from an employer was now required to get a PPS number.

    I think it is to stop PPS numbers falling into the hands of illegal immigrants.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,862 ✭✭✭Cushie Butterfield


    SpaceTime wrote: »
    There line was that if you weren't working here you don't need one and they have a new rule about not issuing them.

    Quite bizarre tbh.
    A bit of clarification on your friend's wife's situation as regards being issued with a PPS number. There has been no change in rules as regards the issue of one, but they are stepping up enforcing existing rules.

    Someone has to have a reason to be issued with a PPS number (which she has). Banks are obliged to ask for a PPS number but for someone that isn't a resident here they aren't obliged to give one to the bank. The confusion has to have been that it wasn't clear that she is actually now a resident in ROI, or maybe they thought she was non-EU, or had no GNIB card or whatever.

    Anyone who owns a property here is entitled to get one (they are obliged to have one). The situation is that if someone who owns a property walks in to a registration office with a utility bill has to be issued with one on the grounds that they need one to pay property tax & the looming water charges. I know that your friends are renting at the moment, so that's not relevant, but she may need one for him to claim married persons tax credits so that's a valid reason.

    My advice would be to ring the registration office (if it's the Hanover St office in Cork then the number is (021) 4806800 or Bantry is (027) 20820) & ask for a supervisor or inspector. The numbers for the other locations are all in the link in my earlier post. She will have to stress that she is a ROI resident & married to an Irish citizen. They might be able to arrange an appointment time rather than her having to take a ticket & queue again seeing as she has already queued.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,088 ✭✭✭SpaceTime


    It was processed today for her, but she's still not exactly chuffed with the lack of information, lack of clarity and general attitude that she must be trying to cheat the system.

    I can appreciate that they need to ensure fraud doesn't happen, but this isn't how you do that.

    She even brought all her P60s for the last 10 years with her just to prove she had been paying social insurance contribution and to show she hadn't been some kind of burden on the UK state either.

    The whole thing did get processed in the end and they got into some normal humorous banter but they really need to make the whole process much more clear and straight forward. There's no point in having someone coming into an office multiple times for nothing. It's a waste of everyone's time.

    Simplest thing would be to have an online form that you can fill in and print out and bring in with you with the questions pre-asked. Like why do you need the PPS number on a drop down menu.


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