Is this bullying or not?

Yellow diamond

Hi there, just looking for a bit of advice! I recently returned to my job following maternity leave. Everything was going well until I started to notice a 'vibe' towards me by two girls in the office. By vibe I mean subtle things, criticising me, giving me all the crap jobs neither of them will do, sarcastic remarks...etc..The two of them putting their eyes up to heaven if I said something, again very subtle. So I just carried on put my head down, worked away and would make general chit chat etc...

one of the girls is new and only working part time, I get the impression and have heard from others that she thought I wouldn't return to work and she would get my job full time!

Anyways I was feeling a bit anxious going to work the last few weeks but convinced myself I was being over sensitive....until today, I was searching for a sent item in my inbox when I came across an email conversation between these two girls basically calling me a moron. (We share the same email btw I wasn't snooping)

I was really upset, I know I should have stepped back from the situation but I went to my boss crying with the email and told her I wanted to leave as I was sick of the atmosphere. She asked me what other issues I had but I had nothing concrete really only this email. I don't know am I over reacting?? What would people do in this situation I suppose is what I am asking? If they are disciplined I certainly couldn't go back to the three of us sharing a small office together the tension would be unbearable

stinkle

Name calling is bullying, and you have proof of it. Stuff like giving you crap tasks can be too, but may be trickier to prove.

Sorry you're going through this, bullying is awful.

R.D. aka MR.D

What did your boss recommend?

Personally, I would just confront them and see what their problem is.

I know that that might not be the best advice if you want to 'build a bullying case' or whatever but you are all grown women here. Maybe there is a problem that you can work out if not then you can either change jobs or learn to deal with the fact that maybe these 2 women don't like you and just be more assertive with what tasks you'll do.

Teyla Emmagan

Go back to your boss and explain the whole thing. Be totally honest about your concerns. You should not leave over this, are you mad? Then they have won.

Also, try the work and jobs forum. The folks over there are all over their employment law and will give excellent advice. Good luck.

Yellow diamond

Thanks for the advice, I have slept on it and I am clearer this morning! I have been nothing but nice to these girls, I have taken on the additional work and was even being overly helpful....basically I think they want me out! I get on with everyone else in the dept and my performance reviews have been good, so it's not that I am a slacker.

I really don't want to go down the route of reporting this to management officially. Also I don't like confrontation, it's hard when you are outnumbered, but I know I really should stick up for myself.

I told my boss in confidence yesterday and once I calmed down I said I would sleep on it. She said she would leave it with me but was disgusted with the contents of the email too.

It's very childish behaviour!

CaraMay

Keep a note of everything in case it escalates - everything nasty they say to you, jobs they ask you to do etc

Maybe your boss can have a word with them off the record?

stinkle

Yellow diamond wrote: »

Thanks for the advice, I have slept on it and I am clearer this morning! I have been nothing but nice to these girls, I have taken on the additional work and was even being overly helpful....basically I think they want me out! I get on with everyone else in the dept and my performance reviews have been good, so it's not that I am a slacker.

I really don't want to go down the route of reporting this to management officially. Also I don't like confrontation, it's hard when you are outnumbered, but I know I really should stick up for myself.

I told my boss in confidence yesterday and once I calmed down I said I would sleep on it. She said she would leave it with me but was disgusted with the contents of the email too.

It's very childish behaviour!

I'm not up to speed on warnings etc but could they get a verbal or written warning about this?

I've been there in a situation with 2 women being difficult. I tried the assertive thing when being spoken to like a child, and it rattled one a bit. I felt unsupported by my boss though, its great that yours is supportive.

You say you don't want a confrontation, I'm the same but in the long run there was still an atmosphere cos I kinda let too much go, and then couldn't be myself in their company, so was a bit withdrawn. I often wonder would I have been less anxious had I said something, or at least would have had the bad atmosphere but said my piece!

jopax

Definitely two bullies , they should be held accountable or at the very least confronted by management & given a warning.
I think they actually done you a favour by being so stupid to send that email, as you said it is very hard to pinpoint bullying when its done subtly.
Nobody deserves this treatment and with time it would erode your confidence and self esteem, please do what you have to & stand up for yourself.
At the end of the day they caused this, not you with their disgraceful behaviour.
I hope it that your boss shows no tolerance for this bullying.
Best of luck with this.

Stavro Mueller

Whatever you choose to do, nip this in the bud. If you don't take action it'll make things worse for you. Their behaviour will get in on you and you'll be miserable. Also they'll get worse when they see that they're getting away with what they're at. Keep a copy of that email for your own records. Write everything down -dates/times/details. You'd be surprised how quickly you forget things. Even if you don't go down the road of a bullying case, it's no harm to keep these things in your armoury. I'd say they'd not be half so brave if they knew there could be repercussions.

mazdaminx

Are you answerable to them or your boss in terms of jobs/tasks. Ask your boss about the things they are leaving you to do
Meanwhile kill them with kindness and try your best not to show them your annoyance
Oh the power of numbers!
I would probably let boss know you are going to keep a record of their behaviour towards you

Neyite

Pretty much identical thing happend to me after maternity leave. It was really hurtful that my replacement had ingratiated themselves so much, and the galling thing was that only for the systems I set in place before I left that they coped at all with the nature of the work. Junior management was involved, and instrumental in giving me intern tasks and for about 3 weeks I wasnt getting my former work back at all from the replacement.

In my case, I dont have a formal route of HR, so I went to a key person who was very approachable and who was well placed with management for an off the record rant, mentioning that the management person was on thin ice with their efforts to push me out, and that an employment tribunal would have a field day with it as a slam dunk case. Within a day, they had backed right off, I had my role fully restored and the replacement left shortly after.

You are, by law, entitled to have the exact job you had before maternity. They cannot bring you back and give you a lesser role. If they do change your workload, the onus is on the employer to prove that it wasnt related to your maternity leave. Which is difficult when your maternity replacement is still sitting there doing your job.

Its a dangerous situation for your employer - to have employees risk the company ending up in the Labour Court because they used this particular form of bullying which is closely protected in Law. No harm to let your employer know that you know this. If your manager has a spark of sense they will nip this in the bud right now and give those two a serious rap on the knuckles.

And as for quitting? Are you mad?? That is YOUR job, do not let them bully you out of it. Give your manager a few days to act before you do anything rash with your employment.

Yellow diamond

Thanks again everyone, I am on duty this morning at 10. I am going to talk to my boss, I have let it slide for long enough. I agree about the email, I have a copy and I have been taking notes on events.

Yes, I can be a soft touch to a certain extent, and I don't think they will expect me to react, but I am, I am furious this morning rather than upset.....I am going to demand an apology from them both as much as I don't like confrontation. Yeah they will probably be out for my blood after but I think it would be good for management to see exactly what's going on.....

.I should add that in the second part of the email, which I didn't show my boss, was a discussion about her which was quite insulting again name calling. I didn't show her because a. I didn't want to hurt her feelings and b. I was only there to discuss my own issue....I am thinking now should I give her the lot?

Typer Monkey

Yes absolutely show your boss the full email. It strengthens your case and gains you an ally. I wouldn't bother demanding an apology if I were you. It achieves nothing really. I would however take great pleasure in telling them that you're sick to death of their treatment of you and that you'd brought your concerns including the email to your bosses attention and waiting on her advice. Their stomachs will absolutely flip when they realise what they've been caught out saying.

Don't worry about the atmosphere afterwards. You're not friends now so what difference will it really make?

Good luck with it. I was bullied before by a supervisor and I'm in a job with a strict rank structure it was really difficult to deal with. You are in better position as it's colleagues on the same level. It's even better now you can have your boss as an ally

CaraMay

Do definitely show her the full email as obviously she needs to watch her own back as well. How thick were they to email that stuff.

deisemum

You need to show your boss the full email so your boss is fully aware of the extent of their behaviour.

Barely There

I wouldn't bother demanding an apology from them OP - they sound like arseholes and their apology would be worth nothing.

I'd just say to them in a matter-of-fact way, that you saw their email and will be forwarding it to your boss and reporting its contents to HR, and that you'd imagine someone will be contacting them soon about it.

Then just walk away.

cloudatlas

Never ask bullies for anything even an apology or ask them why they are doing it. You know they aren't sorry they've continued this behavior for such a long time, you know the girl who replaced you is jealous of you and wants your job. You shouldn't be asking them for anything they should be asking h.r. if they can hold on to their jobs after the way they've treated you.

Honestly I'm surprised your boss didn't act on it. Do you have a h.r department, you should go straight there with the full email and your notes. That email is absolutely key to your case, even the fact that they were abusive about your boss puts them on shakier ground.

You are protecting these bullies by not exposing the full extent of their malice. They are not your friends. And if they do anything else tell them you will go straight to h.r if it doesn't stop. Zero tolerance policy is all sad jealous bullies understand.

If you want to make a formal complaint then you have to tell your boss that and escalate it to h.r.

LynnGrace

^^ Agreed. I wouldn't recommend asking for an apology either, to be honest.

Neyite

Yellow diamond wrote: »

Thanks again everyone, I am on duty this morning at 10. I am going to talk to my boss, I have let it slide for long enough. I agree about the email, I have a copy and I have been taking notes on events.

Yes, I can be a soft touch to a certain extent, and I don't think they will expect me to react, but I am, I am furious this morning rather than upset.....I am going to demand an apology from them both as much as I don't like confrontation. Yeah they will probably be out for my blood after but I think it would be good for management to see exactly what's going on.....

.I should add that in the second part of the email, which I didn't show my boss, was a discussion about her which was quite insulting again name calling. I didn't show her because a. I didn't want to hurt her feelings and b. I was only there to discuss my own issue....I am thinking now should I give her the lot?

haha, they are so stupid! Deffo forward the full email onto your boss. But dont demand an apology. In fact, I'd just play it cool, say nothing and let your boss handle it. Stay well out of it from here.

Typer Monkey

Actually I agree with Neyite here. If you tell them they'll be forewarned. I'd let your boss catch them on the hop with the email.

Hope your morning went ok. You are in a strong position here with the law on your side so stay strong. You deserve the protection of your boss/HR so don't hesitate to rally them to your cause

Babooshka

Yellow diamond wrote: »

.I should add that in the second part of the email, which I didn't show my boss, was a discussion about her which was quite insulting again name calling. I didn't show her because a. I didn't want to hurt her feelings and b. I was only there to discuss my own issue....I am thinking now should I give her the lot?

It's not your job to censor two idiots who are wasting work time by gassing about others via email (brainless thing to do, speaks volumes about their intelligence level), you should have shown this straight off the bat. You owe them nothing and they should be on a verbal warning at least, depending on the disciplinary procedure in place at work, which you should also be checking in your company handbook / employee terms and conditions. If they don't have one they should have one!

I totally agree with Neyite also - don't demand anything from them or even engage with them and send it all on to your boss

Yellow diamond

Hi op here, work was very eventful today, I spoke with my hr manager this morning and gave her the email. My two colleagues were called in and they have been given warnings.

One of them approached me with an apology which I accepted however I am not sure if it was genuine. The other person has just avoided me today and left early. Yeah it's awkward but I keep reminding myself it's not my fault!

All in all I am happy I stood up for myself. Also my husbands friend is opening a similar business and offered me a job this evening...going to sleep on it but I really think a fresh start is what I need!! Thanks for all the advice!! Mods can prob close this now!

stinkle

Yay brilliant! Wow it says it all that one of them won't interact with you. Good luck with whatever you decide to do, its great to have options!

Stavro Mueller

Yellow diamond wrote: »

All in all I am happy I stood up for myself. Also my husbands friend is opening a similar business and offered me a job this evening...going to sleep on it but I really think a fresh start is what I need!! Thanks for all the advice!! Mods can prob close this now!

Ha ha. It'd be ironic if they got what they wanted - you leaving - but ruined things for themselves.

I'm glad to read this update. Even if you decide against taking this new job for some reason, it wouldn't surprise me if both of them start looking around for a new job. Maybe it's just me but I don't think I'd be able to face coming into work every day and dealing with a boss who had read what I'd typed in an email.... Hopefully things will improve for you from now on -no matter what anyone says, it is bloody awkward to be stuck in an office with two people who've behaved like this. Try to remember that you've got the upper hand here and they'll most likely be terrified that you'll be going to the boss again if they step out of line. Bullies often aren't so brave when they're faced down.

LynnGrace

Yellow diamond wrote: »

Hi op here, work was very eventful today, I spoke with my hr manager this morning and gave her the email. My two colleagues were called in and they have been given warnings.

One of them approached me with an apology which I accepted however I am not sure if it was genuine. The other person has just avoided me today and left early. Yeah it's awkward but I keep reminding myself it's not my fault!

All in all I am happy I stood up for myself. Also my husbands friend is opening a similar business and offered me a job this evening...going to sleep on it but I really think a fresh start is what I need!! Thanks for all the advice!! Mods can prob close this now!

Well done. A nasty situation, but you came through it in a very dignified way. Don't rush into any decision about changing jobs. Best of luck in whatever you decide.

ABajaninCork

Good for you! Just tell yourself this: You can't fix stupid. And let those two thick cows stew in their own juices - Serves them right!!

New Home

I've been bullied myself and it's horrible. Bullies are despicable. It stopped in every areas of my life when I decided to consistently stand up for myself. I said to myself, firmly: "ENOUGH IS ENOUGH. I'M NOT WILLING TO GO THROUGH THIS ANY MORE. I AM NOT PUTTING UP WITH THIS ANY LONGER." And for once I meant it. Then I said to myself: "If they did this to someone I care about, let's say my children, would I stand up to the bullies to defend them, or would I pretend nothing happened in order not to cause any trouble?" All in all, you have to say to yourself that you will defend yourself against them, because if you don't stand up to them for you, who will? You'll probably be very anxious/nervous about it at first, but as you your confidence grows you'll feel much stronger. You are in the right. Even if they had a bone to pick with you for whatever reason - and I'm definitely not saying this is the case - there is no excuse for their behaviour. Bullying is wrong, full stop.

Good luck with everything.

Glad to hear your update OP. Closed per request
If you need any further advice please PM any of the PI mods to re open