Expired tourist visas, but working here

goz83

My sister in law is Swedish, she has been living here for a few years, married to my brother, who is Irish.

Anyway, in recent times she has encouraged a friend and her niece to come to Ireland on tourist visas and to find work as cleaners, or looking after children. The thing is, my brother knows that both their visas are well expired and that they both still work even though they apparently were not entitled to work in the first place. I assume it's all into the hand and it has been grating on his nerves for some time now. I have to say, it annoyed me too, but I wasn't aware that Swedish citizens required any visa to work here.

What are the steps necessary to stop this abuse of the system? He wouldn't know all their details and would only know them on a first name basis.

coylemj

The 'friend and her niece' can't be Swedish or they wouldn't need visas to work here, Sweden is in the EU.

goz83

coylemj wrote: »

The 'friend and her niece' can't be Swedish or they wouldn't need visas to work here, Sweden is in the EU.

That was my thinking on it alright. But then I checked online and there seems to be something about tourist visas for swedes having to apply via the Danish embassy. See the part where it says The Consulate does not have the authority to deal with the following matters:
•Holiday visa applications (Schengen Visas).
Applicants to apply to the Danish Embassy in Dublin


•Residency applications or work visa applications and applications for residency cards.


http://www.swedenabroad.com/en-GB/Embassies/Europe/About-us/Ireland/

I know her niece is definitely Swedish and her friend, well I assume she is too, but I could be wrong about the friend.

haro124

Just went through that link and it seems to be for non EU/ visa exempt citizens who are in living in Ireland and planning on travelling to Sweden

Pro Hoc Vice

goz83 wrote: »

That was my thinking on it alright. But then I checked online and there seems to be something about tourist visas for swedes having to apply via the Danish embassy. See the part where it says The Consulate does not have the authority to deal with the following matters:
•Holiday visa applications (Schengen Visas).
Applicants to apply to the Danish Embassy in Dublin


•Residency applications or work visa applications and applications for residency cards.


http://www.swedenabroad.com/en-GB/Embassies/Europe/About-us/Ireland/

I know her niece is definitely Swedish and her friend, well I assume she is too, but I could be wrong about the friend.

Sweden is a member of the EU as such its citizens have the right to free movement.

Vojera

Are you 100% sure they had visas? Swedish citizens do not need any sort of tourist visa to visit Ireland, nor do they require a working visa.

Either they are not Swedish or there's some confusion. Maybe they're being paid under the table and that's what the concerns are?

Pro Hoc Vice

Vojera wrote: »

Are you 100% sure they had visas? Swedish citizens do not need any sort of tourist visa to visit Ireland, nor do they require a working visa.

Either they are not Swedish or there's some confusion. Maybe they're being paid under the table and that's what the concerns are?

I would guess either not Swedish or the OP and her brother are confused, considering that she must know her sister in laws nationality I will go with confused.

goz83

Vojera wrote: »

Are you 100% sure they had visas? Swedish citizens do not need any sort of tourist visa to visit Ireland, nor do they require a working visa.

Either they are not Swedish or there's some confusion. Maybe they're being paid under the table and that's what the concerns are?

I'll have to ask him. I brushed it off, saying that Sweden is in the EU and they don't need visas. I suppose if you're tired and using google, you can find anything for and against if you don't pay attention. Thanks all. Confirmed my original thoughts.

goz83

Pro Hoc Vice wrote: »

I would guess either not Swedish or the OP and her his brother are confused, considering that she must know her sister in laws nationality I will go with confused.

we all get a bit confused from time to time

Pro Hoc Vice

goz83 wrote: »

we all get a bit confused from time to time

Very true and rather sexist of me.

Bob24

If they are Swedish citizens, they neither need a tourist visa nor a work permit. Same if your decided to move to Sweden tomorrow: you can just go to the airport, fly there, start working the same day if you find a job, and spend the rest of your life there.

As EU citizens, the only case they would not be allowed to stay in Ireland is if they stay longer than three months and don't either start working or become students here.

Maybe you got something wrong? If they are "from Sweden" but not actually citizens of Sweden or another EU state, or Swedish but working unofficially without paying their due tax/PRSI; they could indeed be illegal.

the_syco

goz83 wrote: »

Anyway, in recent times she has encouraged a friend and her niece to come to Ireland on tourist visas and to find work as cleaners, or looking after children. The thing is, my brother knows that both their visas are well expired and that they both still work even though they apparently were not entitled to work in the first place.

I'm thinking that although the sister in law is Swedish, the "friends" are not?

goz83

Bob24 wrote: »

If they are Swedish citizens, they neither need a tourist visa nor a work permit. Same if your decided to move to Sweden tomorrow: you can just go to the airport, fly there, start working the same day if you find a job, and spend the rest of your life there.

As EU citizens, the only case they would not be allowed to stay in Ireland is if they stay longer than three months and don't either start working or become students here.

Maybe you got something wrong? If they are "from Sweden" but not actually citizens of Sweden or another EU state, or Swedish but working unofficially without paying their due tax/PRSI; they could indeed be illegal.

Maybe that's it. They are paid into the hand. He is sure of that much. He threatened to report them and his wife (now separated) went crazy about it. So something is not right.

Bob24

I guess this is it ... EU citizens can only stay 3 months at a time if they are not working or studying in the country.

I don't think much would happen if he was to report them though. They could just either leave and come back as tourists again (unless Ireland wants to consider them a threat to national security border control has to let them through), or if this hasn't been going on for too long they can say they are self employed and were planning to register with revenue shortly.

The only thing is revenue might chase them for the missing taxes ... but I doubt they would be bothered unless large amounts of money are involved.

johnnyskeleton

goz83 wrote: »

Maybe that's it. They are paid into the hand. He is sure of that much. He threatened to report them and his wife (now separated) went crazy about it. So something is not right.

My advice, tel him to forget about it.

Pro Hoc Vice

Bob24 wrote: »

I guess this is it ... EU citizens can only stay 3 months at a time if they are not working or studying in the country.

I don't think much would happen if he was to report them though. They could just either leave and come back as tourists again (unless Ireland wants to consider them a threat to national security border control has to let them through), or if this hasn't been going on for too long they can say they are self employed and were planning to register with revenue shortly.

The only thing is revenue might chase them for the missing taxes ... but I doubt they would be bothered unless large amounts of money are involved.

What about OAP's or those a who are otherwise self sufficient, what about a person seeking work or members of the family of a person working.

Bob24

Pro Hoc Vice wrote: »

What about OAP's or those a who are otherwise self sufficient, what about a person seeking work or members of the family of a person working.

Well I was keeping it simple as from the information given by the OP these cases don't apply here ... but yes I am pretty familiar with directive 2004/38/EC and it indeed also includes the cases you mentioned ;-) (though as far as I know a person seeking work could only stay more than 3 months if they were working here previously to becoming a job seeker and left employement involuntarily)