Pregnancy, motherhood and careers.

madeinamerica

Hi. I'm wondering how those who choose to continue with a career after having a child find it. Your own feelings, reactions of those you work with, what others in your profession do etc etc.

I'm 36 weeks now. For me, i want to continue my career as I'm the primary bread winner at the moment and i have goals that i want to achieve. My work is a big part if my life. But I've been surprised as I've had mixed feelings myself and mixed responses. In my area, the majority at the top are men and i work with a lot of guys at the moment. Of the 8 group leaders on my floor, 2 are women and one of those really got the job as her husband was head hunted to the place. I've noticed that most work conversations I've had about my pregnancy have been with guys telling me about their wives and kids. No women having kids at my stage (I'm 33). Before I was pregnant or before I announced it, I had conversations with a few women at my level who basically are of the opinion that for s woman to have a child at this stage is madness (we're early 30s) and a couple said they'd wait till they got to the next career stage, which is at about age 40+ (they haven't mentioned such things since i announced my pregnancy). I guess I've never felt a distinction between myself and the guys or child-free women before, but now I really realise there is a difference. While I have a very supportive other half, I don't have someone to have my babies for me! I wonder sometimes do I have what it takes to succeed and have kids, or should I even try to do what is necessary? The job tends to have long hours. Then other times, I know that I will regret it for the rest of my life if I don't at least try.

All this could change once the baby arrives!

I'd love to know others thoughts or experiences, or thoughts on my own situation. Thanks.

pwurple

I have continued with my career, just in the last few weeks of mat leave for baby 2.

I find it fine really. I really enjoy my work, find it fulfilling. My dad had the biggest problem with it I think, at the start. I'm not sure why, as my mum worked (part time) when we were children... But he made several remarks about me throwing them into crèche, etc. he got over it though.

Mostly, no-one bats an eyelid at work. I tend to not talk about my family though in there. I remember having to leave early one day because my daughter was in hospital, and someone saying they didn't realise I had a child.

There was one guy who told myself and my colleague (she was female, no children) to go home and look after our homes when a meeting was running late. She took him down a few pegs, and that was that.

When I think of the number of professional women I meet nearly every day, many of whom have children, I know there are loads of us... Our gp, our solicitor, accountant, shopkeeper, pharmacist, dentist etc.

All getting on with it.

househunter

I'm expecting my 2nd too, with a few weeks to go in work. I became pregnant soon after i returned from maternity leave after the 1st and there were some smart comments about that but only in a jokey way. I work with mostly men but i never have any issues. Since i came back to work though things have changed. I have to leave at a particular time to get home to collect my son from the childminder - if its my turn (my husband works for the same company and we take turns dropping off and picking up). I just can't stay late when that's the case, whereas before I'd often work late. I do find that because of this i spend more time checking and responding to emails in the evenings and at weekends which is confounded by the fact that since I've come back I also work more with people on the west coast of the US. So all in all i find it fine but if i was under pressure to stay in the office later, i know it would cause problems. I want to get to spend at least some time with my son before he goes to bed. It would kill me not to see him for at least some time every day. I also take parental leave and use it to work a 4 day week at the moment. That has mostly worked out well so far

Moonbeam

I had a good career too but about a year after #2 I left,when I go back to work everything will have changed in the IT industry but although I have days that I feel I am really missing out I love kids and mostly enjoy being home.
I was the 1st woman in the company to ever take maternity leave and everybody was so nice to me but I was not the same after 2 kids.
It did affect my identity and social life as being a Geek was a lot of both for me.
If the cost of childcare was not a factor I would work part time.
My husband travels a lot and chances are given who the big IT employers are so would I and I would not be able for that.
I joke about retiring before I was 30!
It is up to you only you know what you want to do and working with a child is perfectly acceptable, if we were all the same it would be boring!

Chattastrophe!

I couldn't be a full-time mother. Ultimate respect to those who do it - the "constantness" of it, never being able to switch off, always thinking about the next feed or nappy - it's exhausting. I love and adore my son, but I also love going to work and switching off for several hours every day. People say that being a working mother is like having two full-time jobs - to me, it's more like my working day is a relief from my other "job", and makes me appreciate the time with my son SO much more. Working part-time flexible hours on good money would be the ideal ... in a perfect world, lol!

Rose35

I have only one child so far anyway, he is 2 now, I went back to work 6 months after he was born, it
can be tough at times running a house and working full-time but I try to get as much housework as I can
out of the way in the evenings during the week so I can enjoy the weekends with my son.
I enjoy working and most of all I enjoy the money as I like to shop and do things with my child.
It wouldn't have been an option for me to give up work though, I would like to go part-time even 4 days a week but
this is not an option in my job at present, I would love a second baby but I would find it challenging with two and working full-time or maybe not who knows, I am pretty wrecked most nights when I fall into my bed but I wouldn't change a thing and my little one enjoys creche meeting his little friends everyday, it makes a difference that we have a great creche just up the road from our house so Im confident leaving him there every day. I think my little man would be bored at home with me everyday and I don't think it is for me to be a stay at home mum either, also, i work with great people that make the days go that little bit faster.

madeinamerica

Thanks for your replies ladies. It is great to hear that sticking with the career is worth it for yourself, despite being tough. I feel the same. I spent a long time training for my job and I'd feel like I was missing an arm if I left. I know people do do it, and do it well. It all just seems overwhelming at the moment.

As an aside, I just heard that when a woman came back from 6 weeks maternity leave here, her male group leader said 'now you've had your 6 week vacation...' wtf

Cameoette

madeinamerica wrote: »

As an aside, I just heard that when a woman came back from 6 weeks maternity leave here, her male group leader said 'now you've had your 6 week vacation...' wtf

:eek: I hope she opened a can of whoopass on him.

I have no experience to share, but I'm definitely fretting a bit about how I will manage...I will probably be starting a PhD the following September and I am wondering half the time am I mad, but then in ways it offers more flexibility than a full-time job, but then you're on a lot less money..but don't pay tax on it...so there's a lot to think about. I have just finished my undergraduate degree that I went back as a mature student to do, so I'm at a kind of a crossroads career wise anyway. I guess I haven't even started my career!

madeinamerica

Cameoette wrote: »

:eek: I hope she opened a can of whoopass on him.

I have no experience to share, but I'm definitely fretting a bit about how I will manage...I will probably be starting a PhD the following September and I am wondering half the time am I mad, but then in ways it offers more flexibility than a full-time job, but then you're on a lot less money..but don't pay tax on it...so there's a lot to think about. I have just finished my undergraduate degree that I went back as a mature student to do, so I'm at a kind of a crossroads career wise anyway. I guess I haven't even started my career!

I don't know if she did, I doubt it as it's not an uncommon view here

What will you be doing your PhD in? From my experience in science, it is a hard slog but you can mainly choose your own hours (depending on the lab of course) which can make it easier with creche times, sick babies etc. I only know a few people who had kids during a phd, tough but doable. If your little one is a year when you start then that would be easier. The money is woeful and the work can drive you nuts but if it's what you really want to do then it is worth it

Sligo1

Cameoette wrote: »

:eek: I hope she opened a can of whoopass on him.

I have no experience to share, but I'm definitely fretting a bit about how I will manage...I will probably be starting a PhD the following September and I am wondering half the time am I mad, but then in ways it offers more flexibility than a full-time job, but then you're on a lot less money..but don't pay tax on it...so there's a lot to think about. I have just finished my undergraduate degree that I went back as a mature student to do, so I'm at a kind of a crossroads career wise anyway. I guess I haven't even started my career!

O fair dues to you! I was hoping to start my PhD in 2013 after my son was born (Nov 2012)... That didn't happen as I got pregnant again in June 2013. I really thought with all the time off id have loads of time to work on my PhD. No chance. I think if I had applied myself properly I might have gotten into it... But I feel like baby brain has taken over and all I'm thinking about is when is the best time to have another one!

I'm usually such a motivated person when it comes to my career... But these last couple years have really changed me... And I'm not sure if it's for the better... I just don't know. I'm definitely a more caring person and I just don't wanna leave my kids... But I also feel like I've stopped being a part of me aswell which isn't right...

I hope you succeed in what you want to do. Hopefully I'll be there someday aswell .

monflat

I remember my father saying that to me how long more have you on.your holidays?

Holidays? Men have not a clue. he at the time kept bringing up the subject of dozol or a drop of whiskey with my first who was extremely colicky.
It was obvious.who looked after us when we were younger as he just can't stand a baby crying.


Anyways on my first I could not wait to get backto work.
With a bad dose of PND ( which I did not accept until 11 months later) I craved a bit of reality again.

I was silly trying to do it all exercise to get my figure back.
Breastfeed. look after a colicky baby
I galloped back to work at 8 months.

After second I had a lovely time.
Easy baby easier to look after 2 children than one
Went back to work because I felt that I'm.more than just a mother that's my thinking to fulfill my own needs.

Now after this 3 Rd baby I'd be more content to stay at home part time.

I see how quickly the other two are growing and learning.
But I'd say il go back part time just for pocket money etc.

However I think staying at home with children is the hardest job ever.
I don't think I'd do it forever.

However you will know yourself when the time comes
How they change.your lives!

madeinamerica

Thanks for your honesty, ladies.

I've no experience with small children so I've no idea what I'd feel like being at home a long time. Not that I'll have the chance with this baby with 4 months mat leave.


That'd be pretty annoying coming from your Dad, monflat.

negative views of mat leave aren't restricted to the older generation. A friend in his mid-30s basically said he thought mat leave was a terrible drain on companies. This was while his wife was pregnant. I don't know how such people expect the world to work without it, unpaid mat leave? all mothers stay at home? stop having kids?

pwurple

He is right though. Maternity leave is a drain on companies. I know some small companies who don't hire any women for exactly that reason. If there was equal paternityleave, or sharable paid parental leave like in nordic countries, it would even things out.

For women who are the main earners in a family it often makes sense that fathers would do some infant childcare. Maternity benefit here is only transferrable here when the mother dies during the leave.

wuffly

No experience to share (yet) at the moment i live in the middle east where you get 45 calenders mat leave. I have no idea how i am going to work it, when it happens. We have 5 girls pregnant in the office at the moment and one has not taken any leave for last few years so she will have an additional 90 days my boss is having a sh*t fit and she's not even in our dept (he's English with a wife and 3 kids so i just stare and him and think asshole) all i hear everyday is that if you don't need someone for 3 months you don't need them. There is no such thing as maternity cover due all the visa costs etc... So basically I feel like my boss is telling me you're back in 6 weeks or you're fired. Back home i think its a choice you can only make you have kids, most of my friends have taken the opposite track to what they expected. Although because of the situation here i know a ton of entrepreneurs, and personally I am so over working for other people, hoping to have small business going by the time i have kids so i don't have to go back to 12hr days and 24hr blackberry!

madeinamerica

pwurple wrote: »

He is right though. Maternity leave is a drain on companies. I know some small companies who don't hire any women for exactly that reason. If there was equal paternityleave, or sharable paid parental leave like in nordic countries, it would even things out.

For women who are the main earners in a family it often makes sense that fathers would do some infant childcare. Maternity benefit here is only transferrable here when the mother dies during the leave.

While I have to agree with you that technically it is a drain, that is also a very narrow view of society and individuals. Yes, the way current mat leave is in Ireland (I won't even talk about the states) does put all the onus on the mother while leaving out the father. This skews things, as it seems that women who have kids are a drain. However, the world will not function without a new generation so there has to be new children born. Bearing children isn't a lifestyle choice, it is a necessity. And really, we need each generation to have the best chance possibleThat might sounds bit 'out there', but in reality it is true.

So the question is what do we do with these necessary children? One way is for governments to give more paternal leave and even up the playing field a little. Then the birth of a child is not a woman's issue but a parents' issue - it does take two to tango and some people may stop seeing it as a holiday and more of a useful role. Of course, changing perceptions and behaviours are very difficult and take a long time. Apparently even in one of the wonderful scandanavian countries that gives parental leave that can be shared between both parents, not a lot of men were taking it up so the government changed the rules to where if the men didn't take it then the mother couldnt use that time either. Nudging by government can work.

Another point is that businesses etc do not run society, otherwise we'd be on 7 day weeks, 14 hr days, no holidays, no sick pay, children working etc etc. The reason we have protected holidays, sick days etc is to protect the worker from exploitation and also in the long run make society better. I see maternity/paternity leave as being in that group. It is something that makes workers better (seriously, how functional is a sleep deprived new mother with a 6 week old? why rush them back to work when it can lead to more PND? etc) and makes society better (ensures new babies have good care early on e.g. with one or two constant people, keeps women in workforce, stops a leaky pipeline in careers etc).

Must go do some work, but I could go on!

Cameoette

madeinamerica wrote: »

I don't know if she did, I doubt it as it's not an uncommon view here

What will you be doing your PhD in? From my experience in science, it is a hard slog but you can mainly choose your own hours (depending on the lab of course) which can make it easier with creche times, sick babies etc. I only know a few people who had kids during a phd, tough but doable. If your little one is a year when you start then that would be easier. The money is woeful and the work can drive you nuts but if it's what you really want to do then it is worth it

Immunology hopefully It's great to hear that it can be done!

Millem

I will probably throw a spanner in the works!!! I couldn't do the hours my OH does, (which is probably normal private sector hours) on a very good day he will get home at 5.45 but usually it's more like 7. I remember doing a few days work during the summer and I didn't get home till 6, I was wrecked, had to feed baby, do housework etc etc etc I didn't get to sit down till 9pm. I just felt like there was no point to working because I didn't get to see the baby as he goes to bed at 7.

I am very lucky with my hours, holidays and the fact that I love my job
I am looking actually forward to going back to work next week I definitely will scale back on the extra marking work I do for lc/jc because I feel my time off is precious with the baby.
I am absolutely no desire for promotions of any kind and am very content in the position I'm in. There has never been a day that I dread going into work. I do think I would like to always work and if things got too hectic I would job share.

pwurple

That's a good point millem. All the house stuff still needs to be done.

I tried to get super-organised for working so we can actually have a life as well.

-Groceries get delivered. Our local shop does deliveries really early morning.

-Cleaner. If you are both out all day working, someone to help with cleaning/ironing will save your marriage. Plus, you actually have to tidy so they can get to the floor, so it keeps you in a routine.

-Work clothes in very limited palette. It's boring, but I have a set of work clothes, that ALL go with eachother. This is so if I get puked on, or coated with baby breakfast first thing in the morning, there is always a backup top/pants ready to go.

-Be extra efficient at work. Arrive on time, get work done at work, no dawdling, no leaving late unless really essential.

Millem

pwurple wrote: »

That's a good point millem. All the house stuff still needs to be done.

I tried to get super-organised for working so we can actually have a life as well.

-Groceries get delivered. Our local shop does deliveries really early morning.

-Cleaner. If you are both out all day working, someone to help with cleaning/ironing will save your marriage. Plus, you actually have to tidy so they can get to the floor, so it keeps you in a routine.

-Work clothes in very limited palette. It's boring, but I have a set of work clothes, that ALL go with eachother. This is so if I get puked on, or coated with baby breakfast first thing in the morning, there is always a backup top/pants ready to go.

-Be extra efficient at work. Arrive on time, get work done at work, no dawdling, no leaving late unless really essential.

I felt so bad on my poor dogs who were so neglected those days!

madeinamerica

pwurple wrote: »

That's a good point millem. All the house stuff still needs to be done.

I tried to get super-organised for working so we can actually have a life as well.

-Groceries get delivered. Our local shop does deliveries really early morning.

-Cleaner. If you are both out all day working, someone to help with cleaning/ironing will save your marriage. Plus, you actually have to tidy so they can get to the floor, so it keeps you in a routine.

-Work clothes in very limited palette. It's boring, but I have a set of work clothes, that ALL go with eachother. This is so if I get puked on, or coated with baby breakfast first thing in the morning, there is always a backup top/pants ready to go.

-Be extra efficient at work. Arrive on time, get work done at work, no dawdling, no leaving late unless really essential.

Great advice, thanks pwurple.

madeinamerica

Millem wrote: »

I will probably throw a spanner in the works!!! I couldn't do the hours my OH does, (which is probably normal private sector hours) on a very good day he will get home at 5.45 but usually it's more like 7. I remember doing a few days work during the summer and I didn't get home till 6, I was wrecked, had to feed baby, do housework etc etc etc I didn't get to sit down till 9pm. I just felt like there was no point to working because I didn't get to see the baby as he goes to bed at 7.

I am very lucky with my hours, holidays and the fact that I love my job
I am looking actually forward to going back to work next week I definitely will scale back on the extra marking work I do for lc/jc because I feel my time off is precious with the baby.
I am absolutely no desire for promotions of any kind and am very content in the position I'm in. There has never been a day that I dread going into work. I do think I would like to always work and if things got too hectic I would job share.

Not a spanner at all, Millem! It is great to hear all sides, thanks.

I'm in a different type of work where its not so much wanting promotions but if I want to continue working in this sector I need to move up; there are no constant positions until (if) I get to the one about 10 years down the road. I can only stay in my current position for 5 years max, in the next level perhaps for 2-3 then the next is usually 5 again. So it is either move up or get out. (Cameoette, fyi academia is a bitch!)

Millem, about you loving your time with your baby, I can totally see that. My other half works from home and hopes to look after bubs from month 4-6, after which he'll go to a creche 2-3 days a week with Dad minding him the rest. I have a fear that I will get really jealous of the time he'll get to spend with the baby, even dropping off to creche etc. I know it will be a crazy envy and I will at the same time be so grateful that he'll get to be with the baby so much as I know he'll be great, but still I think it might be hard for me. I'm having a right pity-party for myself here!!

lazygal

I'm due back to work shortly. We have two children and they'll be going to a minder. I half thought I could do the stay at home parent thing on my first but second time around I know being at home full time is not for me. I really admire men and women who do it, but I'm looking forward to getting back to work. I like my job but I am not particularly ambitious and the hours are not family friendly, even less so the higher you go, so I'll just plod along. My husband has adjusted his hours so we can juggle drop offs and pick ups. We both had two parents who worked outside the home so we're used to that family dynamic.
I agree about getting a cleaner. Cuts out 95% of the rows in this house anyway.
Go in, do the job, and don't leave unless absolutely necessary. My husband would find it easier to leave for an emergency than I would so he's on call for that.
Have everything ready for leaving the house before you go to bed when the kids aren't around. It takes way less time and stress than during the morning rush.
And don't use the children as a bargaining chip as to why you need certain holidays or time off. Everyone, including those who don't have children, has reasons for wanting some arrangements. I worked in a place where those with children got first pick for the 'nicer' hours and it caused massive resentment.

FurBabyMomma

When I hear about people complaining about mat leave I always wonder, so do you think the customers that keep you in a paying job just materialise out of thin air??? But I do think maternity leave is unfairly weighted and I can see why many employers secretly wouldn't employ a woman of childbearing age for that reason unfortunately.

The position I'm in is the thought of going back to where I was working fills me with dread. Before I got pregnant I was planning on starting my own business. I still plan on doing that, but I'm afraid with a new baby and a new mortgage I won't be brave enough to take that leap in case it goes wrong.

spottybananas

FurBabyMomma wrote: »

The position I'm in is the thought of going back to where I was working fills me with dread. Before I got pregnant I was planning on starting my own business. I still plan on doing that, but I'm afraid with a new baby and a new mortgage I won't be brave enough to take that leap in case it goes wrong.

I run my own business, just found out I'm pregnant, and am terrified. No maternity leave (I will only be able to take a few weeks off really), no maternity pay - if I don't work I don't make money. The positives are that I can work around my husband's hours mostly so we won't need childcare, and I will be able to be at home quite a lot, but for now I'm not sure the positives outweigh the negatives, and I'm terrified. Being self employed always has its pros and cons but now I'm struggling to see that the pros are actually worth it.

I would love to be a SAHM, but that won't be possible financially really. I'm ambitious-ish, but if/when we have a baby/children my career options will be even more limited due to the rural area we live in and stuff, unless I was to commute quite far and that's not possible with costs and my husband's work hours.

FurBabyMomma

Spottybananas are you not entitled to state maternity benefit if you've paid a certain amount of PRSI? That's the impression I got when I did a small business course and there's also a page for self employed people to fill in on the application form.

Unfortunately where I work atm does not pay your maternity leave so I'm going on to the state benefit. I was hoping to start up my own business while on maternity leave but was informed that I'd then lose the state benefit.

So basically my plan is to ask for unpaid leave from the day job after my mat leave and have my business ready to launch by then so I can at least give it a shot.

spottybananas

Sorry I mean my job doesn't pay maternity benefit, I will probably get the state one but my job doesn't provide me with maternity leave/pay, etc. I can't take much time off from work, so I won't get state maternity benefit for more than a month or two anyway.

How Strange

I found working fulltime after my first child quite manageable once we got into a routine. We got a cleaner on the advice of other working mums and that has been our lifeline. It's the best €30 we spend a week.

I've found working fulltime with two small kids (baby and toddler) tough going. It's like being on a threadmill. It seems like we never stop and there's always something to be done. I've turned into one of those women who I never thought in a million years that I'd be. I can't sit down as I'm always thinking of what I have to do next. Then add the sleep deprivation in there and some days in work I can hardly put a sentence together (happened last week).

Also I feel the kids aren't able for 5 long days in crèche especially during the winter. We're all exhausted and grumpy by Thursday evening.

I'm starting my parental leave today so I'm doing 3 full days and 2 half days and I'll take the kids home from crèche at lunch time. I think this will give us a bit more of a balance and everyone can relax a bit more.

I couldn't imagine giving up my job as I'm not cut out to be at home fulltime with kids. However, with two little kids I needed to do something and thankfully my employer was open to considering different options for parental leave.