I have a criminal record

LegacyUser

So heres my story, circa 2 years ago I got into a fight. I wouldnt be a violent person infact i never fought in my life before hand.This was a one off night out which just happened and i reacted. Fast forward i was arrested and ultimatly charged for assault. At the time my life simply stopped, I was working away both in my part time job and in college.I felt i had lost everything i had worked for and "sure whats the point on continuing if its not gonna get you anywhere". it was the first and only time (touch wood) i thought about ending it there and then. I failed my exams, spend un-endless amounts of time up at night researching possibilites/outcomes etc. I eventually decided to see a councilor who helped me meet the right people who could help me. Anyways eventually after picking myself up out of the rut i eventually dealt with the matter hands on and in court i walked out with a fine criminal record.


Fast forward to present; Im 24 and im still in college,going into final year sitting on a 2.1 avrg. I have worked since i was 15 and from then i have more less become dependant from there on...ie pay for my own stuff/trips if any/car/college fees/rent/courtdates^^ etc....The relationship between work and college hasnt been great as i tend to work when i should be studying,but then again if i dont have a job i dont have college(i have loans to pay off also)

I have just been offered a parttime job where by the pay is quite good for being a part-time student.Here goes my conundrum.They have asked on there contract whether or not I have a criminal record. in my head its like,if i say yes this could go belly up for me. If i say no, they might do a background check as part of there recruitment process and then i dont have a leg to stand on. I have had this issue before with numerous insurance companies whereby they are very enthusiastic to give you quotes and do the deal there and then but once they ask the question about having a criminal record they arnt interested. It would be considered a sales retail role but still very good pay all the same.
I hope this hasnt been too long of a read but I apriciate any response,
Thanks

Barely There

In all liklihood they won't do a background check.

Just answer 'no' to the question and ignore the high-horse responses you're likely to get in this thread.

Magicmatilda

AFAIK and check this - depending on the sentance it is possible to get your conviction expunged after a certain period of time. This does not apply to specific types of convictions, like sex offences I believe. Worth checking out as this is something that will come up for you again and again.

It is unlikely that they will check, however in the future for more serious roles they may do.

In this instance I would take my chances.

JillyQ

What type of work is it. In certain sectors the company must do a backround check on you. If this is done any conviction will show up.

ShowMeTheCash

A part-time job I would not worry too much about it.

Also I kind of know your situation, my second year at uni I walked out of the bar into a brawl, my attempt initially was to stop it but soon turned into me having to fend off two guys, long storty short both guys ended up in hospital and I was up on two section 2's Assult and a section 6 breach of the peace.

It was untimately thrown out by the judge but was scary none the less.

I know a guy who has a pretty serious assult charge but he is working for Intel so it did not seem to stop him from landing a good job.

Arthur Beesley

Honesty is the best policy.

jimmycrackcorm

Arthur Beesley wrote: »

Honesty is the best policy.

Unless it is a job that actually necessitates a background check then I'd say no. The only thing honesty will get here is a job refusal.

Silverman11

I say tell the truth but you could possibly put in a cover note and explain the situation if you want.

NipNip

Hitting brick walls won't help you. Why don't you tell them what you have told us all here?

Lou.m

<Mod Snip: Please do not quote an entire OP. The quote facility is good for picking out specific points. Quoting the entire passage is unnecessary and clogs up the thread with duplicate posts. Please be mindful of other posters who continually find themselves scrolling through the same body of text and only use the quote facility to discuss specific points in the post >

I would tell the truth and explain.

How are you going to explain that part of your life? The sudden stop ect?

I really understand working whilst trying to get a degree is very hard. I would explain and perhaps they could see your turn around as a sign of strength.

I don't know the complications you may face though I have never even gotten a ticket. You might be better asking for advice from someone who deals with these things.

Lux23

I don't think they can do a background check without you filling out a Garda vetting form.

Chattastrophe!

If you say yes, I'd say it's extremely unlikely you'll be offered the job - no matter how you try to explain it.

If you say no, well, chances are they won't do a background check. You'd probably get away with it. Even if you were found out, and weren't offered the job as a result, it's the same outcome as if you'd said yes. You'd be no worse off.

I'd say take the chance, say no, and hope for the best!

lovelyjubbly

Was it reported in a paper, as in if they Google your name will it come up?

jd83

Unless its a role that you needs garda vetting for e.g working with children, civil service or others i cant think of now they cant do garda vetting.

The only way they could check would be to get you to request a certificate of good character from your local garda superintendent.

anncoates

jd83 wrote: »

Unless its a role that you needs garda vetting for e.g working with children, civil service or others i cant think of now they cant do garda vetting.

My current job did a check on me and it's not any of those jobs.

I did have to consent to the check though so you'll have warning.

JillyQ

Jon Odd Racer wrote: »

I wouldnt disclose it. I've heard of jobs going as far as ringing up previous employers and saying did this bloke actually work for you etc but unless its a job like teacher etc I really don't see them looking into it and as someone said I think you have to consent to it. The gards wont just give out info to anyone who asks.

Did you defo get convicted?

There is plenty of job's where backround checks are done. From what I remember what used to come back was something like known to the gardai

skooterblue2

JillyQ wrote: »

There is plenty of job's where backround checks are done.

From what I know of recruitment agencies in the manufacturing sector:
As long as the two previous references are from solid backgrounds (college, MNC, public establish figure in business(not clergy)) and you can account for your time.... there is no need to double check everything.

Most recruitment agencies about getting people into jobs ASAP, money back from the employer. If there are no grey areas there is no need to go probing.

I imagine if there is meeting vunerable people or children or dealing with the security forces it should not be a bother. If you could be found out later your employer can dismiss you.

I would say stay quiet.....

JillyQ

skooterblue2 wrote: »

From what I know of recruitment agencies in the manufacturing sector:
As long as the two previous references are from solid backgrounds (college, MNC, public establish figure in business(not clergy)) and you can account for your time.... there is no need to double check everything.

Most recruitment agencies about getting people into jobs ASAP, money back from the employer. If there are no grey areas there is no need to go probing.

I imagine if there is meeting vunerable people or children or dealing with the security forces it should not be a bother. If you could be found out later your employer can dismiss you.

I would say stay quiet.....

I have done it for the private security industry (before the psa) backround checks were done for all sectors of that industry including office staff sales guarding etc we were also asked from time to time do it for factories for there operatives.

Dave!

OP I'd probably conceal it in this case.

Once you start looking for real jobs you might have to consider whether being dishonest will come back to bite you; if you can't get the conviction expunged, then you might be better off just owning it and saying "yes, this happened when I was younger", and giving some sort of spiel. It probably depends on your field, but e.g. I've had a few interviews the last few weeks for software development jobs, and the process is so personality and instinct-based (for the hiring manager) that I couldn't imagine that my having an old conviction from years ago would be given much weight, assuming they like me in general and I have the skills/experience they're after (this might not apply to bigger or multi-national organisations though, who might have bullsh*tty HR guidelines and red tape that they have to comply with).

However for some Micky Mouse part-time job, where the worst thing that is likely to happen if they find out you lied is they won't give you the job, I'd say feck it, take the chance. It's pretty unlikely they'd give you the job if you mention it – hiring for these jobs would be based on more superficial stuff than a real job, and they'll probably have tonnes more applicants, so sadly they'd probably filter you out quick enough.

seamus

Only certain types of employers and bodies are permitted to perform Garda vetting checks, your typical employer on the street does not have access to that service. Presuming the job isn't one where you work with vulnerable people (children, the elderly, mentally disabled or homeless), then I see no good coming of telling the employer.

In theory, the courts are a matter of public record, but you would have to go to quite a bit of trouble to find someone there and be sure it's them.

People can moralise about honesty all they like, but unless your conviction is relevant to the work you're doing, then I don't see it being information that the employer should be told. Assault? Maybe a problem if you're applying to be a bouncer or a steward. Not if you're going to be working on a cash register.

In any case, what's the worst that can happen? They find out in six months' time and they fire you. Big deal. In reality if you've been there six months and are a good solid worker, then finding out you have a criminal conviction might surprise them, but they won't use it as a reason to fire you.

I agree with what Dave! says - when you get into the workplace proper it's a good idea to own it and use it to prove that you've matured since then. But for the kind of part-time college jobs where you fill out an application form and your conviction is going to get your application binned, then just don't include it.

If it's really eating at you, then don't tick the box either way. They'll assume you forgot to tick it and your application will go through.

tenifan

Hi Op. Doesn't sound like a personal issue as much as you're asking should you lie to improve your chances of getting a job.
My answer: it depends on whether you'll get caught. Try to find out if the company does background checks (work and jobs, work problems might be a good forum; alternatively glassdoor.com can advise on the recruitment process)

Stupid mistakes have serious consequences. That is a fact of life. Suck it up and take the hit.

A man who's open about having a conviction & explains what happened is every bit as employable as a guy with a clean sheet.

If you keep shtum and it gets out you lied, the question then becomes "what else has he lied about?"

You are not that guy. Suck it up & say it. Who knows? Your future boss could have been in a similar boat once.

skooterblue2

Deleted User wrote: »

A man who's open about having a conviction & explains what happened is every bit as employable as a guy with a clean sheet.

If you keep shtum and it gets out you lied, the question then becomes "what else has he lied about?"

A man with no conviction has serious advantages over a guy with a conviction. An employer isnt interested in hearing your side of the story. If you can prove yourself for a few years and get a good sales book behind yourself and it gets found out later.... I think no one will really care. If it is found out an interview stage you will get dismissed instantly.

I know what I said wasn't fair or politically correct but that is really how the world works. I know this first hand from dealing with an employer. A problem that I declared and was honest about ..... my contract didn't get renewed.... that is life

Stupid mistakes have serious consequences.

Having a criminal record is a stupid mistake.

Lying about it is a stupid mistake.

Just like not wearing your seatbelt, you might get away with it. Or you might get catapulted out of your car and lose your life instead of breaking a few bones.

Stupid mistakes have serious consequences. That is how the world works.

OP, I think only you can decide whether it's worth the risk. I would employ someone who was upfront about this kind of thing. I would not employ a liar, or someone who would throw out an application because of a "yes" tick on criminal records without asking about it.

In my mind, the person judging without asking is actually in the same boat as the person lying about having a record. If one wants to scam a job out of the other, they both deserve each other. So, in a wierd way, if you think the person looking at the CV will bin it when he sees the crim record, I'd be saying go ahead and lie. Just remind me never to do business with your company, because I'd respect neither of ye.

But I know you'll say it, and you'll be considered trustworthy for going so.

Mr. Incognito

Magicmatilda wrote: »

AFAIK and check this - depending on the sentance it is possible to get your conviction expunged after a certain period of time. This does not apply to specific types of convictions, like sex offences I believe. Worth checking out as this is something that will come up for you again and again.

It is unlikely that they will check, however in the future for more serious roles they may do.

In this instance I would take my chances.

In Ireland a criminal conviction is for life. There is no expunsion.

It has consequences for travel, public service jobs and working in any role where a vetting is required. You will never be able to work as a solicitor or barrister either.

I would advise you to disclose and explain it when asked and dont volunteer it otherwise.

Its a harsh tag

huwants2no

As someone already said I reckon if you come clean you'll likely not be offered the job. Probably thanks you for being honest and tell you they'll keep you on file!
My advice is don't mention it, if you get the job then at some point down the road when you've got to know your employer and more importantly they now know you,then if you really wanted to you could bring it up. Least that way they would know your not a Saturday nite brawler and it was just an unfortunate incident!!
Hope it works out for you

Holsten

Tell them = no job.

Keep quiet = job.

Pretty simply really.

LegacyUser

Mr. Incognito wrote: »

............................ You will never be able to work as a solicitor or barrister either.

........................................................

This is incorrect. See here http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056767351 for more accurate information/interesting discussion

TimeToShine

Tell them - no job.

Don't tell them - get the job - unless they do a background check - at which point you'll be back to having no job.

Nothing to lose really. Good luck and don't beat yourself up about it.

Mr. Incognito

IH82tell wrote: »

This is incorrect. See here http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056767351 for more accurate information/interesting discussion

This thread quotes a bill that is not yet law. A bill is merely proposed legislation. It has no effect until passed by the oireachtas, senad and signed into law by the president. None of these things have happened.

I work as a solicitor and full garda vetting was required for Blackhall.

I presume barristers are the same.

You are quite wrong. As the law stands there is no expunsion.

If you want a fuller picture

http://www.lawreform.ie/_fileupload/Reports/Report%20Spent%20Convictions.pdf

The law reform commission did an excellent analysis a few years ago