Becoming a Ryanair pilot

pepe the prawn

Anyone tell me what's involved? I'm currently getting my ppl, considering going down the integrated ATPL route afterwards.. From what I've heard, Ryanair are regularly hiring new first officers..

Anyone know what cost is involved once I've got a frozen ATPL? ie type rating etc..

Also, what are Ryanair like to work for as a pilot? I haven't a whole pile of interest in being based in Europe, but England/ireland wouldn't be a problem..

Thanks in advance for any advice ye can lend

Preset No.3

Depends on how much you want to fly and how willing you are to sell your soul. Expect to move bases 4-5 times in 2 years. Expect to be tired all the time. Expect to earn less than the people cleaning the aircraft. Expect to be treat like a piece of sh1t!!!!

Welcome to the flying club!!!

pepe the prawn

Preset No.3 wrote: »

Depends on how much you want to fly and how willing you are to sell your soul. Expect to move bases 4-5 times in 2 years. Expect to be tired all the time. Expect to earn less than the people cleaning the aircraft. Expect to be treat like a piece of sh1t!!!!

Welcome to the flying club!!!

I see, doesn't sound promising!

What are the job prospects like with aer Lingus? Do they hire frozen atpls?

folbotcar

Preset exaggerates a bit. But you can be based anywhere in Europe and when promoted to Captain moved again. The cost of a type rating was around 30k at one point. But having the money won't guarantee a job. They're pretty strict about pilots.

The pay gets better with time.

Aer Lingus they do hire new pilots but they apply exactly the same standards as they do to their cadetships. They seem to prefer certain integrated schools too.

As for being tired, par for the course with pilots. After the last flight of the day the energy seems to drain out of you but you still have to drive home plus you have to get up and do it all again tomorrow.

BTW if you only fancy working in the UK and Ireland you will limit your chances.

CharlieOscar

From someone who once was so close to going down the route you are about to embark on, just consider the follow:

You want to fly for a living - Yes
What aircraft do you want to fly - ?
Why do you want to fly that aircraft - ?
Which airline flies those aircraft - ?
Am I willing to accept a small salary for the first few year in order to answer the above questions with ??? as the answer

Next, where does the airline fly from/to, or where are their bases? If it is not in Ireland / England am I prepared to live in those countries to follow my desire to be a commercial pilot, be it a bush pilot to an airline pilot.

Next, what were my other career paths before flying. Would they make me happy and is the salary comparable, and what are the benefits of pursuing my other career goals over my flying career goals.

Then ask yourself, what will make you happy, flying where ever it may be in the world, flying the aircraft you want, pursuing the dreams of commercial flying that you want and accepting the salary that the airline offers (whether it be good, bad or indifferent).

Most of all, be happy with the decision you do make.

ProfessorPlum

^^^a word of caution. If the answer to 'what aircraft type do you want to fly' is very important to you (as distinct from'what kind of flying do you want to do'), spending a lot of money to go down the ATPL route is probably not going to make you happy. Very few pilots have the luxury of really choosing what airline/s they end up working for, never mind be type they fly, and most willfly many types over their career. At the end of the day, a jet is a jet, a prop is a prop - personally I'm far more interested in the other stuff that goes along with it - rosters, bases, t&c's, work life balance etc.
Many people start of their careers thinking they'll be happy to sacrifice almost anything for their 'dream career'. At the end of the day though, it's a job. Do you want to live to work, or work to live?

Locker10a

pepe the prawn wrote: »

I see, doesn't sound promising!

What are the job prospects like with aer Lingus? Do they hire frozen atpls?

Another thing about becoming an airline pilot is you may train, get your type rating and have paid all your money ( you will be in THOUSANDS of debt trust me) and after it all you may not even get a job as a pilot! Only a lucky and select few actually end up working as pilots straight away after training, many spend YEARS working other jobs before being hired by an airline! I have lost count of the number of cabin crew and even aircraft cleaners i know and have worked with who are pilots looking for jobs! There is nothing wrong with being cabin crew, or being a cleaner or any job in between its just after you pay so much to be a pilot and then end up doing a job you could do anyway would be very frustrating ! And many end up in that position

keith16

Locker10a wrote: »

There is nothing wrong with being cabin crew, or being a cleaner or any job in between its just after you pay so much to be a pilot and then end up doing a job you could do anyway would be very frustrating ! And many end up in that position

That does sound frustrating. But it is worth considering how much the OP loves flying. It may be just another job, and it is, but it might be something the OP loves to do.

And even if you do end up in massive debt, and keeps flying in his local club or whatever as a hobby, is that necessarily a bad thing? Particularly if you don't have a mortgage / kids?

Locker10a

keith16 wrote: »

That does sound frustrating. But it is worth considering how much the OP loves flying. It may be just another job, and it is, but it might be something the OP loves to do.

And even if you do end up in massive debt, and keeps flying in his local club or whatever as a hobby, is that necessarily a bad thing? Particularly if you don't have a mortgage / kids?

Yes sure but im just informing the OP that going down the road of becoming an AIRLINE pilot can have a monumental affect on the outcome of your life! And i dont mean that to sound dramatic, we all make decisions that change where we go in life but becoming a pilot can be a high risk and you have to be willing to spend a lot of time away from home, and be willing to move about allot in your life! If you are happy to do this fantastic!! I know allot of pilots, i know guys and girls who live in hotels, and commute home on their days off, they miss things like their kids going to school and family events, but had no choice but to move for their command, and they are the ones who have developed relationships many dont if they move around allot!

But it is an amazing job and if you love flying then what better job to do! The airline industry is cut throat, airlines are constantly looking for ways to pay staff less and work them more, but if you are will to accept the challenges and for you the pros, outweigh the cons, then go for it!! If its your passion and you are paid to do it then it will be worth it!

donkey balls

I have two friends who completed their training right up to MCC and both have yet to get an interview never mind a job flying,A mate of mine who is with FR has had two bases since starting with them except for his line training.
Like most jobs the first few years seem great after that you probably get a pain in the arse getting up at mad o clock in the morning for the early departures.

pepe the prawn

Thanks for the replies and opinions everyone. I asked about Ryanair because I'm aware that they hire regularly, and I know the salaries aren't great to begin with but I've read on pprune that captains with a few years experience are earning €120k plus a year, that's a wait that I'd be prepared to endure to earn a salary such as that. On the flip side, I'm not in a position to up sticks and move to the arsehole of Italy or Lithuania for two or three years, Ireland or UK would be the only bases I'd be interested in, so I guess that rules out Ryanair for me because from what I've read on forums online you're at their mercy when it comes to base selection, and you could be years waiting to be posted to you base of preference.

As for aer Lingus, that'd be a dream come through but I'd imagine it's next to impossible to get in there.

Ive no problem spending €60-80k on training as long as I knew I'd make it back over a few years..

So, to surmise, I'm still unsure what to do.. I'm hesitant to take te advice of a training school because obviously they have their own interests at heart and so would say that yes your dream job is waiting around the corner and so on..

I would love to fly as a career, but I also want a good to reasonable work/life balance, be able to see my missus and my family and still have a bit of a life...

Decisions decisions lol..

Locker10a

pepe the prawn wrote: »

Thanks for the replies and opinions everyone. I asked about Ryanair because I'm aware that they hire regularly, and I know the salaries aren't great to begin with but I've read on pprune that captains with a few years experience are earning €120k plus a year, that's a wait that I'd be prepared to endure to earn a salary such as that. On the flip side, I'm not in a position to up sticks and move to the arsehole of Italy or Lithuania for two or three years, Ireland or UK would be the only bases I'd be interested in, so I guess that rules out Ryanair for me because from what I've read on forums online you're at their mercy when it comes to base selection, and you could be years waiting to be posted to you base of preference.

As for aer Lingus, that'd be a dream come through but I'd imagine it's next to impossible to get in there.

Ive no problem spending €60-80k on training as long as I knew I'd make it back over a few years..

So, to surmise, I'm still unsure what to do.. I'm hesitant to take te advice of a training school because obviously they have their own interests at heart and so would say that yes your dream job is waiting around the corner and so on..

I would love to fly as a career, but I also want a good to reasonable work/life balance, be able to see my missus and my family and still have a bit of a life...

Decisions decisions lol..

Yes its a personal decision , only you can decide really but think long and hard! Most UK/irish airlines pay 120k+ to their captains, yes the money is fantastic, and you are flying which is your passion, what could be better? Just remember you will probably work untill you are 65, and untill you are 65 you will be working Christmas, birthdays, family weddings and more than likely setting your alarm at 3am on earlies!! Despite this I would still consider it one of the best jobs in the world! Purely because i love aviation! But if I didn't have a passion for flying it would be like one of the worst jobs! Who wants to spend a career getting up at 3am and working away from home all the time? If you get into Aer Lingus or Aer Lingus regional, you have a good chance of eventually transferring to Cork, but if you want to maximize your chances of doing this career which can be an amazing one, you have to be willing to relocate possibly for a number of years! I know a captain who had to transfer from her base for her command, she now faces a 3 year waiting list to get back home all the while living in a hotel skyping her family and travelling home on days off, thats tough but they money is great and if its what you love doing then you accept it!

Bazzy

donkey balls wrote: »

I have two friends who completed their training right up to MCC and both have yet to get an interview never mind a job flying,A mate of mine who is with FR has had two bases since starting with them except for his line training.
Like most jobs the first few years seem great after that you probably get a pain in the arse getting up at mad o clock in the morning for the early departures.

i've never seen a CAPT or a FO not smile when walking towards an aircraft and I have done my fair share of early departures.

eatmyshorts

Locker10a wrote: »

Who wants to spend a career getting up at 3am

3am? Sure that's a lie-in! Try getting up at half past midnight to do a 15 hour duty day to some godforsaken kip in the middle if Africa.

Preset No.3

pepe the prawn wrote: »

On the flip side, I'm not in a position to up sticks and move to the arsehole of Italy or Lithuania for two or three years, Ireland or UK would be the only bases I'd be interested in,

Well its looks like you dont really want flying for a career. Anybody that really wants something will do whatever it takes, no matter what. So do yourself a favour, grow up a bit and come back to us in 5 years when the reality of adult life is upon you.

pepe the prawn

Preset No.3 wrote: »

Well its looks like you dont really want flying for a career. Anybody that really wants something will do whatever it takes, no matter what. So do yourself a favour, grow up a bit and come back to us in 5 years when the reality of adult life is upon you.

Lol. Who pissed in your cornflakes this morning dickhead.

I've done plenty of "doing whatever it takes" for enough years now already. I came on here looking for opinions and advice from people who may have been in my position before. I got some good advice and insight, which I will partly use to make a final decision. I have commitments in Ireland that would negate against me moving to some ****hole in Europe that's 100 miles from nowhere, and to add to it, I just don't want to live In a dump waiting for the clock to roll by a few years until the time comes that I "might" be based closer to home.

The reality of adult life hit me a long time ago pal, so take your presumptuous and incorrect view and shove it..

lord lucan

Preset No.3 wrote: »

So do yourself a favour, grow up a bit and come back to us in 5 years when the reality of adult life is upon you.

That was unnecessary, the OP asked an honest question, no need to get personal.

lord lucan

pepe the prawn wrote: »

Lol. Who pissed in your cornflakes this morning dickhead.

Less of the personal abuse and name calling, have a read of the forum charter before posting again.

pepe the prawn

lord lucan wrote: »

Less of the personal abuse and name calling, have a read of the forum charter before posting again.

My apologies.

A319er

Don't rule out

BFS based, jet2 and TCX have ROI staff inc pilots who are Dublin based ,

folbotcar

Some of the comments here might seem a bit harsh but they do reflect the reality of the situation. Only the lucky few get to pick and chose, who to fly for or where to fly. The rest of us have to work hard to even get a flying job that pays money, never mind good money.

After a bit of persistence you can get what you want mainly by being in the right place at the right time.

You can of course decide for yourself what you will or won't accept. That's fine. Just as long as you know that you are closing doors on potential opportunities.

Like any job it becomes a job even if you love flying and aeroplanes. I stepped back a bit from my job because the work life balance went completely in the wrong direction. But the reality for many pilots is that the job is hell on family life even if you have one of the good jobs. I could move on and commit myself to furthering my career but I made a conscious decision not to. I was in a fortunate position to do just that and suit myself. But it's not something many pilots can do.

I personally have known low time pilots who were turned down opportunities because it was in another part of Ireland and didn't pay well or it was the wrong sort of aeroplane. Ignoring the fact that after a few months in the job they would have enough experience to move on to better things. On the other hand I knew another pilot who took the opportunity and then carelessly told the chief pilot that he intended doing just that!

i've never seen a CAPT or a FO not smile when walking towards an aircraft and I have done my fair share of early departures.

Smiling through the pain. LOL I invariably smile too in my flying job, when I'd rather be elsewhere most of the time. I try to remind myself how lucky I am to be up here looking down when all those people down there wish they were up here. I never thought I would end up like that.

On the other hand I don't look up at planes in the sky and wish I was up there anymore. Unless it's a Spitfire!

So it's all a compromise of one sort or other but in all honest you cannot say I want to be a pilot but I won't leave Ireland and I won't fly in certain companies or fly certain types of aircraft. There's a good chance you won't fly at all. You may have to do it for a time until the opportunity comes up. I know of a pilot who flies for Cathay Pacific out of London who lives in the Irish midlands. He has the work life balance worked out but he does have to go away for weeks sometimes. It's the nature of the business.

pepe the prawn

folbotcar wrote: »

Some of the comments here might seem a bit harsh but they do reflect the reality of the situation. Only the lucky few get to pick and chose, who to fly for or where to fly. The rest of us have to work hard to even get a flying job that pays money, never mind good money.

After a bit of persistence you can get what you want mainly by being in the right place at the right time.

You can of course decide for yourself what you will or won't accept. That's fine. Just as long as you know that you are closing doors on potential opportunities.

Like any job it becomes a job even if you love flying and aeroplanes. I stepped back a bit from my job because the work life balance went completely in the wrong direction. But the reality for many pilots is that the job is hell on family life even if you have one of the good jobs. I could move on and commit myself to furthering my career but I made a conscious decision not to. I was in a fortunate position to do just that and suit myself. But it's not something many pilots can do.

I personally have known low time pilots who were turned down opportunities because it was in another part of Ireland and didn't pay well or it was the wrong sort of aeroplane. Ignoring the fact that after a few months in the job they would have enough experience to move on to better things. On the other hand I knew another pilot who took the opportunity and then carelessly told the chief pilot that he intended doing just that!

Smiling through the pain. LOL I invariably smile too in my flying job, when I'd rather be elsewhere most of the time. I try to remind myself how lucky I am to be up here looking down when all those people down there wish they were up here. I never thought I would end up like that.

On the other hand I don't look up at planes in the sky and wish I was up there anymore. Unless it's a Spitfire!

So it's all a compromise of one sort or other but in all honest you cannot say I want to be a pilot but I won't leave Ireland and I won't fly in certain companies or fly certain types of aircraft. There's a good chance you won't fly at all. You may have to do it for a time until the opportunity comes up. I know of a pilot who flies for Cathay Pacific out of London who lives in the Irish midlands. He has the work life balance worked out but he does have to go away for weeks sometimes. It's the nature of the business.

Thanks lad, that's just the kind of info I was lo

pepe the prawn

folbotcar wrote: »

Some of the comments here might seem a bit harsh but they do reflect the reality of the situation. Only the lucky few get to pick and chose, who to fly for or where to fly. The rest of us have to work hard to even get a flying job that pays money, never mind good money.

After a bit of persistence you can get what you want mainly by being in the right place at the right time.

You can of course decide for yourself what you will or won't accept. That's fine. Just as long as you know that you are closing doors on potential opportunities.

Like any job it becomes a job even if you love flying and aeroplanes. I stepped back a bit from my job because the work life balance went completely in the wrong direction. But the reality for many pilots is that the job is hell on family life even if you have one of the good jobs. I could move on and commit myself to furthering my career but I made a conscious decision not to. I was in a fortunate position to do just that and suit myself. But it's not something many pilots can do.

I personally have known low time pilots who were turned down opportunities because it was in another part of Ireland and didn't pay well or it was the wrong sort of aeroplane. Ignoring the fact that after a few months in the job they would have enough experience to move on to better things. On the other hand I knew another pilot who took the opportunity and then carelessly told the chief pilot that he intended doing just that!

Smiling through the pain. LOL I invariably smile too in my flying job, when I'd rather be elsewhere most of the time. I try to remind myself how lucky I am to be up here looking down when all those people down there wish they were up here. I never thought I would end up like that.

On the other hand I don't look up at planes in the sky and wish I was up there anymore. Unless it's a Spitfire!

So it's all a compromise of one sort or other but in all honest you cannot say I want to be a pilot but I won't leave Ireland and I won't fly in certain companies or fly certain types of aircraft. There's a good chance you won't fly at all. You may have to do it for a time until the opportunity comes up. I know of a pilot who flies for Cathay Pacific out of London who lives in the Irish midlands. He has the work life balance worked out but he does have to go away for weeks sometimes. It's the nature of the business.

Thanks lad, that's just the type of info I was looking for

John_Mc

I looked into this seriously and was going to go for it, but having really considered decided not to as I was doing well in my job at the time. My solution is to get my own private aircraft :-)

You'd have to question the current situation where people with ambitions to be a pilot, where it's all about making the right decisions at the right time, have to roll the dice with 100k+ and see if they are one of the lucky ones that gets a job.

martinsvi

I think Airline pilot job requires a person to be dedicated, motivated, in a way - adventurous, you have to love working with people, you have to love the world. The fact that you call certain parts of Europe "a***holes" makes me wonder how will you ever cope with destinations you don't fancy, or colleagues from different cultures and so on... I can't imagine a scenario where you go to an interview, tell them what you think of some parts of Europe and that they will ever phone you back, no matter which airline interviews you, this attitude will not sit well with anyone.

TheBoss11

Hi guys. I too have aspirations of becoming a pilot and have a few hours under my belt. Few hours in a 320 sim too and love flying. I just left school recently and all I want to do is fly. I couldn't care If I'm based in the amazon flying pipers for the rest of my life. I'm just wondering what are the best schools to get employment from? Preferably I want to work in an airline, type of aircraft does not matter.

Zyox

TheBoss11 wrote: »

Hi guys. I too have aspirations of becoming a pilot and have a few hours under my belt. Few hours in a 320 sim too and love flying. I just left school recently and all I want to do is fly. I couldn't care If I'm based in the amazon flying pipers for the rest of my life. I'm just wondering what are the best schools to get employment from? Preferably I want to work in an airline, type of aircraft does not matter.

3 things you can get from a school. But you're only allowed pick two.
- High quality training
- Get done fast
- Cheap

After that it doesn't matter much where you get it done. Every school on the planet will tell you they are better than the rest for one or two of the above reasons. The real chancers will say they have all 3 but it's impossible based on my limited experience. The only school that is "the best" to get employment from is one that you're in as part of a sponsored cadetship with a guaranteed job at the end - aka. the holy grail.

Buyer beware.
And that's just the first warning until you get your training out of the way.

Locker10a

TheBoss11 wrote: »

Hi guys. I too have aspirations of becoming a pilot and have a few hours under my belt. Few hours in a 320 sim too and love flying. I just left school recently and all I want to do is fly. I couldn't care If I'm based in the amazon flying pipers for the rest of my life. I'm just wondering what are the best schools to get employment from? Preferably I want to work in an airline, type of aircraft does not matter.

School recommendation-- CTC

airbuspilot

Locker10a wrote: »

School recommendation-- CTC

Why CTC? CTC costs way more than reputable schools such as Atlantic in cork.

TheBoss11

airbuspilot wrote: »

Why CTC? CTC costs way more than reputable schools such as Atlantic in cork.

Would CTC be an advantage for Aer Lingus? If it's any airline I'd love to work for it's Aer Lingus.

ek9er

Just to add if Ryanair is what your thinking, the actual salary at the moment for a new captain is about 55k gross plus flight pay(every base is slightly different) So expect about 4-4.5k Euro for the busiest months. A little bit less than most first officers, but only due to the fronted "self employed" Setup, and guys homes are being raided by tax authorities because of tax and prsi issues that have evolved from this!

Its far from the 120k plus you have mentioned. Next year it will be less and the year after and so on! And being based in the UK and Ireland? Well that's very unlikely indeed given that there is about 60 bases or "stations" aka non tax compliant unofficial bases.

eatmyshorts

ek9er wrote: »

Just to add if Ryanair is what your thinking, the actual salary at the moment for a new captain is about 55k gross plus flight pay(every base is slightly different) So expect about 4-4.5k Euro for the busiest months. A little bit less than most first officers, but only due to the fronted "self employed" Setup, and guys homes are being raided by tax authorities because of tax and prsi issues that have evolved from this!

Its far from the 120k plus you have mentioned. Next year it will be less and the year after and so on! And being based in the UK and Ireland? Well that's very unlikely indeed given that there is about 60 bases or "stations" aka non tax compliant unofficial bases.

The whole self employed front company setup is a disgrace.

folbotcar

TheBoss11 wrote: »

Hi guys. I too have aspirations of becoming a pilot and have a few hours under my belt. Few hours in a 320 sim too and love flying. I just left school recently and all I want to do is fly. I couldn't care If I'm based in the amazon flying pipers for the rest of my life. I'm just wondering what are the best schools to get employment from? Preferably I want to work in an airline, type of aircraft does not matter.

There are no schools that are best to get employment from. But some airlines prefer certain schools but ultimately it doesn't matter much. No school will get you a job and while they all proudly boast their graduates work for Aer Lingus, BA, NASA etc. That means nothing because of course if you train to be a pilot you're not going to end up as Michelin star chef. So ignore all hype.

If you have plenty of money you can go to one of the big name schools and waste your money hoping some of their status rubs off on you.

The overwhelming majority of pilots I know took the modular routes either in Ireland or the US and most of them got a flying job eventually. Not necessarily an airline job but a job nonetheless.

You say you'd be happy flying Pipers in the Amazon, well good, far too many wannabees don't look beyond the shiny jets and turn up their noses at 'little aeroplanes'. So they stay home, work in a bar and try to keep current with the PC flight sim. Meanwhile their less fussy colleagues are having a whale of a time, stick and rudder flying, working all the hours getting paid next to nothing then moving on to bigger and better things.

I had a connection with an operation that needed a new pilot or pilots every year. It was real flying, not well paid and you were worked hard and treated hard. You'd be amazed how few people bothered to turn up and enquire about flying for them. It was amazing how few people stuck around after being advised that there could be an opening for the right person and how few could fly well enough to get the job. Yet most who did moved onto bigger and better things in less than a year.

There are always jobs like that around. They have to dug out but they're there.

So if you genuinely don't care what you fly as long you're paid. Then there's always a job.

TheBoss11

folbotcar wrote: »

There are no schools that are best to get employment from. But some airlines prefer certain schools but ultimately it doesn't matter much. No school will get you a job and while they all proudly boast their graduates work for Aer Lingus, BA, NASA etc. That means nothing because of course if you train to be a pilot you're not going to end up as Michelin star chef. So ignore all hype.

If you have plenty of money you can go to one of the big name schools and waste your money hoping some of their status rubs off on you.

The overwhelming majority of pilots I know took the modular routes either in Ireland or the US and most of them got a flying job eventually. Not necessarily an airline job but a job nonetheless.

You say you'd be happy flying Pipers in the Amazon, well good, far too many wannabees don't look beyond the shiny jets and turn up their noses at 'little aeroplanes'. So they stay home, work in a bar and try to keep current with the PC flight sim. Meanwhile their less fussy colleagues are having a whale of a time, stick and rudder flying, working all the hours getting paid next to nothing then moving on to bigger and better things.

I had a connection with an operation that needed a new pilot or pilots every year. It was real flying, not well paid and you were worked hard and treated hard. You'd be amazed how few people bothered to turn up and enquire about flying for them. It was amazing how few people stuck around after being advised that there could be an opening for the right person and how few could fly well enough to get the job. Yet most who did moved onto bigger and better things in less than a year.

There are always jobs like that around. They have to dug out but they're there.

So if you genuinely don't care what you fly as long you're paid. Then there's always a job.

Very good information and very inspiring too! Gives me a lot of hope. Thank you very much for your reply!

KnotABother

I'll be honest and say I got bored reading the thread half way through here. However to offer my few shillings to the OP I would say that the first thought to cross my mind was that you sound like ripe prey for one of the big integrated machines.
Forget about training here and flying there and getting loans from banks etc and really take a long hard look at what you are getting into. There are absolutely no shortage of BS artists working for flight schools who will sniff out any little bit of "aviation innocence" in a guy be he 18 or 30 and ride him hard until he has burned through 100k or more with a type rating to come. I will not name names but some of the aviation "academies" out there have aspects of their reputation in tatters. If you chat to those in the know or those inside interview panels or training departments they will tell you some of the product is absolutely dire. Make no mistake, if you have 100k in your pocket and you rock up to these schools you will get a fATPL in exchange but you will not be anything approaching a commercial pilot. They will instead make you a brainwashed jumped up little tosspot full of your own importance.
I had heard all these stories before but it is not until you get a foot in the door you see and hear the first hand accounts.

From somebody who has ploughed the road by hand and has the scars and calloused hands to show for it I would give you these few pieces of advice:

* Look deep into the job market and understand exactly how it works.

* Hand over no money to a flight school until you are 100% happy with what they are saying(if they claim that all their graduates or a high percentage get jobs with airlines then run away!!)

*If you have commitments as you say that will bind you to Ireland/Britain and those binds cannot be broken then training to be a pilot is a non sequitur . Anything that keeps you that restricted will remove the first couple of rungs from the ladder and almost certainly compromise your commitments regardless of base.

*Ensure you have funds available to avoid large gaps between flying when doing your CPL/IR training.

* Do not refer to European cities and ****holes as you will be flying in to them and many of those you will work with are from them...

I recently took the leap in to the grinder and if you are picky or high strung or too good for anything.....it will eat you alive!

folbotcar

If you chat to those in the know or those inside interview panels or training departments they will tell you some of the product is absolutely dire. Make no mistake, if you have 100k in your pocket and you rock up to these schools you will get a fATPL in exchange but you will not be anything approaching a commercial pilot. They will instead make you a brainwashed jumped up little tosspot full of your own importance.

All too true I'm afraid. My favourite is the story of one 'commercial pilot' climbing with stall warner singing away. When this was queried he dismissed it as only a warning. Then he turned to avoid a cloud. The subsequent spin was impressive apparently.

It's remarkable how many bad pilots get through the system. Usually not their fault as they don't know they're badly trained. But they've been robbed by their flight school.

TheBoss11

So what schools do well train their cadets?

Stovepipe

Hi there,
The skill of potential recruits to the right hand seat is usually found out in the sim check and after that, in the type rating. A friend of mine is a TRI/TRE for an Irish airline and he wouldn't have candidates from certain schools if he can possibly avoid them. It isn't all about IR skills or pass rates; if a candidate comes across as an arrogant pillock, especially when it comes to serving/interacting with non-pilots such as cabin crew or techs or redcaps, then he'll ditch that guy in a heartbeat. Sometimes, candidates can pass the ME/IR but can't cope with a TR, because the workload is high or they fail to live up to expectations on the Line. I know of one guy who was chopped after a few months on the Line because he was unmotivated and had to be told to do everything, ie, he hadn't a spontaneous bone in his body and was a drag on the operation. A guy in our airline came within a haircut, literally, of being chopped because he turned into an arrogant slob and was disliked widely, across all trades. He was wheeled in for interview-without-tea-and-biscuits with the Chief and became a very reformed hoor. There's more to it than just ticking off the boxes.

folbotcar

Indeed Stovepipe. I once worked for a company where they had a few pilots in ground jobs who hoped to move onto the flight deck. A bit like Ice Pilots and their 'rampies'.

One guy did everything he could to get flying but he hadn't a chance as everyone from the Chief pilot down didn't like him. He hadn't a hope. The poor SOB.

I think the buzz words are 'soft skills' that sometimes difficult to define set of abilities that are hard to quantify but you often know it when you see it in someone.

Some guys just have it, others just don't get it at all. I've seen people turn up at a small operations completely unaware that they're effectively being interviewed the moment they walk in the door.

Others as Stovepipe point out don't seem to realise that even after they get the job offer they are still effectively being scrutinised for some time afterward.

Tenger

TheBoss11 wrote: »

Would CTC be an advantage for Aer Lingus? If it's any airline I'd love to work for it's Aer Lingus.

No. EI hire direct entry from all over and they have their own cadetship scheme now in its 2nd year. (3rd year should be recruiting soon?)

Jack1985

Should be advised with a point of caution to, although companies will claim to give ''equal opportunity'' some do frown upon certain schools as well as modular over integrated (being ideal) potential applicants.

Tenger

folbotcar wrote: »

Some of the comments here might seem a bit harsh but they do reflect the reality of the situation. Only the lucky few get to pick and chose, who to fly for or where to fly. The rest of us have to work hard to even get a flying job that pays money, never mind good money.

I'm going to quote this point. (Not meaning to ignore other vauable posts)
There have been multiple really helpful posts in this thread. Lord Lucan already issued a warning on page 2.
So this is not a warning but a reminder that the honest upfront advice of people who have been through the 'grinder' is worth reading/listening to. To be a pilot requires dedication and quite often personal sacrifices.
Please don't take offense if anyone tells you to "focus on the goal" or ignore "personal restrictions". This is actually spot on advice. No-one can give you a magic pill to be an airline pilot. Perhaps 1% of pilots get a golden ticket. Everyone else has had to work for it, either self funded, cadetship, modular or integrated...its all hard work.

pepe the prawn

Is there really a preference over integrated than modular?

pepe the prawn

pepe the prawn wrote: »

Is there really a preference over integrated than modular?

Bump

donkey balls

My mate did his modular training along with the rest of the lads on his TR course, I know about 3 FR captains who also went the modular route.
I also bumped into a few who went down the integrated route working for FR, As stovepipe mentioned earlier it's one thing passing the MEIR and getting the job.
But you cannot just sit back and relax thinking that is it I'm in the door, You really need to stay focused on the job and not just while doing the TR.

pepe the prawn

donkey balls wrote: »

My mate did his modular training along with the rest of the lads on his TR course, I know about 3 FR captains who also went the modular route.
I also bumped into a few who went down the integrated route working for FR, As stovepipe mentioned earlier it's one thing passing the MEIR and getting the job.
But you cannot just sit back and relax thinking that is it I'm in the door, You really need to stay focused on the job and not just while doing the TR.

Thanks for that. I realise the commitment needed alright, and that there is a lot of hard work after getting the fATPL. I don't mind that side of it, just as long as there is some chance of getting a job at some stage down the line. I also realise the cost involved with keeping the ratings current while waiting to land a job..

What worries me is the talk that Ryanair aren't hiring irish pilots anymore, any truth in this? Because for someone with a frozen ATPL and only 2-300 hours I understand they are potentially the only airline employer option?

donkey balls

I have two mates who applied to FR and never heard a thing back, And while working at the airport I never came across any Irish cadets but plenty of UK & European ones.