Too many repeats

Deepsouthwest

V disappointed with repeats here in the last few wks, around 20(out of 140)cows seen bulling in the last 3 wks, some repeat cyclers, but more worryingly in the last wk a lot of cows turning up after being AI'd 8-10 wks ago. Fertility is normally v good here, and all cows have got the 'all sure' bolus which has worked well over the yrs. Just wondering if there's anything I can do to find the cause of this, any point in getting a vet to do bloods? Almost afraid to go for cows at this stage at the rate they're turning up

onyerbikepat

No harm get the Vet. Could be outbreak of BVD or Lepto.
Have you changed anthing with the AI, timing or operator etc?

Greengrass1

I don't think you alone.
AI man telling me there is alot if repeats thus yr.
I have 16 cows that will calve next April and only had 1 last yr

Timmaay

Same here, it's a pain in the arse.

Kovu

AI man said same to me yesterday. Cows that calved later (Late March/April/May) being got a lot easier than ones that calved earlier, those seem to be breaking at strange times.

Sami23

Would running a one year old 'squeezed' weanling with my cows help with heat detection as I don't have a bull and am finding it very hard to catch them bulling ?

holestin cowboy24

scanned 31 heifers this afternoon, 4 empties, raging aver this usually only 1 or 2 empty

ted_182

Sami23 wrote: »

Would running a one year old 'squeezed' weanling with my cows help with heat detection as I don't have a bull and am finding it very hard to catch them bulling ?

Well worth a try, we have three or four yearling bullocks running with our maidens this year and it worked very well

sandydan

had something similar a few years ago,was feeding hi phos mins and bucket min vet recommended feeding 1oz monosodium phosphate /day. blended 25 gk to 2 dairy nuts and adding iodine to water trough. used mineral dispenser, pain in arse so poured rest twice daily onto sides of concrete trough and in evenings , gave them selenium and copper bolus and got bull.
BTW a fela said recently 1 bull to 20 cows is enough, he had 1 to 25, he also reconed Dry Cow bucket minerals were better than spec min buckets, just his opinion,

trixi2011

sandydan wrote: »

had something similar a few years ago,was feeding hi phos mins and bucket min vet recommended feeding 1oz monosodium phosphate /day. blended 25 gk to 2 dairy nuts and adding iodine to water trough. used mineral dispenser, pain in arse so poured rest twice daily onto sides of concrete trough and in evenings , gave them selenium and copper bolus and got bull.
BTW a fela said recently 1 bull to 20 cows is enough, he had 1 to 25, he also reconed Dry Cow bucket minerals were better than spec min buckets, just his opinion,

1 bull to every 30 cows not in calf. So if assume 70% held to ai you only need one bull per 100 cows but extra bull power is needed so you can rotate them. Mineral buckets are a waste of time full of molasses better off with bolus or in the water

awaywithyou

Deepsouthwest wrote: »

V disappointed with repeats here in the last few wks, around 20(out of 140)cows seen bulling in the last 3 wks, some repeat cyclers, but more worryingly in the last wk a lot of cows turning up after being AI'd 8-10 wks ago. Fertility is normally v good here, and all cows have got the 'all sure' bolus which has worked well over the yrs. Just wondering if there's anything I can do to find the cause of this, any point in getting a vet to do bloods? Almost afraid to go for cows at this stage at the rate they're turning up

You vaccinating for bvd, lepto and ibr and so on

Tyson Lannister

I have the same problem with repeats this year (suckler cows). No prob with heat detection as I have autumn born bull calves in with them and there'd be 3/4 calves following a cow in heat.
Never had this problem before though, and they're in great condition on the best of grass.
I never give any minerals or anything though, all the get is pre Calver 8 weeks before calving.
I wonder what makes this year so different

tismesoitis

had exactly the same problem this year vet took bloods and showed up low iodine and copper despite getting 8mls copper per hd about 5 wks before breeding season started

awaywithyou

tismesoitis wrote: »

had exactly the same problem this year vet took bloods and showed up low iodine and copper despite getting 8mls copper per hd about 5 wks before breeding season started

Do cows retain copper? Or does it have to be supplied everyday?

greysides

Copper is stored in the liver for a while.

Tyson Lannister

I should've gotten blood tests before the dates all slipped back

blue5000

Any chance it could schellenberg (spelling:o) virus. I think it wasw in the souheast last year.






(Schmallenberg )

greysides

blue5000 wrote: »

Any chance it could schellenberg (spelling:o) virus. I think it wasw in the souheast last year.

Would be on my list for testing.

We've had a dry year. AFAIK, it requires rain to leach minerals out of rock, stone, pebbles, grains to make it available to plants and therefore animals..... I would look into trace elements too.

jaymla627

greysides wrote: »

Would be on my list for testing.

We've had a dry year. AFAIK, it requires rain to leach minerals out of rock, stone, pebbles, grains to make it available to plants and therefore animals..... I would look into trace elements too.

Re schelemberg have had two high positives in bulk screen tests along with repeats and more repeats, vet had stated that test for schelemberg cant differiniate between a animal that has been exposed to it and has derived a immunity to it and a animal that has been infected with it recentaly thus screwing your fertility for the year....drove up the wall at the min bloods where sent of 2 weeks ago still no answers and have had 5 heifers repeat the last week that where six weeks plus incalf our so i thought the major sickener was kamaras had been on them for the six weeks and never went off till last week, dreading scanning next month along with what could be in-store for us next spring if schelemberg is the cause

greysides

I would look back over your previous milk tests. If they were low and are now high..............

jaymla627

greysides wrote: »

I would look back over your previous milk tests. If they were low and are now high..............

Only started bulk screen testing this year, so am in the dark...was a new entrant last year wirh stock bought from various places major alarm bell is 10 cows bought from cork that seem to have held perfect(probably exposed to schelmberg) while the rest of the cows are repeating like mad along with the heifers

greysides

Not to be annoying but their immunity could be to things other than Schmallenberg..... Lepto for example.

They wouldn't have (on the balance of probability) brought Schmallenberg with them but they could carry lepto in their kidneys.

If you bought in older cows I presume they are BVD free, either tested themselves or through this years calf.

jaymla627

greysides wrote: »

Not to be annoying but their immunity could be to things other than Schmallenberg..... Lepto for example.

They wouldn't have (on the balance of probability) brought Schmallenberg with them but they could carry lepto in their kidneys.

Vaccinating for lepto, not implicating the cows brought schmallenberg, my reckoning is they where exposed to it as maidens thus have immunity which is why they have held to ai/bull while the remainder of the cows where naieve and only got exposed to schmallenberg this year hence my fertility problems the lack of answers from the tests is worrying us

greysides

That's plausible. Roughly, what part of the country are you in?

jaymla627

greysides wrote: »

That's plausible. Roughly, what part of the country are you in?

In the midlands up in laois, no known cases in our area over the past two years according to vet

greysides

That would make it certainly plausible.

blue5000

Is there a map online anywhere to show how far it has spread?

onyerbikepat

Schmallenberg Virus - Irish Map
Page 4 & 5 of this;
http://www.agriculture.gov.ie/media/migration/animalhealthwelfare/diseasecontrols/schmallenbergvirus/Schmallenbergvirussummary17Jan13.pdf

greysides

That map is obviously out of date but AFAIK, the spread last year wasn't dramatic.

tanko

greysides wrote: »

That map is obviously out of date but AFAIK, the spread last year wasn't dramatic.

Is there less cases this year than last year?

greysides

That may depend on location. Thankfully I didn't see any this year though I heard of two.

Deepsouthwest

awaywithyou wrote: »

You vaccinating for bvd, lepto and ibr and so on

Vaccinating for bvd, salmonella and ibr, not lepto. Checked with a Munster herd health vet and my milk tests are showing v low levels of lepto, so that's unlikely a prob. Everything else tested for in the milk seemed normal too. Munster vet also felt there wasn't much point in taking any blood samples, only recommended fertility testing the stock bulls, which I think is pointless as most of the cows that turned up the last few wks were cows that were AI'd over 8 wks ago and just turned up now

sandydan

awaywithyou wrote: »

Do cows retain copper? Or does it have to be supplied everyday?

thats why vet told me to supplement with monosodium phos-even though i was feeding hi-phos minerals etc, he argued that copper deficiency is some times caused by phos deficiency and iodine is involved in mix,so if iodine is low ,phos goes down and copper follows in that order, then selenium is affected ,some link that to cell count and nervous problems in parlour as well as white dung in milk fed calves, i know some one who had this problem in suckler herd for 2 years and in year 3 had load of repeats until dosing with selenium and copper after doing blood tests, any you avail of milk-sample testing for incalf diagnosis as opposed to vet or supplementing even