Is this legal?

Penny Tration

Hiya, quick query.

Staff in my company have been informed that from today onwards, anyone who forgets to clock out will not be paid for that day.

I don't ever forget, but can they refuse to pay us if we do forget? We don't have a typical clock in system that counts our hours, we just print a receipt, sign it and send it to head office.

Can they refuse to pay staff if they clock on, but forget to clock out?

nibtrix

Presumably if you don't clock out there is no record that you were there for your full shift? As in, you could have clocked in and then left 5 minutes later or bunked off an hour early.

I don't know anything about the legality of their statement but I don't think it's unreasonable - provided you're in a job where you're paid for the time you work (hourly) rather than a salary.

Penny Tration

nibtrix wrote: »

Presumably if you don't clock out there is no record that you were there for your full shift? As in, you could have clocked in and then left 5 minutes later or bunked off an hour early.

I don't know anything about the legality of their statement but I don't think it's unreasonable - provided you're in a job where you're paid for the time you work (hourly) rather than a salary.

That's the thing. Each staff member works alone in separate shops in different locations, so they will know whether we're there or not, because customers ring in complaining if nobody is there.

Manach

This is not legal advice but. it comes down to proof. On one hand having a dock-out notice is clear evidence that one has worked that day. On the other, there is the concept of balance of proof that there is over a 50% chance that something is so - and that a person worked at a job that day could easily be collaborated by other means: manager noting it, CCTV etc.
So key is: there is a statutory legal onus to get paid for work done; this work can be shown by other evidence besides the clock-out, thus withholding payment for that day would very likely not be legal.
However as always, check with the citizens information site for more info.

therecklessone

Manach wrote: »

However as always, check with the citizens information site for more info.

Better yet, visit your local CI office and talk to someone in person.

Penny Tration

Proof that the staff members are in work is easy enough, as hourly (timed and dated) reports are done from open til close. So they know the staff are all in work, and have proof of that.

I'll head down to CI on my day off, just thought I'd query it. I don't forget to do my clock in/outs but I know on extremely busy days, some of my colleagues do and they're worried about pay now.

kult

Illegal. I won a court case over it years ago with Lidl. Took all customers I had served that day as witnesses as back then Lidl had no cameras. I would let them do it, let them not pay you, then have a proof and take them to court. I won good cash over it and gave them a good lesson.

Mrs OBumble

Of course the other side of this is that being asked to clock in and our each day is a reasonable request. Not doing so, for whatever reason, could be seen as insubordination, which could have some consequences.

My guess is that the company will be saying this to give a pointed reminder to people who aren't clocking correctly. There's a big step from threatning to not pay vs actually doing it.

Penny Tration

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

Of course the other side of this is that being asked to clock in and our each day is a reasonable request. Not doing so, for whatever reason, could be seen as insubordination, which could have some consequences.

My guess is that the company will be saying this to give a pointed reminder to people who aren't clocking correctly. There's a big step from threatning to not pay vs actually doing it.

That's my assumption too, tbh, and I completely agree that being asked to clock in and out is entirely reasonable (which is why I have no issues doing it). I'm only querying it because others have asked me to