Vodafone rip off , a disgrace

rickjames16

I recently went on two holidays , April and May , two weddings that I saved to go on and managed to afford to go ! When I arrived out I received a text saying for 2.99 a day I could use my phone like at home subject to a 100 mob allowance. On my first two days I got a text sayin I was reaching this limit so not wanting a high bill I turned off my internet. On the other days I didn't get a text so presumed I was ok .On my second holiday I got no text either so once again presumed I was ok untill the last day when I got a text sayin I had reached a 50 euro limit ! I rang the minute I got home but was told it couldn't be investigated untill I got my bill , I had been receiving my Bills via text but then these stopped coming ! It wasn't untill i checked my bank statement I saw that 160 euro had been taken out of my account.
My bill should be 50 a month but I always go over the data and only then I realised that when my girl friend comes close to reaching her data (while in Ireland ) she get s a text warning her . Vodafone told me that I was set up for all of these messages but for some reason hadn't been getting them ! They also say that while I got the messages abroad there is no guarantee in getting them, so why send them at all unless they warn you of this ! They gave me no satisfaction at all and after numerous phone calls , emails etc they ve finally offered me a 20 euro "good will " offer ! I feel absolutly ripped off by them and am sad that I have a full year left on my contract ? Have I a point here ?

davo10

Check your contract, if it says these charges apply, you are not being ripped off, you are being charged what you agreed in the contract to be charged.

emo72

but in fairness he tried not to go over the limit. the warning texts were intermittent? thats not helpful. it is a nightmare when you are away wondering about data charges. best not to use them because there is always a catch.

dudara

It's not really a rip-off. They provided a service, told you how much it would cost and you used it.

I do personally think that data roaming needs to be fixedoverall, but ultimately we have to take responsibility for using a service.

davo10

emo72 wrote: »

but in fairness he tried not to go over the limit. the warning texts were intermittent? thats not helpful. it is a nightmare when you are away wondering about data charges. best not to use them because there is always a catch.

Yip pretty much, you get screwed but we all know this before we go. But again, it's what we agree to in our contracts. Most people spend time picking a phone and checking out the camera/storage/apps and very little time checking the charges. You can't be "ripped off" if you generate charges that you know about in advance but still generate, you agreed to those charges as extortionate as they may be.

rickjames16

But why firstly send me texts the first few days and make me think this will be protect me every day and secondly why have I never got a text in Ireland warning me about data usage when other customers get it ! Then the fact that my bills stopped coming as well to me signals a fault in their system ! As for reading fine print etc etc in contracts .. For me common sense would suggest if I got the texts warning me the first two days that this would continue

athtrasna

Ultimately you are responsible for your data use. Your phone should have the ability to restrict data to a certain limit, and you should turn off background data for all but your essential apps. It's an expensive lesson to learn but no rip off.

davo10

Read the contract you agreed to. If it says you are liable to charges while abroad, you were not ripped off, you were charged what you agreed to be charged. It's as simple as that.

bmm

Data roaming is not for the faint hearted ! Tip: Always turn-off data when abroad. Saves allot of hassle ! EU data roaming is becoming more transparent . 25 cent per mb from 1st July 2014 . http://www.askcomreg.ie/news/reduced_roaming_rates_from_1_july_2013.7.1082.LE.asp

rickjames16

So Vodafone can warn people some days that they have gone over their usage but not other days ...
Warn some people about exceeding usage limits in Ireland and not warn other people ! Even though a vodadone customer assistant told me I was set up for this and couldn't explain why I never got them and finally send no bill , email , paper or text and take 160 out of my account ! All these things are ligit ???

davo10

Whether they warned you are not, you incurred the charges as per your contract. Each user is responsible for usage and therefore the charges accumulated. Going abroad, turn off all location/backround apps, they constantly update and cost you money. Unfortunately it may be extortionate but you cannot claim to be ripped off as you likely agreed to the charges when you took out the contract. They are legit, buyer beware, know what you are agreeing to before you agree to it.

rickjames16

davo10 wrote: »

Whether they warned you are not, you incurred the charges as per your contract. Each user is responsible for usage and therefore the charges accumulated. Going abroad, turn off all location/backround apps, they constantly update and cost you money. Unfortunately it may be extortionate but you cannot claim to be ripped off as you likely agreed to the charges when you took out the contract. They are legit, buyer beware, know what you are agreeing to before you agree to it.

And why warn some days and not others , some customer s and not others ?

davo10

Are the charges what you agreed to in the contract?

rickjames16

davo10 wrote: »

Whether they warned you are not, you incurred the charges as per your contract. Each user is responsible for usage and therefore the charges accumulated. Going abroad, turn off all location/backround apps, they constantly update and cost you money. Unfortunately it may be extortionate but you cannot claim to be ripped off as you likely agreed to the charges when you took out the contract. They are legit, buyer beware, know what you are agreeing to before you agree to it.

And why warn some days and not others , some customer s and not others ?

rickjames16

rickjames16 wrote: »

And why warn some days and not others , some customer s and not others ?

Ok I suspect you ll think what a fool I am but when do you get the contract and do you get a physical copy of it ?

davo10

rickjames16 wrote: »

And why warn some days and not others , some customer s and not others ?

It doesn't matter, you signed a contract agreeing to the charges. You can ask for an itemised bill, they will all be there, if you were overcharged then you have a case but if you were charged as per your contract, you were not ripped off, you agreed to the charges.

emo72

davo10 wrote: »

It doesn't matter, you signed a contract agreeing to the charges. You can ask for an itemised bill, they will all be there, if you were overcharged then you have a case but if you were charged as per your contract, you were not ripped off, you agreed to the charges.

i have never ever seen anyone read a legal document whe they sign a contract for a phone. you rely on the person selling it to tell you all you need to be aware of. roaming charges are nasty and should be stopped.

seriously hands up anyone that reads the entire contract?

davo10

emo72 wrote: »

i have never ever seen anyone read a legal document whe they sign a contract for a phone. you rely on the person selling it to tell you all you need to be aware of. roaming charges are nasty and should be stopped.

seriously hands up anyone that reads the entire contract?

Ignorance is not a defence in the eyes of the law. I don't mean that in the derogatory sense, but in the sense of not knowing something you should. When you sign any binding agreement, you confirm that you are aware of the facts contained in that agreement and that you agree to them.

I agree, most don't read them but you are signing your signature saying you agree to the terms contained within. It's up to you whether you actually read before you sign, but if you don't, you have to take responcilbility for the implications.

In this case, if OP signed a contract agreeing to these charges, then that is it, he should have read it.

rickjames16

Common sense would lead anyone to believe when they get the texts the first two days that this is the way the next few would work ..

davo10

rickjames16 wrote: »

Common sense would lead anyone to believe when they get the texts the first two days that this is the way the next few would work ..

Contract? It's all there, common sense would lead anyone to read it before signing. I know you want to blame the phone provider for not saving you from yourself but seriously, if you agreed to the charges when purchasing the phone, that's pretty much all that matters.

emo72

what really kills me here is you have that lovely smartphone, it can do anything. now here you are in a foreign city and you have to cripple the thing by turning off the roaming. the one time when internet becomes vital to you and you cant use it because deep down you know theres something really sneaky in those ts and cs that you didnt read.

if you are with a provider and they do something thats totally legal, but you feel its unfair, well just switch providers when your contract is up.

the roaming charges were such an unbelievable rip off that the eu intervened and started to curtail their astronomical charges.

there is some discrepencies in the ops case. the warning texts only coming through some days. thats certainly not fair. may be above board but still.

davo10

emo72 wrote: »

what really kills me here is you have that lovely smartphone, it can do anything. now here you are in a foreign city and you have to cripple the thing by turning off the roaming. the one time when internet becomes vital to you and you cant use it because deep down you know theres something really sneaky in those ts and cs that you didnt read.

if you are with a provider and they do something thats totally legal, but you feel its unfair, well just switch providers when your contract is up.

the roaming charges were such an unbelievable rip off that the eu intervened and started to curtail their astronomical charges.

there is some discrepencies in the ops case. the warning texts only coming through some days. thats certainly not fair. may be above board but still.

Yip, we all get screwed on roaming charges, but we go into it with our eyes open when we sign that sheet in the shop. Doesn't make it right but it doesn't make the phone provider wrong. It's a simple case of "buyer beware", you can't be "ripped off" if you agree in advance to the charge.

rickjames16

That 2.99 deal wasn't there when I signed the contract .. So I arrive in another country get that text telling me about it ! Then 12 hours later it get a text sayin I was approaching my limit so I turned it off .. The following day the same ! Should I have brought and consulted my contract at that point Dave ?

emo72

rickjames16 wrote: »

I recently went on two holidays , April and May , two weddings that I saved to go on and managed to afford to go ! When I arrived out I received a text saying for 2.99 a day I could use my phone like at home subject to a 100 mob allowance. On my first two days I got a text sayin I was reaching this limit so not wanting a high bill I turned off my internet. On the other days I didn't get a text so presumed I was ok

what about tempting him with this offer and sending him 2 texts warning him approaching limit. but then no more warnings?? feck that. thats almost like entrapment.

rickjames, you have my sympathy here, that seems massively unfair.
but as davo will surely remind you. vodafone done nothing wrong and its your own fault. i would press the issue with them though. best of luck.

UserNo1

the whole thing sounds dodgy alright


they strung you along until the bill went high enough but not to high

afraid you have to pay

yerone

emo72 wrote: »

i have never ever seen anyone read a legal document whe they sign a contract for a phone. you rely on the person selling it to tell you all you need to be aware of. roaming charges are nasty and should be stopped.

seriously hands up anyone that reads the entire contract?

Really? Terms and conditions for individual plans are several pages long, do you think the 20 minutes a sales person has spent taking with you has covered every single one of these conditions? The terms and conditions are part of a legally binding contract and you sign to say that you have agreed to each and every one of these. If you do not understand certain points you should ask questions before signing anything to clear this up. If you straight up just don't bother to read the t's&c's that's absolutely fine but you cannot claim to not have been informed of these things when the information is readily available to you and you sign to say you agree to these. Ignorance is no excuse.

TheChizler

If you're on Android might be no harm downloading a usage-watching app for future use.

foggy_lad

They sent you warnings and this is part of the service which you signed up to and is part of the contract. they then failed to provide these texts warning of reaching data limits so they are in effect responsible for your usage above the allowed limit by not warning you as they did previously with you and do with other customers. They can't treat you differently to other customers so you can't be penalised for not getting a text that most other customers get.

Dave147

Ignore all the yes men in this thread anyway, Vodafone will never refund call charges but they have been known to refund data charges when enough pressure is put on them.

There is a very likely possibility that when you signed up for this service you weren't made aware that you have to be on their "live APN". They are claiming that you should automatically be on it, but it seems more people aren't on it than there are. If this is the case, it means you completely wasted your time signing up to their roaming package as they are just charging you for all your data regardless.

I am writing to ComReg and ASAI about how they are advertising this and am expecting a positive response, especially after another complaint was upheld.

http://www.asai.ie/complaint_view.asp?CID=1143&BID=57

rickjames16

I'll google what a live apn is , but they told me my account was set up for all these messages , they could see I wasn't getting them but couldn't explain why ?

cormie

Here's similar: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057198894

Look at post #30 for the outcome.

rickjames16

Not sure If that's similar or not .. Plus (and if I picked out the right comment ) that guy was out of contract so they used a carrot to get him again !

Fr Tod Umptious

I can't for the life of me understand why people have data turned on while on holiday anyway.
Just keep it off and if you really need it find a convenient place with WiFi.

Mantis Toboggan

Afraid there's nothing you can do about it op only bend over and take it. I was <SNIP> in similar fashion by Meteor. I will admit to turning on data for an hour when our bus broke and we were stuck on it for 9 hours. My fault I guess.

But at the end of the day I was in France, in the European union and I can't see how they let there people get <SNIP> by huge multinational phone companies. They may allow you pay the fine over a number of months but they generally prefer their money straight up.

cormie

The vodafone red roaming is brilliant, €3 for 100MB. As long as you don't go on youtube, stream music or send a lot of pictures and stuff through what's app and the likes, you're grand. If you need access to email and google maps (although best to turn it off when you've an hour or so between each next turn) and the likes, it's perfect.

Their notification set up is confusing and I had similar texts as described in that thread I linked to above about my limits.

ben.schlomo

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

I can't for the life of me understand why people have data turned on while on holiday anyway.
Just keep it off and if you really need it find a convenient place with WiFi.

Exactly, was in Spain a couple of weeks ago and used the hotel wifi and wifi in pubs etc. Baffles me that anyone would do anything else and then be surprised that its costly.

whiteandlight

Unlock your smartphone and get a local sim. Just did it in croatia, 10 days with 2gb internet only about €15. We wanted it for maps. OH on Vodafone and really 2.99 for 100mb is expensive.

Beano

foggy_lad wrote: »

They sent you warnings and this is part of the service which you signed up to and is part of the contract. they then failed to provide these texts warning of reaching data limits so they are in effect responsible for your usage above the allowed limit by not warning you as they did previously with you and do with other customers. They can't treat you differently to other customers so you can't be penalised for not getting a text that most other customers get.

Perhaps vodafone did send them but they werent received? SMS does not guarantee delivery.

cormie

whiteandlight wrote: »

Unlock your smartphone and get a local sim. Just did it in croatia, 10 days with 2gb internet only about €15. We wanted it for maps. OH on Vodafone and really 2.99 for 100mb is expensive.

It depends, I think it's great value compared to any other solutions at present. But for me it's not uncommon that I'd be driving through 5 different countries in a 24 hour period so to not have to worry about changing sims, missing calls on my number, carrying a spare phone, a sim for each country, having to top up each sim, look out for the best deal for each country and all the rest, it's definitely worth it

slimjimmc

OP, why didn't the you check what data roaming charges might cost before you went abroad? Twice! I find it also amazing you didn't even check your bill-pay balance (it's easy) after the first trip to see what you were charged for the first trip, either actions could have saved you incurring additional charges for services you used but didn't need. It's annoying, (putting it mildly) to be hit by an unexpected high bill but their prices are publically available and you are responsible for ensuring you are informed.

rickjames16

Listen good advice about getting foreign sims and I will look into that next time ! As for the the people that said it "baffled" them why I didn't hook into the hotel wifi , iv never claimed to be the brightest button but if there was hotel wifi I would have hooked into it ! As for youtube etc , I didn't go near it .... And the other point of advice I got about not needing internet ! When your stuck by a pool for days on end with your better half , bored off your tree , sky sports app, the score , balls.ie , the indo generally help keep your sanity !!
I'm not arguing bending over and paying it etc where ye are advising me ! What I'm arguing over is the inconsistency of the text messages and how I felt conned because as I keep saying they came the first two days lulling me into feeling safe to continue using the internet etc ! I also have an issue with never receiving the texts warning me about exceeding date usage in Ireland and finally not receiving my bills anymore via text or in fact at all ! If some one on this thread doesn't get that these three things prove there's a glitch in their system and led to them treating a customer very unfairly then I give up !

davo10

rickjames16 wrote: »

sky sports app, the score , balls.ie , the indo generally help keep your sanity !!
........there's a glitch in their system and led to them treating a customer very unfairly then I give up !

Ah come on, you are not talking about going over your quota because you sent a few texts, you were reading the news paper on your phone. The text you got at €50 is the same one we all get when we go above our agreed phone/data amount.

Sorry OP but when I read the line about the apps you were using and data downloading, any understanding I have for your predicament goes out the window. Every person who ever used a smart phone knows if you use the internet while abroad, you get clobbered, that's why in most cases it is used only in emergency or when in a wifi area.

rickjames16

Davo 10 , understanding ? You have left a lot of comments on this thread but I didn't see any understanding , every one of your comments just blames me for this ! I have no argument as I keep sayin about using the apps etc ! As I have consistently said my argument is the lack of texts , getting them and then not getting them etc warning me !
I keep repeating myself here but also not getting the texts in Ireland when I'm approaching my quota as well ! My argument is not that I used the data it is that their warning systems failed to work ..

dudara

The only argument you might have is if Vodafone are contractually obliged to send you warning texts and reminders.

davo10

rickjames16 wrote: »

Davo 10 , understanding ? You have left a lot of comments on this thread but I didn't see any understanding , every one of your comments just blames me for this ! I have no argument as I keep sayin about using the apps etc ! As I have consistently said my argument is the lack of texts , getting them and then not getting them etc warning me !
I keep repeating myself here but also not getting the texts in Ireland when I'm approaching my quota as well ! My argument is not that I used the data it is that their warning systems failed to work ..

Your thread title is "Vodafore rip off. A disgrace", as I and many others keep telling you, you can't be ripped off if you are charged what you agreed to pay in your contract. We all know roaming charges are a disgrace, I think I heard earlier today that they have been reduced, I'll give you that part. But when you read the paper on your phone, in a different country, using a different network and server, then you should know you are going to pay for it. Are you certain the texts were not to be sent out when you reached your normal call and text quota?, data download is a different and expensive additional charge.

Skid X

dudara wrote: »

The only argument you might have is if Vodafone are contractually obliged to send you warning texts and reminders.

But does the Comreg advice not specifically state that the provider is supposed to send a warning?

Data Usage Alert
A consumer who data roams is automatically opted into a data price cap / alert of €61.50 including VAT unless they have requested not to receive the usage alert. A consumer will be advised when they reach 80% of the data usage cap and at 100 % of the data usage cap. The consumer can then decide to continue to data roam or not. The alert is provided to ensure that consumers do not incur high data roaming charges while travelling.

Since 1 July 2012 consumers who travel outside the EU also receive this data usage alert while travelling. If the operator is unable to send the alert due to the network provider in another country the consumer should receive an SMS from the operator advising the consumer that the operator cannot apply the data usage alert in that country.

- See more at: http://www.askcomreg.ie/news/reduced_roaming_rates_from_1_july_2013.7.1082.LE.asp#sthash.tfz0Mp22.dpuf

rickjames16

"As I and many others keep telling you "

No davo 10 , this is your 10 th message telling me ! What I used the data for is not relevant , it is that their own warning system did not work ! You keep saying the same thing .. What's your reasoning to why I never get a message in Ireland so when I approach my ussage limit like others , mr Vodafone spokesman ? Or why 4 months ago , pre holiday my bill text messages stopped coming ?

DUBLIN_person

I can relate to the OP to a certain extent, The last two times I went away on VF red roaming I was charged €2.99 a day plus a €10/€12 EU data roaming add on which I didn't need (as I was on the red roaming) or want. In fairness to Vodafone, they did refund me when I rang to complain stating it was an error on their part , but the fact of the matter was, if I hadn't had noticed, I would have been overcharged.

This along with other reasons is why I am strongly considering leaving VF at the end of my contact.

Also for the people saying to use WiFi, it is easier said then done when in Rural areas, even in places like France..!

however I do think that if you plan on using data, you should research local Sims, as they usually provide competitive rates (Something I have become wise to)

WildCardDoW

Work in this area, they are legally obliged to send you a text at 80% (€48 euro) and then another at €60. However it gets complicated with bundles.

judging by their site you have to opt in (which you did?):

Vodafone Roaming

when you go outside this rate but have opted in to the offer, you are charged a certain amount (depending on roaming area) for going outside the 100MB. The offer appears to last for three months according to the website. The offer is a daily one, so for 2.99 you would have been getting 100MB per day (2.99 each day). You approached the 100MB each day which would be pretty high data usage.

If you didn't opt into these offers you are charged at a different rate.

Roaming rates outside bundle


A lot of this stuff isn't clear black and white, first of all, where were you roaming and on what networks? If you were roaming on a different network at any point other than one they have a deal with, then the bundle may not have been applying and as such you were getting charged the higher rates (so in country one you could have been on Network A which Vodafone have a deal with, but changed to Network B due to coverage, and as such started getting charged the higher rates). For Country B the 2.99 offer should have still been running as it is active for 3 months, but it doesn't look like it was activated as in this country it seems like you only got the €48 limit warning, although it's hard to tell.

You mentioned that you turned off your internet, but was this only for the days where you got the warning message? Did you turn the internet back on for holiday one on subsequent days?

It looks like on holiday one you were opted in for the RED Roaming deal, and got charged 2.99 per day, this would be for any roaming event you made, so calls and texts would also activate the charge, not just data.

Possibly wrong here!

On holiday two, it would appear that this offer wasn't active (for data anyway), so you were just charged traditional rates. If you can verify this, and verify you were on a roaming partner in country two and that you hadn't deactivated the offer you could argue that they shouldn't have been charging you out of bundle rates and only charging you for the 100MB per day.

By the way, for their offers they probably aren't obliged to send you a text to say you are going out of bundle (i.e getting charged outside of your 100MB, but they probably are set up to do that, there's no guarantee's though and it looks like you were having SMS issues before hand so it would explain why those messages didn't reach you.


Also also, if you opted in to the RED Roaming and did other activites, such as make calls and sent texts you were still getting charged 2.99 per day as you are constantly activating the offer each day, it's not just data.

Nope, I'm wrong ehre, that's what I get for posting late at night...