Why keep own replacements

Kevin the sheep

Hi just wondering why do people keep there own replacements what I mean is if a lamb is worth say€100 and you get say €60 for your cast ewe and you won't keep the ewe lamb for Notting let's say €20 for the year well that €180 to spend on a hogget and you also have more land to put a few extra ewes on so you would generate more profit again just wondering maybe I'm missing something big here if so sorry thanks

Cran

Your forgetting if you keep your own replacements the €60 for the cast ewe goes in your pocket. There are other reasons, but based on your numbers thats the easiest response I think......

Kevin the sheep

Cran wrote: »

Your forgetting if you keep your own replacements the €60 for the cast ewe goes in your pocket. There are other reasons, but based on your numbers thats the easiest response I think......

True but are you not also loosing the "€100" from the lamb and have the cost to keep could be wrong

Cran

Turn it the other way around, are you not saving 60 quid from not buying the hogget? There is a cost of replacement table I've seen somewhere at one of the sheep meetings that explains this will see if can find it....

Cran

http://www.teagasc.ie/publications/2011/1826/ReplacementPolicyManagement.pdf

rangler1

Kevin the sheep wrote: »

Hi just wondering why do people keep there own replacements what I mean is if a lamb is worth say€100 and you get say €60 for your cast ewe and you won't keep the ewe lamb for Notting let's say €20 for the year well that €180 to spend on a hogget and you also have more land to put a few extra ewes on so you would generate more profit again just wondering maybe I'm missing something big here if so sorry thanks

I think ewe lambs have to lamb at a year old to be any advantage, also if you're breeding replacements, you have control over improving your flock.
If you're breeding say 40 replacements every year, you can afford to pay good money for a 5 star ram and the extra cost will be very small per ewe coming into the flock.
If you want to keep them idle for the first year, a small flock of hoggets are useful too, cleaning off paddocks

Kevin the sheep

rangler1 wrote: »

I think ewe lambs have to lamb at a year old to be any advantage,

Do many breed ewe lambs now lot of older farmers around here wouldn't do it and would go mad when I tell them I breed mine say you could never get them big anofe at that age but always works out pritty well for me

paddysdream

Kevin the sheep wrote: »

rangler1 wrote: »

I think ewe lambs have to lamb at a year old to be any advantage,

Do many breed ewe lambs now lot of older farmers around here wouldn't do it and would go mad when I tell them I breed mine say you could never get them big anofe at that age but always works out pritty well for me

Try to keep all my own replacements here but an odd year there ain't enough suitable ewe lambs so end up buying a few hoggets.

Last year kept 80 ewe lambs and bought 50 hoggets.Bit more than normal.
It was also the first year that didn't put all my ewe lambs to the ram due to lack of grass all summer keeping the lamb's a little behind other years plus trying to keep enough grass for the mature ewe's.

Find that its better to breed ewe lambs the first year as they are much better the following year to both lamb and rear lambs than those that have never lambed.Would prefer a ewe lamb to have even a dead lamb rather than be run dry the first year.
One drawback is that growth can be checked if you wean them late or if grass is scarce during the summer.Ewe lambs rearing lambs need a bit more time to recover than mature ewes as they are usually still growing.

As regards the economics;forget the ideal scenario re farmers journal etc.
On 500 ewes with a 20% replacement rate there is no way you will sell 100 cast ewes at 60 euro each year.Never seen it here where cast ewes would cover even half the replacement cost if you decided to buy in replacements.
Then again don't like big ewes so my cast ones aint always gonna kill top weight.
More like 80 ewes ranging from 100 euro for a few useless fat things that either lost lambs early or went dry after let out to a few boners at 15 euro plus the rest at 40 to 50 euro each.Don't forget you have to replace the dead ones as well(with their 20 euro knackery charge factored in)
To me thats say 80 cast ewes at 50= 4k then keep 100 lambs at market value of 100 so its costing you about 6k per year for replacements.
To buy even improving little hoggets last year would cost about 130 or so per head.Thats about what they cost me in Tullow and to buy a nice one to put straight to the ram you would be spending upwards of 150 to 160 plus commission and diesel.

rangler1

Kevin the sheep wrote: »

rangler1 wrote: »

I think ewe lambs have to lamb at a year old to be any advantage,

Do many breed ewe lambs now lot of older farmers around here wouldn't do it and would go mad when I tell them I breed mine say you could never get them big anofe at that age but always works out pritty well for me

I would lamb 100 - 120 ewe lambs every year with no problems, and you see the ewes in my pics, they're big enough.
I started lambing them at a year because they were growing too big as mature ewes if I didn't

arctictree

rangler1 wrote: »

Kevin the sheep wrote: »

I would lamb 100 - 120 ewe lambs every year with no problems, and you see the ewes in my pics, they're big enough.
I started lambing them at a year because they were growing too big as mature ewes if I didn't

Is there a problem having big ewes? Would have thought that they would have less trouble lambing...

Kevin the sheep

Is there a problem having big ewes? Would have thought that they would have less trouble lambing...[/quote]

Would they cost more to keep up over the year ?

Cran

Kevin the sheep wrote: »

Is there a problem having big ewes? Would have thought that they would have less trouble lambing...

Would they cost more to keep up over the year ?[/QUOTE]

More to keep, and I often found bigger ewes have more lambing trouble especially if too much condition. Same other way though to small as problem as well.

rangler1

Nothing scientific, just a preference......don't like handling big ewes.

paddysdream

Cran wrote: »

Would they cost more to keep up over the year ?

More to keep, and I often found bigger ewes have more lambing trouble especially if too much condition. Same other way though to small as problem as well.[/QUOTE]

Thats true.Look at a big fat ewe and more often than not she is the one rearing the little runt of a single.

Big fat ewes are grand if running a few with cattle or cows but if you have any number then you will find that they eat way more whilst not producing any more lamb plus as Rangler said,they are a bit*h to handle etc.

Neighbour had 40 or so black ewes running with cattle on very lowly stocked but good grassland.Went through them a month or so ago to pick out cast ewes for him and they had difficulty getting through the cattle crush.Big fat lumps rearing about 1.2 lambs with the cast ewe price as good as the lambs because they kill out top weight every time.These are bought in as hoggets(usually 10 or 15 each year)and after a year or two you wouldn't recognise them.
Even the lad shearing them was complaining this year as the man with him pulling out was nearly bet turning them.

Green farmer

It's easier to overpower and hold a medium sized sheep, then a big one. At times like lambing when you have to catch a ewe with a lamb sticking out, it's no fun if the ewe ends up pulling you around the pen. I've some big Cheviots, strong texels and the odd Charlie cross. going to phase them out for belclare or llyen x ewes. Medium sized sheep with a quiet nature., well that's the theory anyway !!!