toilets in the work place

walter the second

This might sound trivial but I'm angry!...Want to do something about this, feel I've been made a plonker of and think I've genuinely done nothing wrong...

I work in an environment with about 45 men, 3 women. Most of the men are on the road, come into the office a few times a week, the women are permanent office. There's a 'Gents' and a 'Ladies' - I mean just two toilets, not a big line of cubicles inside or anything. Today the gents was busy. Pulled the handle, waited a while, still in there, so I used the ladies. Came out at the same time as the bloke in the gents, the second boss, it turns out, who saw me and said, 'You're not allowed use the ladies'. I said, 'But the gents was busy. Was waiting. Needed to go.' He said, 'Doesn't matter. You should wait. See what the girls would think of that if you told them.' I headed to my car to continue work. Really didn't feel I needed to go into detail explaining myself. Got a phone call 'cause I forgot some stuff in the office. 5 people in there, most started going nuts at me when I got back.

Female office worker 1 said, 'How dare you use our toilets!' I said 'is it not fair enough if the gents is full and the ladies empty and you need to go you use the ladies?' She said I should wait two minutes. I told her I thought she was being unreasonable - that there's like 40 men working in the place and 4 women and the toilets are disproportionate.
Female office worker 2 said, 'When you go home ask your partner if she likes seeing little sprinkles on the toilet seat.' Complete b****x. Always lift toilet seats ; was very careful to keep it tidy on this occasion as I knew I was breaking the 'rule'.
Male worker 1 said, 'If you were in a supermarket would you use the ladies instead of the gents?' I was busy counteracting Female worker 2 but if I'd had the composure or whatever to reply I'd have said yes, if I really needed to go I'd use the ladies.

Man, I wanted to get out of there as quick as possible! I left saying, 'Anyway, have a good weekend' with Female worker 1 still saying, 'Just don't use our toilets again!' Felt like I was being devoured by wolves.

Anyway I'd like to nip this whole thing in the bud in some way. Two of the people are direct relations of the boss. I know if I do nothing the incident will come up again and again and I'll probably say something inappropriate eventually and get fired or something.

Whereas if I did some formal action - write a letter to the boss (hmm, his offspring) , or even better, got a solicitor saying, 'my client feels aggrieved....in fact it is law that you must provide toilet facilities blah blah' that might put the sh*ts up them and they'll hush up about it, give 'em food for thought. I'd change jobs if it were an easy option.

Just interested in your thoughts. Worried about a bad reference when I do go looking for a new job. Don't really care about being ostracised, just want them to think twice about their attitude. Is it not a legal imperative for toilet facilities to be provided for employees in all circumstances?

tenifan

The "legal" route isn't a good option, and it sounds like the whole thing has been blown out of all proportion.

hsa.ie/ eng/Publications_and_Forms/Publications/General_Application_Regulations/gen_apps_workplace.pdf
If the *max number of men likely to be in the workplace at any one time* is over 5 (you said yourself that men are usually on the road), your employer should provide 2 toilets for men (or 1 toilet, 1 urinal). 5 or fewer, then I'm afraid they only need to provide one and you shouldn't have used the ladies'.
Worth pointing out, they could get around the requirement by scrapping the M/F designations on the toilets, as both can be locked separately. Therefore the 2 toilets would cover up to 15 people.

If you really want to cover yourself, go to the doctor and get a note saying you had a kidney infection. Discretely discuss this with your boss, saying how embarrassed you are that the second boss humiliated you in front of your colleagues. (though if he discretely pointed out you shouldn't have used the ladies', you're in the wrong again I'm afraid.. still, he shouldn't have broadcast it to the office)

davo10

Or you could just apologise sincerely, admit it was the wrong thing to do and say you will never do it again.

What's wrong with you man, you are thinking of getting a solicitor's letter to say you should be allowed use the ladies? A toilet is provided for men, most of us get a feeling we need to go pee pee long before it reaches the point where we are "bursting", Bring a potty to work in future.

The mind boggles.

MouseTail

You are over reacting big time. The women were annoyed (and rightly so imo), they called you to task over it, you apologised (I hope). End of. This will be forgotten about Monday.

Jogathon

Wow, I work in a female dominant workplace. I often pop into the male loo if the lady's one is busy. Not a big deal, I would have thought.

nibtrix

Seems like a lot of over reaction going on in that office! The second boss and the women totally over reacted - what's the big deal about him using the ladies toilets? Unless the OP made a mess in there or peed all over the place what difference does it make?!?

At the same time thinking of sending a solicitors letter is a bit ott as well. Just let it go I'd say. If it's brought up again you could say something like "I didn't realise it would be such a big deal, I now understand you have a problem with it and I won't do it again. Can we please drop the subject as I don't think it's necessary to discuss it any further".

Only if they continue banging on about it would it be worth bringing further.

timetogo

It's an overreaction. My company has about the same ratio of men to women. Our toilets are used by both. Like at home. Nobody dies.

And like at home the men manage to use the loo without destroying it,.

fatherted1969

Why have separate toilets if staff ratio is 3:45 surely that would make more sense. A lot of over reactions by female staff if you ask me

walter the second

@tenifan
Cheers for that, solicitor's letter would be a bit of an over-reaction, I know - wrote that message in the heat of the fury; wouldn't go that far.

Throughout the week there would frequently be 20+ males in the building, which has just one toilet for men, so if the matter comes up again I'll politely bring up that salient detail, which is short of the health and safety authority's regulations (there should be 3 toilets).

@davo10

Something tells me your response would be different were it a female using a man's toilet, vice versa to my situation.

Shelflife

Total overreaction by all of you, if its brought up again simply apologise and say it wont happen again. Storm in a teacup dont let any furthur comments rise you.

popolive

OP - The first rule at work is don't rock the boat.

In saying that, I have seen ladies use toilets marked ''gents'' many times in your situation to avoid long queues for themselves.

What generation are the women in your organisation from ? If this was after hours I would elaborate on their Victorian attitudes

davo10

walter the second wrote: »

@tenifan

@davo10

Something tells me your response would be different were it a female using a man's toilet, vice versa to my situation.

Two things stand out for me about this situation. Firstly, the men are not based in the office, the women are. That is their toilet and any one with common sense knows that women can get very annoyed when men use their designated facilities. Employers do not like getting an earful from female employees about men peeing in their toilets.

Second thing is you seem to have reacted in a way which was bound to antagonise your female colleagues. Instead of being contrite, you inflamed them with the "what's the big deal" attitude. No wonder they were pissed off.

The loos are market "ladies" and "gentlemen" for a reason, stop being such an arse.

Mrs OBumble

Tell your boss that the loos need to become unisex: the current arrangement is ridiculous given the numbers in the office.


Seriously OP, how much power do these women have to make your life miserable? If very little, then you can tell them that they're being ridiculously Victorian. If a lot, then you're just going to have to suck it up.

anncoates

They're being a little bit OTT but you're being pretty unreasonable. Life's too short

doolox

Piss on the office floor the next time and leave a big turd in the office floor. The toilets should be shared, given the ridiculous ratio of male to female employees.

LegacyUser

I work in a small office and the toilet is shared between men and women. It's not a problem and I can't believe those women went over the top about it.

I don't think you should apologise and maybe you should ask the boss if the toilets could be made unisex in the light of the male/female ratio. However I also work with relatives of my boss and I know what a minefield this can be, so maybe weigh up if it's worth future hassle before taking it any further. Family will always come first!

popolive

The 3 ladies don't want to give up their clean toilets to 45 extra people. Its not about them being men, that's just a convenient smokescreen. Overused toilets tend to become unpleasant places pretty quickly. They have a privilege which they don't want to give up.

No Pants

My biggest concern would be that the boss felt the need to publicise the matter. Surely this should have been handled privately?

CatFromHue

Bit mad having so few toilets.

If you take it there's equal/more toilets in a 2-3 bedroom house than there is for the 50 or so employees in your place!

LegacyUser

OP, I think you're right to be annoyed. I'm a female, with a serious bowel condition (nothing v nasty, but when I need to go, I need to go...hence posting anon). I'm working in a place where women out number men at least 4 to 1. There's one men's and one women's loo between maybe 40 staff. I always use the men's if the women's are in use. Most of us do it. The women in your office are being unreasonable.

Your boss should see that waiting in line for a loo means you're not working and they should want you in and out ASAP and back to work, not standing for ages waiting for someone else to come out.

Anyway, from experience, the men's are much cleaner- I guess cause they're used less so that's probably what their problem is.

You should say something along the lines of what the other poster said- you weren't feeling well and needed to use the toilet and that he shouldn't openly speak about it to others- that's bullying.

Jen