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Muriel O'/Mahoney
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19-06-2014 9:52pm#1Hoping some of you who love a mystery might like to help with this one!
I've gone in to this search blind as we know pretty much nothing. It's been quite upsetting for my Dad and as a result I think I'm not thinking practically enough to search properly. My late grandmother grew up in an Industrial School in Roscommon without any knowledge of her parents or where she was from. Just this week we finally received from the Department of Education, what little information that they had on her. It turns out that she was born in Dublin to a woman in Mountjoy Prison in 1924, and registered without a name or any other information.
Luckily (if that's how you want to look at it!) a quick search on Find My Past prison records, which go up to 1924, have three listings for this woman, Muriel (O')Mahoney. Even better, on each of the prison records she has listed a different 'next of kin', which I thought would make it very easy to find her on the census. Not so much! I thought maybe someone could have a look for me. I have come up with a *possible* family on the census but I'm just not sure about it. I also can't seem to locate a birth record.
The prisoner - Muriel O'Mahoney aged 23 in 1919, which would give her date of birth circa 1896.
In 1919 she names her father as 'Thos O'Mahoney - Kilkenny' and the record states that she gave birth to an infant female in the Prison Infirmary in November (which means that my Granny had a sister, which is huge!)
In 1921 she names her brother as 'John Mahoney - London'
In 1923 she names her sister as 'Kate Mahoney - Fennor(?) Urlingford, Kilkenny' (It was during this sentence of 5 years that she gave birth to my grandmother although it is not recorded on this entry)
Also, the prison records give her 'Place of Birth' as Rathdrum, on all three?? As you can see from the attached record, she also used loads of aliases, which could make her quite elusive
If anyone wants to take a stab at it, in regards to any aspect of it, I'd greatly appreciate it.0
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Coolnabacky1873 wrote: »Fennor is the name of a civil parish and townland in Tipperary, on the border with Kilkenny. In Kilkenny, Urlingford is on the other side of the border (I used Shane's site to work that out).
A browse search of the 1911 census shows three Mahoney families living in that townland.
All three are headed by a Thomas Mahoney. Two of the families have sons named John, and the other a daughter named Catherine. No Muriels anyway unfortunately.
Anyone living in Fennor townland would have done their business, received post etc. in Urlingford.
No smoking gun but could be potentially interesting.
Yes, they're the entries I spotted (after figuring out about Fennor being in Tipperary) but not enough on any of them to definitively say it could be the family. I can't seem to find any birth registration for Muriel, I wonder if she was born with another name.Just some suggestions: have you tracked down baptisms for your grandmother and the sister born in 1919? Does the National Archives have any other prison records that might help? Did industrial schools cater for babies and very small children? Was your grandmother in another institution before the industrial school?
Thanks CeannRua; your questions are just what we, the family, were asking ourselves the other night, just not sure how to tackle some of them.
I have a list of a few birth registrations for the last quarter of 1919 that could be the child. Without knowing her name, I'll have to just give them a go and hope Muriel's name is on one of them. My granny's birth registration doesn't even give her a name. Just her mother's name and that she was in Mountjoy. As for baptisms, where would a child born in the Rotunda to a prison inmate be baptised? I didn't know where to start.
I haven't approached the archives yet, but a lady in Barnados Origins services suggested it to me.
The schools didn't cater for babies and small children so I'm not sure where to go with that one. My grandmother was 6 by the time she entered the industrial school (1930) so where the hell was she until then? Particularly if Muriel was in prison? Even though they drove me mad, I think I'll have to ask the Sisters of Charity if they know where children would normally have been before the schools. Didn't find them particularly helpful over the past five years!
Another thing I thought was strange was that the court that sent her to the school was in Ballaghaderreen, Roscommon, where the school is. If Muriel gave birth in Dublin, how on earth did my grandmother's case end up in Ballaghderreen District Court? I contacted them, and the court service, but they apparently don't keep any significant records, just dates and and a name or two, like an entry in a logbook.
Thanks Mari! They are the prison records I found on Find My Past 0 -
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Your grandmother's church wedding record, if she had one, *may* have details of where/when she was baptised.
Checked already, nothing there In fact, my Granny told me that when she was getting married, she obviously didn't have any information to give the church (Westland Row) so they contacted Ballaghderreen. A priest came up to Dublin and refused to let her see the details from her own record! Her parents were just put down as 'John and Mary Mahoney'. 0 -
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Checked already, nothing there In fact, my Granny told me that when she was getting married, she obviously didn't have any information to give the church (Westland Row) so they contacted Ballaghderreen. A priest came up to Dublin and refused to let her see the details from her own record! Her parents were just put down as 'John and Mary Mahoney'.
That'd suggest there was something in Ballaghadereen's records. Church has always been very good at covering for its own failings. Be worth checking in general with the parish there (wouldn't give details just yet) to see how open they are to geneology requests. I've found everything from extremely helpful, helpful when the collection box is filled (which is a bit galling but they do have to cover costs) through to downright hostile.
Is your grandmother still alive? If she is she could make a DPA request to the parish there if nothing else comes to fruition. If she's passed I don't know if descendants have any rights in that regard, I don't believe they do though.0 -
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pinkypinky wrote: »Children born in the Rotunda were either baptised in its own chapel or in St Mary's (Pro-Cathedral). Mountjoy has a chapel called "female penitentiary" but I'm almost certain it's only CoI baptisms.
At least I can narrow down the search area!There's a Rathdrum in Tipperary a couple of miles southwest of Fethard on the L3202.
https://www.google.ie/maps/@52.4475517,-7.7325564,15z
Oh, excellent! That makes much more sense, thank you!0 -
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