marriage breakdown

fruitshot

hi my marriage is almost brokedown,,ive been married for 30 years and in 2012 my wife me a guy on facebook she went on to meet him a few times,,,i found out and have been very unfair to her and him yhat it has resulted in complete breakdown of our marriage,,,i don't have anyone to talk to about it,,,im going to start marriage councillind on Tuesday,,my wife wont come,,,

Lou.m

fruitshot wrote: »

hi my marriage is almost brokedown,,ive been married for 30 years and in 2012 my wife me a guy on facebook she went on to meet him a few times,,,i found out and have been very unfair to her and him yhat it has resulted in complete breakdown of our marriage,,,i don't have anyone to talk to about it,,,im going to start marriage councillind on Tuesday,,my wife wont come,,,

I am very sorry for your situation.

I understand why you would feel so hurt.

I am really puzzled though.How have you been unfair to her and HIM? Surely it's the other way around?

I think the fact that she is not going to counseling seems selfish.

Does she want to reconcile?

It seems like she is being very selfish OP. And you don't owe the guy anything.

Find a counselor for you ...so you can talk to someone.

HUGS OP

fruitshot

thank you so much,,,,you notice that im on this site at 5.30 am ,,,that speaks for itself,,,i found the guy through a fake profile and pretended to be a girl,,,then he told me about my wife,,all the gory stuff,,,since then it has been all fights and name calling,,,no trust,,,and blaming her for still cheating,,,i don't know if she is still cheating,,,i just don't trust her,,,

Lou.m

Have you not spoken to her?

Did she admit cheating?

Are you sure she actually did?

fruitshot

just needed to ask,,,did you find councilling helped,,,and was your wife playing the drama queen,,,as my wife is a bit over the top,,,trying to be tough,,,she is 100% denial,,,all my children know what happended and she still wont accept what she done,,,,

fruitshot

oh yes,, ieven met the guy,,,ive spoken to him and she know that he told me about the fling,,,he was telling a lot of lies,,,but also some truth,,,and I was only asking her to tell me the truth,,then it would of been a lot of work and tears,,,but she kept saying no,,,

Penny Tration

fruitshot wrote: »

oh yes,, ieven met the guy,,,ive spoken to him and she know that he told me about the fling,,,he was telling a lot of lies,,,but also some truth,,,and I was only asking her to tell me the truth,,then it would of been a lot of work and tears,,,but she kept saying no,,,

Why do your children know about it? That's something that you as a parent should be shielding them from.

With regards to the rest - you know she cheated on you. She won't admit it. She won't go to counselling with you. She won't take any responsibility.

Your marriage will not recover if she's refusing to acknowledge any wrongdoing.

I'm not saying that to be harsh, but it's true. You will bnever be able to trust her again if this isn't resolved. And this will not be resolved unless she takes responsibility for her actions.

fruitshot

the law in Ireland is so strange,,,,i have no idea how im going to survive,,,all my sayings are gone cos my wife got sick,,,and that cheating was in the middle of all the illness,,,i am going to move out maybe that is a mistake,,ive no idea,,,she has a small income,,ive no mortage,,no young kids,,,im completely lost,,,

fruitshot

yes I know that,,,my youngest daughter founf out about it first,,,she read my wifes messages and told me,,,big row and then the rest of the family got the info,,,they all are so let down,,,

fruitshot

but she is so wrong,,,and I am sure that she would rather see the marriage end than say she was wrong or admit and try move on,,,its a pity she is a lovely girl,,a great ma and a brillent wife up until 2012,,,,,then and now I don't know her,,,cant talk or cant reason with her,,,,i can only see agony and tears along the way,,,plus 4 very sad grandchildren,,,,and for them im truly sad,,,

Penny Tration

Before you leave the house or do anything, you need to talk to a solicitor specialising in family law.

fruitshot

yes im going to one next week,,,i hope that it can be done quick,,,i really don't want the house,,,but I pay everything and I would be boke,,,so I have no idea how much I have to give her and what I have to pay for,,,im really annoyed and very frightened,,,have you went through this yourself...

SpaceTime

The law is a bit ridiculous in some ways but not as bad as you'd think.
Get yourself some legal advice from a solicitor who has experience of family law for a start.

You may have to come to some mutual agreement to divide assets.
You've no debts or dependent kids so, that's kind of the 'least worst' situation.

Main thing though is you should look at legal advice asap to protect yourself against financial hardship.

While a marriage can breakdown and that's very upsetting, you should be looking for a reasonable dissolution if things are irreconcilable.

Main thing is to ensure you sign nothing without going to a solicitor.

Go see a counsellor on your own anyway too. It's very important to talk this through.

Keep lines of communication open but don't get into arguments either. There's no point in getting into big emotional disputes with someone as they'll usually not be very helpful.

Also it's really positive that you seem to have plenty of family support too.

fruitshot

thank you,,,yes im going to see a councillor on Tuesday night,,,i tried this before and my wife wont com,,,and ihave asked her to com on Tuesday,,she thinks they are noisy and looking for gossip,,,some time she can be such a twit,,,she got real sick 4 years ago,,and I spent 20,000 euro on doctors ,,etc,,etc,,,so my finances are drained,,,i really think it is menopause but I cant say that,,,she is 52,,,but thinks she is 22,,,sorry for saying that I sound like a right jerk,,,

Lou.m

fruitshot wrote: »

just needed to ask,,,did you find councilling helped,,,and was your wife playing the drama queen,,,as my wife is a bit over the top,,,trying to be tough,,,she is 100% denial,,,all my children know what happended and she still wont accept what she done,,,,

Hello Fruitshot.

I am female and I have never been married.

I agree with what the above posters have said.

Take time and get advice from a solicitor before you do anything.

If you wife is so selfish that she cannot admit she is in the wrong she sounds a little ill to be honest and not in this reality.

I am very sorry your daughter had to learn that and that you had to find out that way.

Don't play your wife's games.

You don't sound like a jerk at all.


You are actually seeming quite level headed and strong.

You invested a lot of love, time money and life into this person and the behaved terribly.

I think going to a Councillor to help you vent and talk is great. Talking to your wife sounds like talking to a wall. You need some understanding.

And you should get financial and legal advice.

I am sorry she is being so immature.

fruitshot

thank you,,,i am in bits,,,cant get my head around things,,,everything I do and say is wrong,,,even getting hit with rubbish from 28 years ago,,,

SpaceTime

Counselling is very useful for this kind of thing. Talk it through!

Also it's 2014 and I think attitudes have changed enormously in Ireland so, don't be too worried about it.

Life will definitely go on and get better too.
I know that from middle aged relatives etc who have been through it.

fruitshot

SpaceTime wrote: »

Counselling is very useful for this kind of thing. Talk it through!

Also it's 2014 and I think attitudes have changed enormously in Ireland so, don't be too worried about it.

Life will definitely go on and get better too.
I know that from middle aged relatives etc who have been through it.

yes I have been told that it is a great release,,,of tension and stress,,,i will try been as honest as I can...

fruitshot

thank you to you all for your support,,i will take all you stuff on board,,,

fruitshot

just a short message ,,,,has anyone ever gone throught the marriage councilling on there own,,as my wife is not interested,,,what and how much should I tell my councillor,,,,he is a guy,,so should I talk as if he was areal good friend,,

SpaceTime

Just talk away ! That's what his job is.
If his style isn't you cup of tea, try someone else too.

Main thing is to find someone you're comfortable talking it out with.

Don't be afraid to open up to a male counselor either. He'll be totally easy to talk to.

fruitshot

jesus I hope so,,,im really ****ting a brick,,,but I know I got to do this for mr,,,cos I am ok for a few days and then I just get this rush of anger,,,its a real problem for me,,,i really want a life with my wife,,,to be honest I don't think it will happen,,,so if the councillor is good it will be a help for me with a new girl,,,i love wemon and always have,,,im not a cheat,,but I am an honest guy,,,just hurt and let down,,,sorry im going on again,,, thanks for your post,,,,

fruitshot

hi all,,,wish me luck,,,meeting marriage councillor at 8 tonight,,,dreading every minute,,,but I got to do what ever I need to do,,,

fruitshot

got my first session of marriage councilling last night,,,somehow I think its my wife that should be there,,,councillor cant figure out why im doing the graft,,,must say I agree,,,but I will try it for myself try to clear my head and have an ear to listen to me,,even though it is probably a waste of time,,,,

Sleepless and Manic

fruitshot wrote: »

got my first session of marriage councilling last night,,,somehow I think its my wife that should be there,,,councillor cant figure out why im doing the graft,,,must say I agree,,,but I will try it for myself try to clear my head and have an ear to listen to me,,even though it is probably a waste of time,,,,

If you can use the time with the Councillor for yourself then it wont be wasted.

Dont think in terms of solving anything at this point just get them to help you with how to deal with the situation. If you know what I mean.

Sorry you have to go through this.

fruitshot

thank you,,yes I will use there expertise to my advantage,,,and I wont rule anything in or out,,,

fruitshot

not looking forward to my second visit to my marriage councillor,,,,getting a lot of bad feedback from my wife,,,blaming all on me and thinks the kids are on my side,,,she is so wrong,,,denial is a real bad place to be,,,,all I want is sorry and sit down and chat,,,life is to short,,,now she has a girlfriend tp stay with and is telling the tale of all tales,,,she is the victim,,,,sad sad girl,,,but I will do my best for me,,,,

Sleepless and Manic

Ouch.

Blaming you and thinking the kids are on your side doesnt sound constructive. Its too bad she wont do therapy, even if its on her won.

SO often people just dont understand the basics of interacting together and they go off on these tirades which just makes things worse. And are hard to get back from. People burn bridges in anger without thinking.

I'm so sorry you have to go through this. Just hang in there.

fruitshot

Sleepless and Manic wrote: »

Ouch.

Blaming you and thinking the kids are on your side doesnt sound constructive. Its too bad she wont do therapy, even if its on her won.

SO often people just dont understand the basics of interacting together and they go off on these tirades which just makes things worse. And are hard to get back from. People burn bridges in anger without thinking.

I'm so sorry you have to go through this. Just hang in there.

those are words of wisdom,,,my wife is now doing more damage than she did on day one,,,she needs to sit down and talk,,,denial is the bacis of failure,,,if she just shared and told the truth,,you can forgive and move on,, but she asks for the past to be forgotton and get back to normal,,,my answer to that is ,,if it had of been me would it be as easy to forget and be normal,,,i douth it very much,,,,

washiskin

She doesn't seem to understand that the is no normal now.... she can't take back what she has done or said and any sense of normal is going to be so different from now on.
I reckon all this lashing out at you & then asking for things to go back to normal is her way of dealing with the guilt and bringing this gf to stay is to avoid any meaningful conversation with you.


It's imperative that you also get yourself some legal advice for the sake of knowing where exactly you and your kids stand whichever way this works out. It's a really hard time for you right now but trust the process of the counselling to give you the strength for whatever lies ahead.

fruitshot

washiskin wrote: »

She doesn't seem to understand that the is no normal now.... she can't take back what she has done or said and any sense of normal is going to be so different from now on.
I reckon all this lashing out at you & then asking for things to go back to normal is her way of dealing with the guilt and bringing this gf to stay is to avoid any meaningful conversation with you.


It's imperative that you also get yourself some legal advice for the sake of knowing where exactly you and your kids stand whichever way this works out. It's a really hard time for you right now but trust the process of the counselling to give you the strength for whatever lies ahead.

thank you,,just got back from councilling,,must say I feel very down and really annoyed,,i don't like or trust this councillor,,,,i understood that I was going to be a first name and a number,,,then when I am honest maybe to honest,,,know he wants my addresss,,,that's not very annomimus.... a lot more than a name and number,,,think I will be very cautious on next visit and make my exit early and permanent,,,not happy,,,

fruitshot

washiskin wrote: »

She doesn't seem to understand that the is no normal now.... she can't take back what she has done or said and any sense of normal is going to be so different from now on.
I reckon all this lashing out at you & then asking for things to go back to normal is her way of dealing with the guilt and bringing this gf to stay is to avoid any meaningful conversation with you.


It's imperative that you also get yourself some legal advice for the sake of knowing where exactly you and your kids stand whichever way this works out. It's a really hard time for you right now but trust the process of the counselling to give you the strength for whatever lies ahead.

thank you,,yes ive an appointment with my solicitor tomorrow afternoon,,,i need to know where I stand,,,the law in Ireland is not designed for men in family law,,,my kids are all grown up,,,no mortage,,but all bills are standing orders through my wages,,,don't fancy living in a caravan,,,

fruitshot

Lou.m wrote: »

Hello Fruitshot.

I am female and I have never been married.

I agree with what the above posters have said.

Take time and get advice from a solicitor before you do anything.

If you wife is so selfish that she cannot admit she is in the wrong she sounds a little ill to be honest and not in this reality.

I am very sorry your daughter had to learn that and that you had to find out that way.

Don't play your wife's games.

You don't sound like a jerk at all.


You are actually seeming quite level headed and strong.

You invested a lot of love, time money and life into this person and the behaved terribly.

I think going to a Councillor to help you vent and talk is great. Talking to your wife sounds like talking to a wall. You need some understanding.

And you should get financial and legal advice.

I am sorry she is being so immature.

hi lou just got back from councillor,,,not happy me,,,

Sleepless and Manic

fruitshot wrote: »

thank you,,just got back from councilling,,must say I feel very down and really annoyed,,i don't like or trust this councillor,,,,i understood that I was going to be a first name and a number,,,then when I am honest maybe to honest,,,know he wants my addresss,,,that's not very annomimus.... a lot more than a name and number,,,think I will be very cautious on next visit and make my exit early and permanent,,,not happy,,,

Sorry. Its sort of like getting fillings at the dentist. Hard to feel much relief when the process is just to stop it getting any worse.

Trust is a tough one. The Councillor should be subject to the same rules of privacy as a GP though. If you even had a hint that something you told them got out they could lose their career so they should be trustworthy.

Its easy for me to say, I'm in a big city but can you go to another one?

I did it with my Ex(!) and it was an awful process. It can also be hard to open up when you have the other person that you're in conflict with right there next to you.

Sleepless and Manic

My ex-wife and I went to a Councillor for a long time. A couple of different ones actually. And my current love and I have been to one as well.

I absolutely hated it. And stopped as soon as I could. And it didnt help in saving my marriage. But it taught me some amazing lessons i've never forgotten; about listening, and understanding the situation and using the right language to avoid conflicts. A lot (most?) of the fights that happen can be down to misunderstandings that escalate after all.

I think you're doing the right thing. A lack of trust isnt good but if you can get them to give you some actual tools like how exactly to respond to someone who's in denial. That kind of thing.

...just some thoughts.

blatantrereg

Forget the marriage counselling. She deliberately cheated multiple times and would not have told you if you hadn't sussed it out. Now she only seems concerned about vindicating herself. Your relationship together is dead. Seek legal advice instead. If you think counselling will help, seek it for yourself; not marriage counselling.

Lou.m

I feel this kind of relationship is kind of beyond my frame of reference. I don't necessarily have the life experience to advise.

I would suggest talking to people your age and perhaps who have been in marriages.

It is a lot to decide to end. But then she has done a lot. I have not lived through what you have and am at a totally different point in my life.

I would imagine she is a difficult person to live with though. From what little you have written (and of course it is difficult to judge an entire character from this) she seems like the caricature of a narcissist.

Manipulative liars are like eels. They never stop and you can't have a normal conversation with them. I think they are usually attempting to make you give up and accept the abuse. But in reality they only end up proving why you shouldn't and in fact why you don't deserve it.

I think you should be fair to both of you but do what you need to do to be happy. It is tough to be fair when the other is playing dirty. But directness and self esteem is the enemy of the manipulator.

Don't let her get her way. She seems to be a very unhealthy self destructive person. Don't get drawn into that during legal discourse if it comes to that. Don't play her games. The damage she is trying to inflict is not just to get what she wants....it is nature and an expression of who she is.

It seems awful to say rise above it. But you can't out nasty some people ....they are just awful. But don't let them get their own way either.

All the negative abuse she is throwing ...even the sort of passive sly abuse ...the poor me act ....any fake concern ...fake victim act etc... it is all very transparent. People will see.

Some posters here who have more life experience than myself appear to be offering much better advice than I could. People who have been trough marriages will understand more.

fruitshot

Sleepless and Manic wrote: »

Sorry. Its sort of like getting fillings at the dentist. Hard to feel much relief when the process is just to stop it getting any worse.

Trust is a tough one. The Councillor should be subject to the same rules of privacy as a GP though. If you even had a hint that something you told them got out they could lose their career so they should be trustworthy.

Its easy for me to say, I'm in a big city but can you go to another one?

I did it with my Ex(!) and it was an awful process. It can also be hard to open up when you have the other person that you're in conflict with right there next to you.

that is the problem she is not with me,,and dosnt believe in the process,,,also she left on Saturday night and is with a girlfriend,,,spinning tales of me been dangerous and drunk and abusive,,,but she left me to care for our 5 year grandson,,,she is so out of control and in the depth of denial and guilt that she could and would say anything,,,,

fruitshot

Lou.m wrote: »

I feel this kind of relationship is kind of beyond my frame of reference. I don't necessarily have the life experience to advise.

I would suggest talking to people your age and perhaps who have been in marriages.

It is a lot to decide to end. But then she has done a lot. I have not lived through what you have and am at a totally different point in my life.

I would imagine she is a difficult person to live with though. From what little you have written (and of course it is difficult to judge an entire character from this) she seems like the caricature of a narcissist.

Manipulative liars are like eels. They never stop and you can't have a normal conversation with them. I think they are usually attempting to make you give up and accept the abuse. But in reality they only end up proving why you shouldn't and in fact why you don't deserve it.

I think you should be fair to both of you but do what you need to do to be happy. It is tough to be fair when the other is playing dirty. But directness and self esteem is the enemy of the manipulator.

Don't let her get her way. She seems to be a very unhealthy self destructive person. Don't get drawn into that during legal discourse if it comes to that. Don't play her games. The damage she is trying to inflict is not just to get what she wants....it is nature and an expression of who she is.

It seems awful to say rise above it. But you can't out nasty some people ....they are just awful. But don't let them get their own way either.

All the negative abuse she is throwing ...even the sort of passive sly abuse ...the poor me act ....any fake concern ...fake victim act etc... it is all very transparent. People will see.

Some posters here who have more life experience than myself appear to be offering much better advice than I could. People who have been trough marriages will understand more.

hi lou,,,I am so grateful for your advice,,,i have taken all on board...I love my wife a lot,,but I spoilt her done to much gave to much and expected noyhing in return,,,she is not the girl I fell in love with,,,and for the last few years I don't know her at all,,,my son and daughter don't want to here from her,,,now she is trying to say im abusive to her,,and she has to lock herself in her room,,and I am drunk all the time,,,and she feels in danger,,,but yet she left on Saturday and left me to look after our 5 year old grandson who is with us for 4 and a half years,,,so she is lying to make herself justified,,,she cheated and was caught,,, wont accept it and is in denial,,everyone else is wrong,,,believe me im no saint but im honest and love my family,,,,sorry for going on and on,,,,

fruitshot

Sleepless and Manic wrote: »

My ex-wife and I went to a Councillor for a long time. A couple of different ones actually. And my current love and I have been to one as well.

I absolutely hated it. And stopped as soon as I could. And it didnt help in saving my marriage. But it taught me some amazing lessons i've never forgotten; about listening, and understanding the situation and using the right language to avoid conflicts. A lot (most?) of the fights that happen can be down to misunderstandings that escalate after all.

I think you're doing the right thing. A lack of trust isnt good but if you can get them to give you some actual tools like how exactly to respond to someone who's in denial. That kind of thing.

...just some thoughts.

thanks at the moment my wife is been an idiot,,,she is burning bridges so fast she has no understanding of how life works,,,thinks that the court will give her the house and a big salary,,,maybe she is right,,,ive got no idea,,thats why im seeing my solicitor at 2 today,,,see what is the story,,,i will post when ive news,,,

fruitshot

had my meeting with the solicitor,,,seems I was born the wrong sex,,,my wife messes up,,,is off her head in denial,,has every one of our kids in arms,,tells lies to anyone that will lister,,leaves the family home,,,and is entitled to half of everything,,,what a weird country,,,,but what can I do,,,does anyone know can your grown children give statement to the authorities as to the status of things,,,my wife is spinning a tale and keep adding to it as she wont admit that some of the problem is hers,,,but a court will believe her,,,can my adult children give a statement as to what they have seen and that what is said is untrue,,,,i love my wife but cant sit back and loose everything and be made to be a monster,,,,

Sleepless and Manic

Oh god. Its getting complicated huh? I am so sorry for all your woes.

I could be completely wrong. I'm no expert and I'm in the usa, and I know Irish law can be hard on men.

I think the idea with separating couples is that assets get split 50/50. Imagine what would happen if it only took an accusation to deprive one side of their share? I think the idea is that the authorities dont want to get involved in a couples bickering. SO they'll look at how long you were together and just split everything down the middle, thats kind of what you agreed to at the wedding right? You shouldnt be losing everything at all? Unfortunately if there's property involved it may have to be split.

Luckily your kids are grown so there's no issues of support.

There's a "Separation and Divorce" forum here too that may offer more advice.

Hang in there.

fruitshot

Sleepless and Manic wrote: »

Oh god. Its getting complicated huh? I am so sorry for all your woes.

I could be completely wrong. I'm no expert and I'm in the usa, and I know Irish law can be hard on men.

I think the idea with separating couples is that assets get split 50/50. Imagine what would happen if it only took an accusation to deprive one side of their share? I think the idea is that the authorities dont want to get involved in a couples bickering. SO they'll look at how long you were together and just split everything down the middle, thats kind of what you agreed to at the wedding right? You shouldnt be losing everything at all? Unfortunately if there's property involved it may have to be split.

Luckily your kids are grown so there's no issues of support.

There's a "Separation and Divorce" forum here too that may offer more advice.

Hang in there.

thank you,,,yes im lucky that ive them all grown up,,,it would be easier on me if it was over,,,we are tougether a long time,,,i think my wife has an mental issue,,thats what councillor thinks,,,we have a 5 year grandson that is with us all the time and I think she got jealous,,thats a guess,,,but his ma is away down the country,,there was a problem with drugs she was in rehab,,made a lot of enemies,,,she is coming home to be here with him cos some of her enemies know my wife is gone and they would report us to the law,,,my wife I think has menapouse and is 53 going on 23,,,the guys like her she dresses sexy looks well and the attention has got her on a rool...she cheated once and maybe twice got caught and is in denial,,,same old same old,,,bury your head in the sand,,,