Horrific death of Mother and Children

mezuzaj

A priest whom I know who had worked in Iraq called me about an horrific story that happened in Norther Iraq. A man was forced to see his wife and 2 children shot. He was then told to tell the rest of the Christians in his town to leave otherwise they would meet the same fate. It seems Iraq is in chaos, with hundreds of thousands leaving their homes. It seems its the end of the small community of Christians, which are an ancient community.

I presume it will make the media sooner or later, but things are pretty bad in Iraq. The priest had spoken to his friend who is a priest in Iraq, he has decide to stay with his flock and meet his fate with them.

newmug

God bless all the people of Iraq, especially those suffering persecution at this time.

mezuzaj

Some details. http://www.sconews.co.uk/news/38005/christians-flee-iraq-violence/

However the updated news is not good. Christians are being actively targeted today. International media are not getting to report on the ground as its very unstable.

hardline islamic extremists want to create an islamic republic.

Benny_Cake

mezuzaj wrote: »

Some details. http://www.sconews.co.uk/news/38005/christians-flee-iraq-violence/

However the updated news is not good. Christians are being actively targeted today. International media are not getting to report on the ground as its very unstable.

hardline islamic extremists want to create an islamic republic.

That region of Iraq had a history of a variety of religious groups living side by side. That came to an end with the 2003 invasion and with a group like ISIS calling the shots, the future for Sunni Muslims looks grim, but for minorities like Assyrian Christians it's hard to see how there can be any future in their homeland.

mezuzaj

Benny_Cake wrote: »

That region of Iraq had a history of a variety of religious groups living side by side. That came to an end with the 2003 invasion and with a group like ISIS calling the shots, the future for Sunni Muslims looks grim, but for minorities like Assyrian Christians it's hard to see how there can be any future in their homeland.

There is not much future in the Middle east for Christians. Apart from Israel/West Bank. Jordan is ok, but things can change very quickly. Its sad.

Syria has hunted them out and Lebanon has a lot of tension.

fulmer1984

this is why i dont believe in Religion.

mezuzaj

fulmer1984 wrote: »

this is why i dont believe in Religion.

Well I can understand totally where you come from with this comment, its barbaric that anything could happen like this in the name of God. I know in the past there have been Christians who did the same in the name of God.

But the reality is Christ Killed nobody and calls us to turn the other Cheek. Not all religions call its followers to kill those who have a different faith. Even the Prophet respected jews and christians....

Sad reality of extremists. Islam does not have a unified code of belief, its each to his own interpretation. For example in Iran you are killed for being Gay, but its perfectly fine to be transexual.

eviltwin

fulmer1984 wrote: »

this is why i dont believe in Religion.

This is why I don't believe in God. I can't understand a God that allows this to happen to so many innocent people especially children when there are all sorts of scum living the life of Reilly.

wexie

mezuzaj wrote: »

Not all religions call its followers to kill those who have a different faith.

Correct me if I'm wrong but I don't think ANY religions call their followers to kill non believers do they?

It's extremist interpretations of religion that lead to this kind of madness.

the_monkey

newmug wrote: »

God bless all the people of Iraq, especially those suffering persecution at this time.

I think he's busy giving KAtie Taylor gold medals..

Zed Bank

It's particularly sad due to the fact that it's the exact same God, and at the end of the day, there are many similarities between the abrahamic religions.

mezuzaj

Zed Bank wrote: »

It's particularly sad due to the fact that it's the exact same God, and at the end of the day, there are many similarities between the abrahamic religions.

Yes it is, its harrowing. We can go back and forth here in boards.. But the sad reality is that TODAY a man saw his wife and Children slaughter in front of him.. in the name of God.

The sad problem with Middle east is that Americans and British have poked their heads in there so much that to many Muslims Christianity has been mixed with American Capitalism and its all the one now. To be a Christian in Iraq is to be a westerner, even when the Christians in Iraq where there long before Muslims arrived.

Manach

There is an element of religion in this mix, but also a lack of a what would be called a centralising state element as well, specially in the Arab world [books by B. Lewis and Glass]. So this implied lack of trust in central authority causes peoples primary loyalty to devolve to the lower & older units such as the tribes and an inherent distrust of any not related by blood (real or imagined). Hopefully the aid agencies can make some type of impact on the refugees who do make it out.

generic2012

Manach wrote: »

There is an element of religion in this mix,

An element of religion!? This is what really sickens me. People believe in God or they don't. They follow what he says or they don't. He says to kill children that disrespect their parents, people that work on the sabbath, cheating women etc. He has wiped out the world leaving only a pair of each species on the earth and wiped out multiple cities. You can twist around and spout bull about interpretation (that you can't even agree on amongst yourselves) all you want but the fact is you worship a spiteful, jealous, cruel, mass murderer. And what is absolutely despicable is that you say he is the personification of perfect goodness. Don't look down on your peers in Iraq who are doing what God tells them to do. Look what happened in Tuam. People who think believing in God is not bad need to cop on. It was all right when our strongest weapons were sticks but not any more since weaponry has obviously progressed a lot faster than some peoples intellect.

JK

periodictable

I've seen the online videos of people being killed in the Middle East in the name of religion.
How anyone can kill another person let alone cut off their heads in an exercise taking the best part of a minute is beyond comprehension.
I find it equally disturbing that the leaders of the various Muslim sects rarely condemn these killings, and frankly I really cannot see any way that this will end soon.
I read of one militant in Syria was a former Christian pastor, who now leads his terrorist group in killing people in the name of Islam. Perhaps that speaks volumes about the perpetrators-acting in the name of any God or higher being is a cover for their psychopathic tendencies, and the only way to stop them is to kill them. They have forfeited any claim to due process.

Pocoyo

I feel terrible for that country the average citizen of bagdad are more similar to us than the english,Most of them are not religious they drink respect women the way we do,have same sense of humor as us and the same outlook on life,Its absolutely amazing how similar iraqi's and the irish are. They would give the clothes off their back i cant speak highly enough of them.

mezuzaj

Pocoyo wrote: »

I feel terrible for that country the average citizen of bagdad are more similar to us than the english,Most of them are not religious they drink respect women the way we do,have same sense of humor as us and the same outlook on life,Its absolutely amazing how similar iraqi's and the irish are. They would give the clothes off their back i cant speak highly enough of them.

Yes, it was an amazing country in the 90's.

Borderfox

A bit of background on ISIS and it's leader

Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi (aka Abu Dua), the lead player of Isis/IsiL, was little known before 2010 when he became leader of al-Qa’ida in Iraq after the death of the previous leadership group in an attack by a combined force of United States and Iraqi forces. It is believed that his real name is Awwad Ibrahim Ali al-Badri al-Samarrai and that he is a Sunni, and was born in Samarra in 1971. He has a University of Baghdad degrees in Islamic Studies, including history, poetry and genealogy. He was an American prisoner in Bocca Camp, in southern Iraq, from 2005 – 09, probably as a result of activities as a militant preacher, with his own militia in Diyala province, in support of Saddam Hussein Abd al-Majid al-Tikriti, President of Iraq 16 July 1979 – 9 April 2003.

The destruction of the leadership of al-Qa’ida in Iraq, in 2010, marked a nadir in the organisation. The take-over of the leadership by Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi was accompanied by increasingly detailed organisation which even included the publication of ‘annual reports’ of its activities in each Iraqi province. Nonetheless, Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi remained a shadowy figure with few knowing where he was located or, even, what he looked like. It is reported by prisoners of al-Qa’ida in Iraq, that he would wear a mask in order to maintain his anonymity.

The outbreak of the conflict in Syria allowed al-Baghdadi to expand his area of operations and undertake a series of carefully planned and brutal operations against both the Syrian Army and, remarkably, other jihardist fighters. The success of his campaigns may reflect on the composition of his leadership group, and advisers, who are believed to include senior figures from the previous Iraqi military (disbanded on 23 May 2003 by Coalition Provisional Authority Order Number 2 issued by US Administrator of Iraq Paul Bremer) and Ba’ath Party (Arab Socialist Ba’ath Party meaning ‘renaissance’ or ‘resurrection’) members.


Al-Baghdadi directed experienced fighters from Iraq to Syria, to establish Jabhat al-Nusra as his initial al-Qa’ida franchise but separated from this in 2013. As previously posted Isis/IsiL tactics are exceptionally brutal and the areas of Syria under their control are subject to Sharia law with torture, public executions (including be-headings) and the indoctrination of children and adolescents.

Benny_Cake

generic2012 wrote: »

An element of religion!? This is what really sickens me. People believe in God or they don't. They follow what he says or they don't. He says to kill children that disrespect their parents, people that work on the sabbath, cheating women etc. He has wiped out the world leaving only a pair of each species on the earth and wiped out multiple cities. You can twist around and spout bull about interpretation (that you can't even agree on amongst yourselves) all you want but the fact is you worship a spiteful, jealous, cruel, mass murderer. And what is absolutely despicable is that you say he is the personification of perfect goodness. Don't look down on your peers in Iraq who are doing what God tells them to do. Look what happened in Tuam. People who think believing in God is not bad need to cop on. It was all right when our strongest weapons were sticks but not any more since weaponry has obviously progressed a lot faster than some peoples intellect.

JK

Mod: Take this elsewhere - the atheism/of existence of God thread, for example. The purpose of this thread is not to provide a soapbox to proclaim the perceived evil of religious belief, it's to discuss the current situation in Iraq.

Edit: I've tidied up this thread. There is one place in the Christianity forum for debating the existence of God and that's the atheism megathread. Alternatively there is the A&A forum. If anyone has an issue feel free to drop me a PM.

indy_man

The message below was posted in the last day on the Facebook page of Province of St. Joseph, Dominican Friars. Please pray. It appears that Fr. Najeeb may have been martyred.
——————–
Fr. Legge wrote this morning: Here’s my quick translation of the email message sent early this morning by Fr. Najeeb.
Bad news. I write you in a situation of violence in Mosul that is very critical and even apocalyptic. Most of the inhabitants of the city have already abandoned their houses and fled into the villages and are sleeping in the open without anything to eat or drink. Many thousands of armed men from the Islamic Groups of Da’ash have attacked the city of Mosul for the last two days. They have assassinated adults and children. The bodies have been left in the streets and in the houses by the hundreds, without pity. The regular forces and the army have also fled the city, along with the governor. In the mosques, they cry “Allah Akbar, long live the Islamic State.” Qaraqosh is overflowing with refugees of all kinds, without food or lodging. The check points and the Kurdish forces are blocking innumerable refugees from entering Kurdistan. What we are living and what we have seen over the last two days is horrible and catastrophic. The priory of Mar Behnam and other churches fell into the hands of the rebels this morning. . . . and now they have come here and entered Qaraqosh five minutes ago, and we are now surrounded and threatened with death . . . . pray for us. I’m sorry that I can’t continue . . . They are not far from our convent . . . .
Don’t reply. . . .
Fr. Najeeb Michaeel o.p
“Fr. Najeeb is an Iraqi Dominican who lived with me in Fribourg last year. He works on some unique manuscripts that the Dominicans have in their priories in Iraq. He is a very kind, generous, exemplary Dominican.”

Here is video of Fr. Najeeb praying the Our Father and Hail Mary in Aramaic.

mezuzaj

I got more details of the Deaths. The Man was stopped with is family while they were trying to leave Mosul. They were asked to leave their car. Once it became clear they were not Muslim, the 3 children had their throats cut, then their Mother.

They then told the Father to let Christians know that they would face the same end.

mezuzaj

http://www.thejournal.ie/iraq-captured-soliders-images-1519093-Jun2014/

Some pictures from ISIS.

Brown Bomber

Benny_Cake wrote: »

That region of Iraq had a history of a variety of religious groups living side by side. That came to an end with the 2003 invasion and with a group like ISIS calling the shots, the future for Sunni Muslims looks grim, but for minorities like Assyrian Christians it's hard to see how there can be any future in their homeland.

Just for clarity: Sunni = Sunnah = Tradition. The "tradition" of the Prophet Muhammed who invited Christians to pray with him.

These Salafist Tafkirs who are allied with the "liberal", Western democracies in Syria and Libya serve the "traditions" or more accurately the agenda of the House of Saud and it's petro-monarchy Wahabbi allies.

From a member of the Saudi Royal Family:

“This regime in Saudi Arabia does not stand by God’s rules or even (country’s) established rules and its policies, decisions, and actions are totally based on personal will of its leaders.”

“All that is said in Saudi Arabia about respecting law and religion rules are factitious so that they can lie and pretend that the regime obeys Islamic rules.”
- See more at: http://en.alalam.ir/news/1499049#sthash.h1nQ4q32.dpuf

Their crimes were for so long hidden by pro-regime-change propagandists in the so-called free press as they were portrayed as Freedom Fighters and not the Gulf/Western backed mercenary jihadis they actually were

All of whom are virtual protectorates of the U.S.

Brown Bomber

fulmer1984 wrote: »

this is why i dont believe in Religion.

... I take it then you don't "believe in" states either?

mezuzaj

Brown Bomber wrote: »

Just for clarity: Sunni = Sunnah = Tradition. The "tradition" of the Prophet Muhammed who invited Christians to pray with him.

These Salafist Tafkirs who are allied with the "liberal", Western democracies in Syria and Libya serve the "traditions" or more accurately the agenda of the House of Saud and it's petro-monarchy Wahabbi allies.

From a member of the Saudi Royal Family:

Their crimes were for so long hidden by pro-regime-change propagandists in the so-called free press as they were portrayed as Freedom Fighters and not the Gulf/Western backed mercenary jihadis they actually were

All of whom are virtual protectorates of the U.S.

I have to say I am ignorant to the whole sunni/shia conflict. I think Iraq as a country should never has existed that than Sunni/Shia should have had 2 different states. I don't know if they can live side by side, (unless you have a dictator).

For Christians its the end in Iraq. simply no way to continue. They are actively targeted.

Brown Bomber

mezuzaj wrote: »

I have to say I am ignorant to the whole sunni/shia conflict. I think Iraq as a country should never has existed that than Sunni/Shia should have had 2 different states. I don't know if they can live side by side, (unless you have a dictator).

For Christians its the end in Iraq. simply no way to continue. They are actively targeted.

Yes, the situation is truly grave. It's very sad.

One of my friends - an Iraqi Christian - had his brother-in-law murdered in front of his sister (the murdered man's wife) in a sectarian killing due to the fact he was a member of some obscure John the Baptist Christian sect native to Iraq (that someone here may know more about). His own family had earlier been given 24 hours notice to leave their home as it was now the property of "Al Qaeda".

Iraq/Mesopotamia is an ancient and proud civilisation. Prior to the illegal US invasion Christians lived in peace, even if they were suffering through the economic sanctions and the whims of a dictator and to the Muslim population it was irrelevant whether someone was a Sunni or a Shia. They intermarried, their children went to the same schools and so on.

The invasion changed all this.

Specifically the establishment by the US military of the "Wolf Brigade". A US-led Shia death squad which targetted Sunnis. The consequences of this are obvious.

Revealed: Pentagon's link to Iraqi torture centres

Exclusive: General David Petraeus and 'dirty wars' veteran behind commando units implicated in detainee abuse
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/mar/06/pentagon-iraqi-torture-centres-link

Petraeus and the Wolf Brigade: Torture Built into US War Strategy

US Military Still Runs With Dreaded Wolf Brigade

http://www.antiwar.com/orig/porter.php?articleid=8335

History didn't begin yesterday.