Climbing tips for the Ogreish

rollingscone

So it has become clear that the greatest of my many cycling weaknesses is climbing. I've been doing some research on it have drawn the following conclusions:

1. Do more miles (Work in Progress - although I've been terrible at getting out for more frequent shorter spins since my regular commutes have dropped off the schedule, tending instead to do one big spin a week which is obviously not the way to progress).

2. Do hill repeats - trying to do this a couple of times a week but the nearest hill I can find is Cruagh Road and it's far enough away that on days like today when I'm squeezing cycling in between work commitments I don't always get time to knacker myself on it. Howth is even harder to get to when time is tight, is there anywhere else nearer the City Centre (D8/2) that's not too hectic where i could get all of my suffering vitamins and minerals maybe over a shorter distance?

3. Lose weight - I'm at a point where it genuinely might be easier to lose weight off the bike than myself*, I'm in reasonable trim but someone recently described me as being like a very pale Samoan.

4. Technique, I've been spinning in my lowest gear sitting back with my fingers resting on the flats and this has helped a lot in terms of getting up climbs without having to stop but is horrendously slow. Today I tried getting out of the saddle a few times on the Cruagh climb but aside from clearly needing to build my stamina at this I also found the sudden unwelcome return of knee pain so that needs some thinking (I'm hoping that road pedals will help with that).

I pushed a bit harder going through Edmonstown today and got my speed up to 15kph but once it got up the real climb before the first bridge I could only get up to this pace in my brief stints out of the saddle.

In addition, the received wisdom seems to be to get out of the saddle and power over the top in order to get ahead on the descent but I'm constantly struggling along at a snails pace, probably a symptom of insufficient miles in the saddle.

*Bike currently weighs in at 10kg with AKSIUMs, I might shave off a few more grams with my CF Seatpost and eventually with CF Forks bt it's not exactly a lump as it is. My being 95kg is obviously the real issue.

Answers on a cake shaped postcard.

cython

In terms of a hill closer to D8, I'm not sure how long of a hill you're looking for, but there's always Knockmaroon hill just on the far side of Chapelizod, running around the outside of the park. More of a short sharp climb compared to the others, but not sure you need too long of a hill if you're just going to do repeats. I've never cycled up it myself, mainly because I wouldn't be confident of not pissing off drivers unnecessarily at rush hour, but average gradient on strava looks to be about 10%.

Also, if you are out that far you could try some of the other hills up from the Strawberry Beds, but Knockmaroon would be the closest to town if you're under time pressure to get to/from it.

maloner

I'm in D8 as well and better than knockmaroon hill IMO (which is busy with traffic and kinda narrow) are the various roads that head away from the river along the strawberry beds.

Some are less busy than others but I find them good hills for hill sprints (close to enough to full effort after a good warm up).

Somerton:
http://www.strava.com/segments/706315

Rugged Lane:
http://www.strava.com/segments/3096241?filter=overall

Westmanstown:
http://www.strava.com/segments/793928?filter=overall

Barnhill:
http://www.strava.com/segments/911711?filter=overall


Depending on how tight for time you are, a few reps up and down sommerton with one more past the Anglers rest if traffic allows would be something. Not very long but if done hard they would have their benefits as part of a "balanced diet"

Chips Lovell

Climbing is essentially about power to weight. You want to get as strong as you can to propel the lowest amount of weight up a hill.

I'd focus on both parts of the equation. Don't worry about the weight of your bike until you can see your ribs.

I live in Dublin 8 too and would use Cruagh Road and other spots in the Dublin mountains for hill intervals. The hills around the Strawberry beds are very short, more like 1 minute efforts. It's good for the explosive stuff, but less so for long sustained efforts.

Best session for building sustained climbing speed would be 3 x 15 minute intervals up hill, building it up to 3 x 20 minutes. So go up Cruagh and turn around once you hit 15 minutes, go back down and do it again. In terms of effort, you're talking about around 90 per cent.

I've had some success from strength endurance/SFR type intervals too, i.e. low cadence, big ring intervals on hills. Some people swear by them, others think they're tripe.

Oscar Gateaux

Oscar Gateaux wrote: »

Climbing is essentially about power to weight. You want to get as strong as you can to propel the lowest amount of weight up a hill.

I'd focus on both parts of the equation. Don't worry about the weight of your bike until you can see your ribs.

I live in Dublin 8 too and would use Cruagh Road and other spots in the Dublin mountains for hill intervals. The hills around the Strawberry beds are very short, more like 1 minute efforts. It's good for the explosive stuff, but less so for long sustained efforts.

Best session for building sustained climbing speed would be 3 x 15 minute intervals up hill, building it up to 3 x 20 minutes. So go up Cruagh and turn around once you hit 15 minutes, go back down and do it again. In terms of effort, you're talking about around 90 per cent.

I've had some success from strength endurance/SFR type intervals too, i.e. low cadence, big ring intervals on hills. Some people swear by them, others think they're tripe.

How much rest/downhill should you allow for those intervals?

Chips Lovell

I'd descend back to the starting point and start again. That's probably quite long in terms of recovery. A lot of training plans only stipulate four to five minutes.

rollingscone

@Oscar Kurtains

You might not believe it from having seen me but I'm pretty near ribs showing as it is, I do have some permanent fat deposits that aren't going anywhere in the absence of surgical intervention but in addition to cycling I train four days a week with kettlebells and body resistance and run at least 18km p/w also (other commitments, no danger of me connecting it with cycling and swimming in some sort of horrific display of perversity).

TBH I've avoided descending on Cruagh since nearly crashing there last year, but it probably is time to slay that particular dragon.

As for intervals uphill in the big ring, I'm pretty sure that would finish off my knees for good so I'll have to do without that.

@Cython, Knockmaroon hill is far too busy and tight for anything other than getting past Knockmaroon hill IMHO.

quozl

As an alternative idea, would you consider concentrating on something more suited to your build like time trialling or sprinting?

I'm a bit too broad to ever be a really good climber but it does have a certain hard to resist allure to it, doesn't it?

rollingscone

quozl wrote: »

As an alternative idea, would you consider concentrating on something more suited to your build like time trialling or sprinting?

I'm a bit too broad to ever be a really good climber but it does have a certain hard to resist allure to it, doesn't it?

The allure is called 'Wicklow' I haven't even joined a club yet. Never mind thought about TTs and Crits.

hf4z6sqo7vjngi

Buy lots of carbon stuff.

rollingscone

Billy Dirty Rebel wrote: »

Buy lots of carbon stuff.

Carbon bottle cages. The answer to all of lifes problems.

Carpenter

I am hoping to get better on the hills as well so I bought a carbon bell

Ole Rodrigo

Dura Ace chain. Every climbers secret weapon.

rollingscone

Carpenter wrote: »

I am hoping to get better on the hills as well so I bought a carbon bell

I heard that Carbon bells are more about ride quality than weight saving.

XtotheZ

ive said this a million times before, ride the biggest gear you can up climbs in training. Go as slow as you want speed dosn't matter just grind the bejaysus out of it. Youve probably heard grind is bad but this is in training. Im 85kg and in racing can climb well under my weight (but just cant make acclerations, think of Cadel Evens as opposed to Contador) and basically I completly give it to doing this effort, on 4k low-moderatly steep gradient, whenever im out training.

Just be sure when you are in an event to spin and as your a big guy like me, staying in the saddle uses less oxegen

Paddigol

rollingscone wrote: »

The allure is called 'Wicklow' I haven't even joined a club yet. Never mind thought about TTs and Crits.

God bless Wicklow. And my new training friend... Red Lane.

seamus

Yeah, I'm afraid it's a power to weight thing and you can either be a great climber or big and muscular, but not both. Every extra kilo on your body is another kilo you need to haul over the hills.

This is why you generally find with professionals that they're either climbers, TTers or all-rounders. On the flat, the extra weight that TTers carry has a negligible effect in getting up to speed, so they can maintain bigger watts (and therefore greater speed) over the length of the course. On the hills the climbers get more bang for their buck and can climb faster on less watts, giving them more stamina over the whole stage.

For example, an 85kg rider to climb 100m @ 12km/h in ten minutes is 162watts.
A 65kg rider to do the same costs them 126watts or about 25% less.

If the 65kg rider put in the same effort as the 85kg rider, he'll do the same climb in 7.5 minutes.

So you can see how even if you're an exceptionally fit 85kg rider, an equally (or even slighty less) fit 65kg rider will absolutely kick your ass over hilly courses.

Satisfy yourself with not being an utterly crap climber, and learn to accept that you will never appear in the top ten of a Strava hill segment. It's all you can do, while you eat your cake.

rollingscone

Again I'm not racing, more concerned with being able to keep up with friends and eventually clubs on spins

Sammo13

I'm 82kg and should be less, as I reach for biscuit :rolleyes:.
I started doing hill repeats up the long hill to Roundwood this winter -
started with 3 x 4m, then to the top, 4 x 4m and then 4 x 5mins. Felt it made a huge difference.
I've started doing intervals as part of commute to work. 30 second hard with a min recovery 6 or 7 on way to work. I think any sort of interval training will benefit your endurance and will help your climbing.

3 x 15m session sound savage and is something I should work towards.

Daroxtar

I'm a sh!t climber, 5'8" and 75kg and legs like a stork but I intend on heading up from stocking lane to Kippure over the weekend on my 15kg hybrid so if you want to feel good about yourself I'll let you know what time I'll be heading up and you can fly past me like Pantani ( just make sure to call me an ambulance if I'm lying in a heap somewhere along the way)

Carpenter

XtotheZ wrote: »

ive said this a million times before, ride the biggest gear you can up climbs in training. Go as slow as you want speed dosn't matter just grind the bejaysus out of it. Youve probably heard grind is bad but this is in training. Im 85kg and in racing can climb well under my weight (but just cant make acclerations, think of Cadel Evens as opposed to Contador) and basically I completly give it to doing this effort, on 4k low-moderatly steep gradient, whenever im out training.

Just be sure when you are in an event to spin and as your a big guy like me, staying in the saddle uses less oxegen

I did this last weekend going to the top of Kippure in the big ring was hard but I made it so next year I will do it again .

nordicb

Rowing machine may help building up leg strength required for climbs, and is easier on knees...