Starting a Pro Team

lolpaddywacks

Looking for over 18's who are interested in joining a full time professional team based in Ireland. This would require living in a house with team mates, living by the rules of the house, and playing League of Legends for circa 10-12 hours per day - both team and solo.
If you are interested PM or comment.

SeantheMan

Not that I'm interested....but where is the house ?
Who has to pay the rent ?
Do the players have to pay for rent/food ?
Do they get salaries ?
What league do they have to be....I'd assume Challenger or Diamond 1 at least ?

Troll post ?

cherryghost

How is it a troll post? I know of some players who are doing this in Dublin now.

SeantheMan

cherryghost wrote: »

How is it a troll post? I know of some players who are doing this in Dublin now.

It was a question, first post on boards and complete lack of any information provided.

TheDoc

SeantheMan wrote: »

It was a question, first post on boards and complete lack of any information provided.

To be honest I'm sure that is stuff to be discussed between two parties, and not to be posted out for the general public?

If you've no interest, don't be worrying about it.

I'd be more concerned why these setups, keep just making random posts around various forums. This isn't lol related, but just all games in general.

If you want to start a pro team that does well, put the work in and go scouting. Go to the LANs on display, get involved in the community and get scouting.

This craic of dangling a carrot of a pro team and waiting for people to flood to you never works in my experience. You need to go find the people that are right for your team and what you want to achieve.

If anything the post should somewhat contain some criteria, eg. Diamond soloq min requirement etc

SeantheMan

TheDoc wrote: »

To be honest I'm sure that is stuff to be discussed between two parties, and not to be posted out for the general public?

If you've no interest, don't be worrying about it.

I'd be more concerned why these setups, keep just making random posts around various forums. This isn't lol related, but just all games in general.

If you want to start a pro team that does well, put the work in and go scouting. Go to the LANs on display, get involved in the community and get scouting.

This craic of dangling a carrot of a pro team and waiting for people to flood to you never works in my experience. You need to go find the people that are right for your team and what you want to achieve.

If anything the post should somewhat contain some criteria, eg. Diamond soloq min requirement etc

That was one of my questions also

TheDoc

Hopefully your man gets back if things go ahead. A team is going nowhere if it doesnt have a fanbase, and I'm sure the Irish scene will get behind any team trying to make the grade.

Have to say 11-12 hours playtime is a bit mad. Quality over quantity. Don't see much quality practice in 12 hours, sounds mental Although I'd say if its a proper team and house setup, there is probably 6-7 hours soloq streaming time in there for the fanbase.

Which needs to be created, so make sure to come back and tell us when your up and running!

Dreddybajs

TheDoc wrote: »

To be honest I'm sure that is stuff to be discussed between two parties, and not to be posted out for the general public?

If you've no interest, don't be worrying about it.

It's very easy for young players to get scammed or put into situations where they're being exploited with offers like these, obviously that's caveat emptor but I don't think it's unreasonable to post up your credentials when looking to start something like this.

KarmaBaby

Just one point on this.

I think the team should meet up regularly, but you don't need to force the team members to live together. Its not necessary and can be counter-productive to creating a positive team environment. If the team members are committing to the schedule, then it doesn't matter a sh1t where they live.

TheDoc

KarmaBaby wrote: »

Just one point on this.

I think the team should meet up regularly, but you don't need to force the team members to live together. Its not necessary and can be counter-productive to creating a positive team environment. If the team members are committing to the schedule, then it doesn't matter a sh1t where they live.

There are some pretty massive benefits to living together as part of a team, maybe not so much even the living together, but having the team meet up in person for practice session would always trump online exclusivity.

Despite the obvious raport building of being physically together as a group, critique can be a lot more constructive and progressive when in person, then online where it can be more aggressive and destructive.

I'd recall our teams Arcadecon prep for last summer. While we frequently practiced online, and as friends spent most of our time online together, there was a noticably different tone when we met in person ( for me meeting the team members for the first time) discussion in terms of game strat was more mature, constructive and the feedback and points for tactics was immediate. Our captain was also able to run through first hand his thoughts from replays, which could be ambigous doing it online.

He was physically pointing at something and we could all see it straight away.

It's also become the norm standard for most teams and proffesional level entities. For right or for wrong, debating that aside, if you want to be the best, or compete with the best you need to ensure your operating of a platform equal to your peers, which in the case of LoL, would be living together in a gaming house.

IRL_Sinister

Positive talk, I like it. Unfortunately, though, a first poster with no follow-up is probably going nowhere. Good luck thought to anyone who does want to follow this.

Pro gaming is very difficult but it has changed a lot in the last few years. I'd imagine it's a lot more manageable now with all the teams/houses/LANs etc. With the summer now approaching it really is a good opportunity for people to just rent out some vacant student accommodation and give it a go for 3 months and see how you get on.

EDIT: It's also really unhealthy so be ready to factor that into your lifestyle.

KarmaBaby

TheDoc wrote: »

There are some pretty massive benefits to living together as part of a team, maybe not so much even the living together, but having the team meet up in person for practice session would always trump online exclusivity.

Despite the obvious raport building of being physically together as a group, critique can be a lot more constructive and progressive when in person, then online where it can be more aggressive and destructive.

I'd recall our teams Arcadecon prep for last summer. While we frequently practiced online, and as friends spent most of our time online together, there was a noticably different tone when we met in person ( for me meeting the team members for the first time) discussion in terms of game strat was more mature, constructive and the feedback and points for tactics was immediate. Our captain was also able to run through first hand his thoughts from replays, which could be ambigous doing it online.

He was physically pointing at something and we could all see it straight away.

It's also become the norm standard for most teams and proffesional level entities. For right or for wrong, debating that aside, if you want to be the best, or compete with the best you need to ensure your operating of a platform equal to your peers, which in the case of LoL, would be living together in a gaming house.

Well I have some experience in living in a similar environment and I'm not convinced it is the best solution. Yes, this is very common in the gaming world, but pro MOBA gaming is also rife with team infighting, break-ups and roster changes.

Its not actually the norm for the entire team to live together by the way. You would usually have 3 of the team living together (those that are friendliest with each other) and maybe two others living elsewhere but spending time in the house also, whenever they can.

A lot of that is down to problems with the team dynamic and personality clashes. You cant predict what will happen if you throw 5 young guys into a house together in a high pressure environment. It more likely to blow up in our face and be damaging for for people's health, than it is to work out in the long run.

Strategies and discussions can be conducted over skype. You can all watch replays together online at the same time.

KarmaBaby

IRL_Sinister wrote: »

EDIT: It's also really unhealthy so be ready to factor that into your lifestyle.

If the team is manged properly then it shouldn't be. Personal/Recreational time including health and fitness should be part of any professional team's schedule. Otherwise players will just burn out and become demotivated.

BMMachine

I have a friend who has had this offer before, he decided to stay in college. the house operated for ~5 weeks and then everyone had to go home because the whole thing was a poorly organised clusterf**k. Always find out the sources and always look at the bigger picture. also - if you want to join one of these style of teams then I recommend getting on IRC and doing the research

lolpaddywacks

Thanks all for the inputs. This is not a troll post. I am curious to the level of interest in having a pro team. I figure if other countries, specifically Copenhagen Wolves, can do this then why not Ireland. I am short on specific details but simple maths. One five bed house in Carlow town centre rents for €800 per month, or €160 per person. Add broadband, light and heat and this should remain under €220 per person. The unemployed assistance is €379 per month, approx. So, in my view, the incremental earning from solo streaming required to be self sustaining is not huge.
If this was ever to happen I would see the a role as team manager/coordinator/parent in charge etc. This could never be described as a money making exercise, unless the team became a runaway success.
In terms of playing standard I really do believe anyone can get good at LoL if they have good mechanics. Decision making and team strategy is something which can be learnt and evolve.
For me it would be impossible to quit your job and rock up to a house and expect the same income, unless you're an established streamer. Even if someone had huge audiences on day 1 it would be 10 weeks before they'd get a cheque from twitch.tv.

All journeys start with the first step. If you think this is something you could be half interested in email me to: **REMOVED**
obviously exclude the spaces I had to put in to allow this to be posted.
Thanks all.

TheDoc

Aw jaysus

Sorry am all for supporting the notions and was defending it above, but thats shocking.

Your basing the maths of social welfare income and social welfare rent assistance? I think the taxpayer might have a problem funding your gaming house....

So this isn't a pro team, with any sort of sponsor or backer, you essentially want to get five lads who would be willing to live life of the social welfare, and you assume putting a certain amount of hours into a game is going to make you good enough to be pro level?

Have to raise serious questions over what your attempting here. I also notice you say "parent", what age are you exactly yourself, being the main organiser of this?

You've got some serious flaws in the setup there, you might aswell rename this thread to " looking for five lads to scrounge of the social and play lol all day".

lolpaddywacks

Wow. Do you really think there is some massive telco or tech company willing to plow money into a gaming team in Ireland? You can't be serious...
Any gaming team is going to be young, most likely an average age under 22. This means they are probably not going to be able to form a group to rent a house. The question is basically: would you be willing to have a go a being part of a pro gaming team. Anyone can be a pro starcraft player in their parents attic/basement but this isn't the case with Lol, it requires a team environment.
My point about unemployment assistance was to demonstrate there is a baseline. What is the difference, to the taxpayer, between renting a house and playing games versus sitting in your parents home and playing games? I think you're point is slightly redundant.
Also it's not my 'gaming house'. It would be the gamers house.
Thanks for your feedback anyway. It provides an opportunity to address some concerns others may be thinking.

KarmaBaby

lolpaddywacks wrote: »

Thanks all for the inputs. This is not a troll post. I am curious to the level of interest in having a pro team. I figure if other countries, specifically Copenhagen Wolves, can do this then why not Ireland. I am short on specific details but simple maths. One five bed house in Carlow town centre rents for €800 per month, or €160 per person. Add broadband, light and heat and this should remain under €220 per person. The unemployed assistance is €379 per month, approx. So, in my view, the incremental earning from solo streaming required to be self sustaining is not huge.
If this was ever to happen I would see the a role as team manager/coordinator/parent in charge etc. This could never be described as a money making exercise, unless the team became a runaway success.
In terms of playing standard I really do believe anyone can get good at LoL if they have good mechanics. Decision making and team strategy is something which can be learnt and evolve.
For me it would be impossible to quit your job and rock up to a house and expect the same income, unless you're an established streamer. Even if someone had huge audiences on day 1 it would be 10 weeks before they'd get a cheque from twitch.tv.

All journeys start with the first step. If you think this is something you could be half interested in email me to: lolpaddywacks @ gmail.com
obviously exclude the spaces I had to put in to allow this to be posted.
Thanks all.

What is the €379 a month unemployment assistance figure that you're referring to?

For unemployed people under 25, I think the dole is somewhere between €100 and €160 a week.

lolpaddywacks

I did a quick look at welfare.ie. The reduced value is €87.50 per week. This is multiplied by 52 and divided by 12. Maybe I'm underestimating. I ignored rent allowance from the baseline. Complicated and, my understanding, often not obtainable.

Playboy

How about you spend some time looking for work or educating yourself? If you don't have a sponsor or cant afford to fund yourself then don't do it, it's benefit fraud as you are not actively seeking employment.

KarmaBaby

lolpaddywacks wrote: »

I did a quick look at welfare.ie. The reduced value is €87.50 per week. This is multiplied by 52 and divided by 12. Maybe I'm underestimating. I ignored rent allowance from the baseline. Complicated and, my understanding, often not obtainable.

I think it depends on age. There is a difference between under 21s and over 21s and if living independently or not. Moving out of home and having to apply to a different Social Welfare office also raises questions about their reason for moving and the possibility of having their dole cut off. "I'm moving to Carlow to look for work", probably isn't going to cut it down the dole office. If the players start making money from the venture you also run the risk of making them non-tax compliant/fraudulently claiming social welfare at a time when the government are really clamping down on that kind of thing.

In any case, let me be absolutely blunt. I think anyone interested in this would be absolutely mad to take you up on your "offer". If there is a group of decent Irish LoL players, then they can get organized and do this themselves. Outside of a very vague plan you haven't been forthcoming as to what your own experience is or credentials as a gaming manager are. That to me screams "NO" because I can't think of any logical reason why you wouldn't tout your credentials in order to sell this idea to potential players.

I think, if there is the potential for a pro Irish MOBA team, it most likely already exists in its early stages, albeit a bunch of friends playing semi-competitively. If they have successes they will logically move to consider forming a more serious team and they can do that alone and much more cost effectively than in the environment you're suggesting. When they're more settled, they can consider getting a manager and taking things to the next level.

What you're asking is for players to make a huge commitment, and take considerable financial and personal risks, while you appear to be burdened with no real risks at all. That is not what good managers do.

And a business model based on social welfare income is complete and utter horse manure.

Dreddybajs

The way to get sponsored is to form a team, play, and eventually get noticed. You don't need to form a team house and cheat the dole to do it and that sounds like a way worse idea for a hundred different reasons.

KarmaBaby

Dreddybajs wrote: »

The way to get sponsored is to form a team, play, and eventually get noticed. You don't need to form a team house and cheat the dole to do it and that sounds like a way worse idea for a hundred different reasons.

exactly

cherryghost

I'm closing this.

It's gone from a viable thread into complete ludicrousness. You are trying to CHEAT the system. Do yourself a favour. Get a job. Play in the evening with some friends. Get into some amateur leagues. Get noticed.

Then maybe you can evaluate your life again instead of the mockery of the Irish Welfare system you have laid before us. It's ideas like this that brings the system down and punishes people that are on welfare for a genuine reason.