Walkway between Browneshill Wood & Sandhills

bytheglass

So, there (used to be) a walkway between Browneshill Wood and Sandhills estates. The type that only allows one person through at a time and you swing the gate back so you can walk around it.
Yesterday I've noticed a big metal temporary construction-type fence boarding it up, making it impossible to cross from one area to the next. It looks like it was placed there by professionals, (builders, council?)
I'm a resident of Browneshill and did not receive any notification that this would happen. I used the walkway regularly to walk to SuperValu etc...
Apparently some teenagers hung around there (maybe a group of 4 or 5) and I believe this irritated some Sandhills residents but I could be wrong. There was never any graffiti and I never had any altercations when using it as they were rarely there.
I don't think it should be boarded up as I believed it to be a good thing as we have a bigger green area and more young people were using it to play sports encouraging better community spirit.

Would it be 'illegal' if I took down the fence?
It is an area which is open to the public, who has the right to board it up anyway?
How can I complain about this?
Does anyone else from the area agree with me?
And if not, can you share your opinion why you think the walkway should remain boarded up please?

Oh and we don't have a residents committee yet so I wouldn't know where/who to start discussing this with.

Owryan

Maybe contact some of the councillors on facebook and ask them was it the council who blocked it?

scallionhead2

You didn't buy a house in the back of sandhills - pay a premium to have it in a cul de sac and then have the builder decide to SNEAKILY open a walkway between his two estates effectively making it one big estate!

Are you talking about people in your estate playing on the green in Sandhills??! They have no right to treat another estate's green as their own!

YOU bought/ are renting on the Browneshill road - you are near LIdl and you knew you had no access to Supervalu - it is not a right you have now.

The Sandhills residents have got the council to board it up as it is illegal and there has been antisocial problems and needles found at the gate. Also people bought into a small estate not a super estate - McLoughlin seems to be a law unto himself!

bytheglass

Fair point, the walkway was not on the original plans for the estate as far as I can remember. But I thought it was a positive thing. Now there seems to be a 'us' and 'them', ill-feeling brewing.

Why would McLoughlin 'sneakily' build the walkway though? It isn't in his best interests.

I am talking about Sandhills residents playing on the green in Browneshill Wood and not vice-versa. The Browneshill Green is bigger and more suitable for field games and I for one have no problem with kids from any estate using it.

I was not aware of needles found at the gate and find it hard to believe TBH, the kids I met there regularly seemed polite to me, even standing back to let me walk through. I walked there regularly and they were there rarely.

Sandhills was never a small estate and Browneshill Wood when finished will not be small either, however I don't think a walkway (with gate) constitutes a 'super estate'!

I also don't think blocking the walkway will curb anti-social behaviour and needle usage, people will just go somewhere else. A fence is not going to solve that problem.

johann johannson

Apologies for reviving an old thread.

I'm a resident of Browneshill wood. I've used that walkway while it was available.

I have never had any problems with any groups at that walkway.
Any kids that were there, would often move to allow people through.

As for the opinion of someone buying a house in a quiet cul de sac and spending money to have such a luxety, maybe a house out the country would have provided such solidarity.

I doubt anyone is above the law themselves that they could block service to local amenities for an entire estate , and stating that lidl is close enough to do so, is a childish remark.

I for one will be looking to the council to have this reopened.

ForstalDave

I to used this a good bit and never had issues with anyone at the gateway nor did i ever see any needles on the ground, Its a well lit area with houses close on both sides so strike me as a bad place to do that sort of thing. In regards to blocking off the gate all it has done is make things more dangerous. Kids from both estates play together and now it means a fairly long walk around or jumping over the wall. Il support any plan to reopen this walk way

bytheglass

johann johannson wrote: »

I for one will be looking to the council to have this reopened.

ForstalDave wrote: »

I'Il support any plan to reopen this walk way

I'll also support any plan to reopen it, Johann have you written to the council yet? Do you need any help with it? I'm not experienced in matters like this, And wonder should we get a petition going?

Feel free to PM me

johann johannson

I havent written to anyone yet.

A petition would be a good start i reckon.

Ill have a talk with a council official and see what action would be best. Otherwise, we may all invest in step ladders!

byhookorbycrook

Re the petition, you'd be better served contacting people to lobby directly.

jocksey

Has anything ever been done about this? It doesnt really bother me as I still hop the wall as I did before the gap was even put in but I'm getting on on years now and reckon I only have 10 or so more hopping years left in these knees.

As for the anti social people I agree we need a way to keep the sandhill ruffians out. Maybe some sort of swipe card just for the brownesers to get in and out while restricted access for them.

I can understand their bitterness buying houses similar to ours at twice the price will never leave a good taste in anyone's mouth

sunny2004

jocksey wrote: »

As for the anti social people I agree we need a way to keep the sandhill ruffians out. Maybe some sort of swipe card just for the brownesers to get in and out while restricted access for them.

that comment truly made my day haha

jocksey

I see this issue has reopend again this evening. Ruffians from the sandhills arena knocking on doors to get signatures for a petition. A petition to the council no less to have the walkway reopened.

Browneshill residents should not support this. The fact we had it blocked up in the first place to keep the little sandhill spawn off of our green spaces should be enough.

Unless we can have a key card system to keep them out I say build a wall. They are the Mexicans of carlow

Cw85

Are you actually kidding? It's the total opposite. It's the people from the brownshill wood direction who keep jumping that wall and coming into Sandhills. All the litter and empty beer cans at the gate are all on the brownshill side too. While walking I've seen people lifting prams and buggies, bikes etc over the wall and let me say these people are not the most approachable to put it lightly. I'v even felt a little concerned for my own safety with groups of young lads that do be hopping the wall.

bytheglass

The walkway was blocked in error, and it is planned to reopen in the New Year

https://www.carlowlive.ie/news/home/503477/big-read-council-to-draw-up-plan-to-re-open-access-between-two-estates-in-carlow.html?fbclid=IwAR2tErUs6jHlbf64OC7-5J7t8rsJ05tpGHSEX5-EWty_sGBrhuU0Fwe_ncE

Nokia6230i

bytheglass wrote: »

The walkway was blocked in error, and it is planned to reopen in the New Year

https://www.carlowlive.ie/news/home/503477/big-read-council-to-draw-up-plan-to-re-open-access-between-two-estates-in-carlow.html?fbclid=IwAR2tErUs6jHlbf64OC7-5J7t8rsJ05tpGHSEX5-EWty_sGBrhuU0Fwe_ncE

Won't someone think of the.......price of the houses.....!

Fiatx19

It's only a matter of time before someone breaks an arm or a leg climbing over the ridiculous barrier the council put up. The council will be 100% at fault because they had no right to block the gap in the first place.

The barrier only serves to stop parents and children from using the walkway to reach the shops and to visit friends. The teenagers just jump over the wall/barrier as they always have done.

In my view if the gap was opened there would be far less chance of anti social behaviour because nobody would want to hang around a busy gap.

Isthisthingon?

https://carlow-nationalist.ie/2020/06/19/controversial-pedestrian-access-will-be-reopened/#.XvCM0GhKi70

Walkway to be reopened according to council

Cw85

Isthisthingon? wrote: »

https://carlow-nationalist.ie/2020/06/19/controversial-pedestrian-access-will-be-reopened/#.XvCM0GhKi70

Walkway to be reopened according to council

Very bad decision, can see it closed up again in the future

iwillhtfu

Cw85 wrote: »

Very bad decision, can see it closed up again in the future

What's the issue up there? Trouble coming in from sandhills or Browneshill or just outside gurriers hanging around

Ishmael

iwillhtfu wrote: »

What's the issue up there? Trouble coming in from sandhills or Browneshill or just outside gurriers hanging around

Mainly gurriers coming in from outside and acting the bollox around the sandhills estate. There were issues with drugs AFAIK. There is also a elderly man who lives beside or near the gateway who was being harassed by those who were loitering around there. Don't know if they were coming from the browneshill estate or further afield

It's not just the browneshill estate. It will draw in all those along the Brownsehill road who want to use it as a shortcut to the shopping area at the entrance to Sandhills. Another housing estate is just being finished along the browneshill road and there is another on the way so there will be significantly more than just browneshill residents using it.

iwillhtfu

Ishmael wrote: »

Mainly gurriers coming in from outside and acting the bollox around the sandhills estate. There were issues with drugs AFAIK. There is also a elderly man who lives beside or near the gateway who was being harassed by those who were loitering around there. Don't know if they were coming from the browneshill estate or further afield

It's not just the browneshill estate. It will draw in all those along the Brownsehill road who want to use it as a shortcut to the shopping area at the entrance to Sandhills. Another housing estate is just being finished along the browneshill road and there is another on the way so there will be significantly more than just browneshill residents using it.

Ah right I see thanks for that. I almost bought in Sandhills when they went on sale years ago lovely houses but always thought a local shopping centre can be both good and bad.

SligoBrewer

Cw85 wrote: »

Very bad decision, can see it closed up again in the future

It allows people from Browneshill access to what is a pretty important shopping centre on foot or by bike and also allows kids to walk safely to school.

It also allows people from Sandhills quiet access the other direction.

Blocking up a public amenity that is so important it was a condition of planning because of kids who have long since grown up is just silly.

SligoBrewer

Ishmael wrote: »

It's not just the browneshill estate. It will draw in all those along the Brownsehill road who want to use it as a shortcut to the shopping area at the entrance to Sandhills. Another housing estate is just being finished along the browneshill road and there is another on the way so there will be significantly more than just browneshill residents using it.

This is why it should be open.

Do we close roads because drug dealers use them?

Ishmael

SligoBrewer wrote: »

It allows people from Browneshill access to what is a pretty important shopping centre on foot or by bike and also allows kids to walk safely to school.

It also allows people from Sandhills quiet access the other direction.

Blocking up a public amenity that is so important it was a condition of planning because of kids who have long since grown up is just silly.

SligoBrewer wrote: »

This is why it should be open.

Do we close roads because drug dealers use them?

Hey, If the antisocial issues don't come back, happy days, no problem. There a lots of young kids / teenagers in Sandhills and if it kicks off again, I can't see the parents tolerating it for long. I have no particular personal issue with it being open or closed. I was just pointing out that there would be considerably more footfall through the estate than just people from the Browneshill wood estate. That will inherently lead to more nuisance issues like littering and dog fouling and potentially worse but maybe not.

It has been long enough that the troublemakers have probably moved on at this stage.

SligoBrewer

Ishmael wrote: »

Hey, If the antisocial issues don't come back, happy days, no problem. There a lots of young kids / teenagers in Sandhills and if it kicks off again, I can't see the parents tolerating it for long. I have no particular personal issue with it being open or closed. I was just pointing out that there would be considerably more footfall through the estate than just people from the Browneshill wood estate. That will inherently lead to more nuisance issues like littering and dog fouling and potentially worse but maybe not.

It has been long enough that the troublemakers have probably moved on at this stage.

Ah yes, make people get in their cars to get some bread because there is litter on the ground.

Cw85

SligoBrewer wrote: »

Ah yes, make people get in their cars to get some bread because there is litter on the ground.

You don't live in Sandhills obviously so you're not really in a position to give an opinion. It's very intimidating even to go for a walk up where the walkway is without groups of lads making comments at you and placing you in fear. These groups have also caused criminal damage to properties in the estate for which the guards have been notified. It is a lovely quiet estate most of the time but when these people come in to cause trouble it effects peoples livelihoods and therefore allowing them access is not for the common good. Of course I have no issue with people with good intentions passing through to use the shopping centre but at the end of the day they can't argue that it must be open as it wasn't open when these people would have bought houses in that area.

Ishmael

SligoBrewer wrote: »

Ah yes, make people get in their cars to get some bread because there is litter on the ground.

I am saying that it probably should be re-opened now as it has been long enough that the troublemakers from before may have moved on. If it leads to antisocial problems, then it should be closed again. I doubt anyone in Sandhills cares if people are or aren't walking / cycling through to get to the shopping area and back again. It's the intimidation of residents by groups of gurriers and the associated antisocial behaviour that people don't want. It's worth a try to re-open it though under the caveat that if **** starts up again, it will be closed again.

SligoBrewer

Cw85 wrote: »

You don't live in Sandhills obviously so you're not really in a position to give an opinion. It's very intimidating even to go for a walk up where the walkway is without groups of lads making comments at you and placing you in fear. These groups have also caused criminal damage to properties in the estate for which the guards have been notified. It is a lovely quiet estate most of the time but when these people come in to cause trouble it effects peoples livelihoods and therefore allowing them access is not for the common good. Of course I have no issue with people with good intentions passing through to use the shopping centre but at the end of the day they can't argue that it must be open as it wasn't open when these people would have bought houses in that area.

I used to live in the estate for many years. I had kids hanging on outside my bedroom window at all hours of the night being really bloody loud, and this is when the gate it was boarded up.

But it's an estate in town? These things are going to happen.

Looking down at people from other estates isn't on, isn't nice or isn't fair. Neither is calling kids gurriers on the internet, they are someone's family member and are still growing up.

It's just a gate and if you want to reduce anti-social behaviour take away the kissing gate altogether and replace it with a bollard. As people in the thread pointed out, we had a condition of planning that the council decided to board up, but yet we still had people jumping the wall. The only people you're stopping using the gate are people who are getting their shopping who can't jump the wall.

iwillhtfu

Mod note . Keep it civil please .

Cw85

SligoBrewer wrote: »

I used to live in the estate for many years. I had kids hanging on outside my bedroom window at all hours of the night being really bloody loud, and this is when the gate it was boarded up.

But it's an estate in town? These things are going to happen.

Looking down at people from other estates isn't on, isn't nice or isn't fair. Neither is calling kids gurriers on the internet, they are someone's family member and are still growing up.

It's just a gate and if you want to reduce anti-social behaviour take away the kissing gate altogether and replace it with a bollard. As people in the thread pointed out, we had a condition of planning that the council decided to board up, but yet we still had people jumping the wall. The only people you're stopping using the gate are people who are getting their shopping who can't jump the wall.

From my experience I have never hear kids out very late at night so I cannot comment on that. This isn't looking down on people, it's stating facts that certain people not from the area are causing trouble which is not fair on the residents. It's a very tricky situation as nobody would want stop any civilized person using the walkway to pass through. I don't know how to put a stop to the people causing trouble though we cannot expect he Gardai to be patrolling the area constantly either.

Fiatx19

There is no way to stop teenagers jumping the wall and hanging around there, short of putting a Donald Trump style 50 foot Mexican Wall in. Those who argue that the gap should be closed are only stopping decent residents from using what is a valuable and safe shortcut to the shops and schools. I haven't seen any antisocial behaviour in either estate in the past few years. There's currently 187 houses in Browneshill Wood /Rise with planning for 61 more. I think that the residents using that gap would deter antisocial behaviour. Closing it up again will make it a dead end for tennagers to hang around. I hope that those who oppose the gap can see that in the long run it's a beneficial amenity for everyone in the community.

iwillhtfu

iwillhtfu wrote: »

Mod note . Keep it civil please .

That was the civil version

iwillhtfu

Those short cuts or walkways always draw undesirables, pretty much everyone I know of and surprisingly a good few spring to mind, they're all the same.

As pointed out though it's only the few that are acting up. I wonder could there be an atguement for cctv being installed.

Agent Coulson

Yes back lanes and short cuts through estates always draw the wrong kind for many things from fly tipping to drug dealing and use.

SligoBrewer

We're literally talking about a gap in 4 foot wall here. It's pathetic.

byhookorbycrook

Re-opening thread.