How comes DAB Radio is still not available Nationwide?

Andy From Sligo

Hi - i live in county Sligo 12 miles from Sligo Town and I got myself a nice shiny new DAB clock radio. love the radio, it has RDS FM on it too and displays the station name on FM and what show it is on the display. However (and this is the stupid thing) there is not way of setting the clock part manually on the radio - it only gets its time from a DAB signal only and sets the clock time on it! - so just to confirm it wont set the time from an FM RDS signal (like previous DAB/FM radio's I have had before) and there is no way in the radio menu of manually setting the time for the clock, its just not possible on this make/model of DAB/FM Clock Radio the only way it can set the clock is from a DAB signal only! and we have absolutely no way of getting a DAB signal where we live. So why is DAB STILL not available these days its 2014 for goodness sakes? - it should be available nationwide we live in the digital age now not the 90's still!! - will it ever be available nationwide and if not what is the hold up does someone know why? - and who can I send my complaint to about not being able to receive DAB where we live, I mean i pay the same amount of TV Licence as someone in Dublin or Limerick or wherever there is DAB available so shouldn't I be entitled to the service too? - other than that does someone know where I would have to travel to from Sligo, to pick up DAB signal and set the clock on this radio would someone know? -s there other parts of Ireland apart from Dublin/limerick/cork etc that can pick up DAB even if its a weak signal? - its portable/runs on AA batteries too as well as mains so I can take it in car somewhere. Many thanks for any info.

L1011

Money.

Kensington

See here: http://www.digitalradio.ie/can-i-get-dab/

Trick of the Tail

Largely because the BAI haven't done anything about DAB.

They're dragging their feet because existing FM stations have told the BAI that they don't want any competition from stations on DAB, nor do they want to have to spend out on migrating to it.

However, DAB should not be seen as a replacement for FM, it should be seen as a separate band for smaller, lower cost model, more specialist and diverse stations. Existing stations should NOT move to DAB.

The BAI should licence multiplex operators now, but make costs nominal so the costs to the stations can be reasonable.

Dan Jaman

Having heard the total mess that DAB has become in the UK, I can't say I miss not having it here.
Yet another system that had a lot of promise that's been ruined by eejits /greed / profit.

Trick of the Tail

Yea, let's hope though that we learn from the UK's mistakes.

They marketed it initially as a better quality medium, and a replacement for FM. Its not necessarily the former, and should not be the latter. There's nothing wrong with FM except there's not enough of it.

Some of us in the industry are working together (despite being from what might usually be called opposing sides) to try to ensure this.

However, the UK isn't THAT much of a mess. Lots of stations, many not on FM; Coverage actually better than is often said. I was in the North recently, drove from the north-west to the south-east listening to BBC R2 the whole time - nice quality, very few drop outs.

SaveOurLyric

Trick of the Tail wrote: »

However, DAB should not be seen as a replacement for FM

I thought that was exactly what it should be seen as. So that FM's inefficient hogging of bandwidth can be resolved.

Trick of the Tail

Nope, that's the biggest mistake. People will not want to buy new radios just to hear the same stations, when they can hear them just fine now.

FM isn't that inefficient anyway, it only takes up 20MHz, which ain't much use for anything.

People will, however, be more inclined to buy new radios if they want to hear stations they can't hear now, for example playing country music, rock, nostalgia, 'beautiful music', etc.

bbability

I know lots of people using smart phones using aux in port on car radios to listen to radio these days using different radio apps. I used it myself yesterday to listen to RTE Gold. Handy out.

I fully agree with the post above. Specialist stations such as community radio and hospital radio shouldbbe moved without delay to digital only broadcasting. Makes a lot of sense... Ahh that's the problem!

Andy From Sligo

I get Sh1t reception on FM most of the time on a load of stations - so 'shooshy' that I have to turn them from stereo to 'mono' to cut the interference out - that would be another plus for DAB for me.

Andy From Sligo

I mean the whole country has got to be full of main transmitters and relay transmitters and must be capable of Digital services these days so must be easy peasy taking a DAB signal from the main Dublin transmitter and relaying it all the way from main transmitters and relay transmitters to me in Sligo shouldnt it be? - and would that really be expensive if its to do with money? - and if its not about money but the ones on FM throwing their toys out of the pram saying they will lose FM radio listeners Tough! - I dont care, if your station is good people will still tune in! - if its not, dont stop other people from receiving DAB because of it!!

Andy From Sligo

bbability wrote: »

I know lots of people using smart phones using aux in port on car radios to listen to radio these days using different radio apps. I used it myself yesterday to listen to RTE Gold. Handy out.

id love to be able to do that but I havent got a 3G plan on my mobile and you havent got wi-fi broadband in the car. If they had the whole of Ireland covered with a DAB signal you can even purchase DAB car radio's these days - but pointless as it is because they would only work as you approach Dublin and other large towns in the East of ireland.

Stavro Mueller

I reckon internet radio will replace dab. Perhaps not for the moment because internet coverage in this country can still be patchy and data caps are still an issue for some people. I'm not sure how many dab stations would realistically ever broadcast in Ireland. The country's too small and the audience for the niche stations some have mentioned wouldn't be there.

L1011

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

I mean the whole country has got to be full of main transmitters and relay transmitters and must be capable of Digital services these days so must be easy peasy taking a DAB signal from the main Dublin transmitter and relaying it all the way from main transmitters and relay transmitters to me in Sligo shouldnt it be? - and would that really be expensive if its to do with money? - and if its not about money but the ones on FM throwing their toys out of the pram saying they will lose FM radio listeners Tough! - I dont care, if your station is good people will still tune in! - if its not, dont stop other people from receiving DAB because of it!!

DAB can't be relay fed, it needs to be precisely time synced so needs fibre - not satellite or it'll be hugely delayed compared to FM.

Transmitters are not that cheap as they are not that commonly used.

Temaz

cymbaline wrote: »

I reckon internet radio will replace dab. and the audience for the niche stations some have mentioned wouldn't be there.

Yep. I bought a wifi radio and can pick and choose stuff from around the world but I tend to stick with XFM for music and BBC radio 4.

Hissing Sideban

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

I mean the whole country has got to be full of main transmitters and relay transmitters and must be capable of Digital services these days so must be easy peasy taking a DAB signal from the main Dublin transmitter and relaying it all the way from main transmitters and relay transmitters to me in Sligo shouldnt it be? - and would that really be expensive if its to do with money? - and if its not about money but the ones on FM throwing their toys out of the pram saying they will lose FM radio listeners Tough! - I dont care, if your station is good people will still tune in! - if its not, dont stop other people from receiving DAB because of it!!

'Relaying the signal' as you put it can be straightforward if you are RTE / 2RN (the spun-off transmission side of RTE) as they have a good digital data connection between all their main sites.
If you are a private operater it could be a major and expensive proposition, buying the equipment, (€6,000 per hop,licencing it (€2000 per year per hop)and paying rent to site owners, typically €2000 per year per dish). Dublin to SLigo would probably involve at least three separate point to point 'hops'.
Similarly for the transmitter, buying one is by no means the end of the expense. The transmitter could range in price from about €5,000 up to €30,000 or so. Aerials, including the rigging and feeder the same again. Add in site rental, anywhere from €2,000 per year for a small fill in site to €20,000 per year for a high site and space for high powered aerial array.

Hissing Sideban

cymbaline wrote: »

I reckon internet radio will replace dab. Perhaps not for the moment because internet coverage in this country can still be patchy and data caps are still an issue for some people. I'm not sure how many dab stations would realistically ever broadcast in Ireland. The country's too small and the audience for the niche stations some have mentioned wouldn't be there.

I dont think so, for two reasons.
1 - As mentioned above, coverage is not by any means perfect everywhere for 4 G (even 3G).
2 - If a cell site gets too many users, it prioritises voice calls over data.
3 - The cost of delivery is too high per listener. Most radio stations that are successfull will have tens or hundreds of thousands of listeners at peak times, the cellular service couldn't cope with that many simultaneous users of one particular stream without major upgrading of it's facilities, and who is going to pay for that?
At the moment it works reasonably well as only a small percentage (probably less than 1%) of a station's listeners are doing so on line, and a smaller percentage of tehm listening via 3/4G mobile service

Andy From Sligo

Hissing Sideban wrote: »

'Relaying the signal' as you put it can be straightforward if you are RTE / 2RN (the spun-off transmission side of RTE) as they have a good digital data connection between all their main sites....

well then RTE / 2RN should be made to supply the DAB signal nationwide themselves then and include the money from the TV licence - I pay TV licence and i believe DAB radio services should be inclued in the Irish TV licence range of services and Nationwide, not just pockets of areas in Ireland. And if it was the case and they did but all they had on the DAB service was just RTE Radio stations only then so be it. At least its better to get something on my DAB radio (even if it is only RTE Radio stations) than nothing at all which is the case at the moment... and then also it will set my time on my new DAB radio

decies

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

well then RTE / 2RN should be made to supply the DAB signal nationwide themselves then and include the money from the TV licence - I pay TV licence and i believe DAB radio services should be inclued in the Irish TV licence range of services and Nationwide, not just pockets of areas in Ireland. And if it was the case and they did but all they had on the DAB service was just RTE Radio stations only then so be it. At least its better to get something on my DAB radio (even if it is only RTE Radio stations) than nothing at all which is the case at the moment... and then also it will set my time on my new DAB radio

Yeah I got dab added to my car radio, here in Waterford total broadcast are doing a test broadcast of dab . When I get it I like the all 80,s but it's very patchy comes and goes . Dab seems to be gone for days now . I mean total have being trailing dab for years now !! I do the whole tune in 3G /4g I phone in car as well but that keeps comeing and going as you move around . It is a bit of farce dab either scrap it altogether or add stations and make it nationwide .